Spoilers Russell T. Davies Returns to Doctor Who as New Showrunner

[TRON JA307020]

It's okay to decide that something just isn't making you happy any more and move on.

The much better original series are still excellent. Do you agree or disagree? If we just move on they'll continue destroying the franchise. Just like star trek. The good news is less and less peoole are watching the newer badly written crap that they'll most likely make changes sooner or later once they change show runners.

 

[Turtletrekker]

When did we elect you the Grand Speaker for Doctor Who Fandom? I missed that somehow.

All of this is about what you don't like, and the fact that people like me are arguing with you is proof that, whether or not you're wrong on this issue, you are definitely wrong to claim to speak on behalf of all fans.

See also: Star Trek fandom, where his arguments run along similar lines.

 

[jaime]

I would rather see Lungbarrow as a story even if it has to be animated due to the actors' ages now than going down the Timeless Child path.

The good news is that I recently found an epub version of Lungbarrow, where they took the serialized online version, which is a revision of the original published text, and converted it to epub. It's on my TBR for this year. However, the author says to read Cat's Cradle books first. I'm missing one, so I plan to pick it up. But since that seems like it's pulling from Vonnegut, I'm going to start off with his book first.

Only the first Cats Cradle book is relevant tbh. By the same author.

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

You're a new producer who's taken over Doctor Who. Your goal is to try to grow the audience.

Do you:

• focus on telling new stories that are accessible to people who haven't been hardcore fans, while not alienating the existing fan base

or

• wallow in continuity details?

Do you want to make the 1996 TV movie or do you want to make "Rose"?

So, you do agree then, that Chris Chibnall, the "new producer who's taken over Doctor Who" when Moffat left (and ended thus the last remnant of the RTD era standing) had a "goal" to "try and grow the audience" by NOT focusing "on telling new stories that are accessible to people who haven't been hardcore fans, while not alienating the existing fan base" but instead produced the Timeless Chidren overarching arc, which basically "wallow(ed) in continuity details" of the Doctor's origin, in an effort to "bring mystery back to the Doctor's whereabouts" but instead make that said origin an elaborate mystery that, in the end, did not achieve much beyond divide the fanbase for no apparent reason.

Nevermind, also, the fact that the Doctor in that very, very first episode was a mystery to everyone, but to himself. Making the character himself wonder about who he is but not actively seek it out is all kinds "I haven't REALLY gone far with my fanwank, I just obsessed over The Brain of Morbius as a teen!"

 

[jaime]

The idea that you shouldn’t depend on a shows continuity in order to make it ‘accessible’ to new viewers is an oft trotted out falacy, often by writers.

Eastenders just had an episode with flashbacks to the nineties in a roundabout fashion. Every Soap Opera just keeps going and going, and now and then trots out a reference to its past characters for anniversaries or to boost viewing figures with a returning face.

Some shows depend on novelty. Some on history.
Doctor Who is the latter.
(See also: how much ‘legends’ stuff Disney ended up working back into Star Wars simply because that just sells more.)

 

[jaime]

So, you do agree then, that Chris Chibnall, the "new producer who's taken over Doctor Who" when Moffat left (and ended thus the last remnant of the RTD era standing) had a "goal" to "try and grow the audience" by NOT focusing "on telling new stories that are accessible to people who haven't been hardcore fans, while not alienating the existing fan base" but instead produced the Timeless Chidren overarching arc, which basically "wallow(ed) in continuity details" of the Doctor's origin, in an effort to "bring mystery back to the Doctor's whereabouts" but instead make that said origin an elaborate mystery that, in the end, did not achieve much beyond divide the fanbase for no apparent reason.

Nevermind, also, the fact that the Doctor in that very, very first episode was a mystery to everyone, but to himself. Making the character himself wonder about who he is but not actively seek it out is all kinds "I haven't REALLY gone far with my fanwank, I just obsessed over The Brain of Morbius as a teen!"

For the first season he did. It didn’t do well, so he marinated in serious fanwankery and returning stuff.
Knee deep in it by the end.

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

And, to be fair: I think the Cartmel Masterplan is similarly flawed and convoluted. The grace I give it is that it didn't make the Doctor into a serial violated individual with no agency to itself, and that ultimately Cartmel both didn't realize it on-screen because the show was cancelled (or put into hiatus, whatever) and also came to realize in hindsight that it was a good thing it never did.

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

For the first season he did. It didn’t do well, so he marinated in serious fanwankery and returning stuff.
Knee deep in it by the end.

The Timeless Child is literally refered to in the Ghost Monument by those creatures. Its Chib's overarching arc for his Doctor.

 

[jaime]

The Timeless Child is literally refered to in the Ghost Monument by those creatures. Its Chib's overarching arc for his Doctor.

I dont think he actually had it planned at that point. Was just something mysterious for the flying Kleenex to say. I thought they were referring to the Tardis itself tbh.

I do think he planned for Vinder to be the Doctors dad, but he was just stapling things together by the end.

 

[Steve Roby]

"The Woman Who Fell to Earth" was, like "Rose" and "The Eleventh Hour," a fresh start that wasn't full of continuity. Most of the Timeless Child arc came during the second series, whereas Bad Wolf and the cracks in the universe arcs played out through Davies' and Moffat's respective first series.

 

[jaime]

"The Woman Who Fell to Earth" was, like "Rose" and "The Eleventh Hour," a fresh start that wasn't full of continuity. Most of the Timeless Child arc came during the second series, whereas Bad Wolf and the cracks in the universe arcs played out through Davies' and Moffat's respective first series.

The crack went on far longer and was worked into the story much more.
Bad Wolf was. Well. Fun at the time eh.

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

I dont think he actually had it planned at that point. Was just something mysterious for the flying Kleenex to say. I thought they were referring to the Tardis itself tbh.

I do think he planned for Vinder to be the Doctors dad, but he was just stapling things together by the end.

"The Woman Who Fell to Earth" was, like "Rose" and "The Eleventh Hour," a fresh start that wasn't full of continuity. Most of the Timeless Child arc came during the second series, whereas Bad Wolf and the cracks in the universe arcs played out through Davies' and Moffat's respective first series.

The rumors about the Doctor's Morbius faces were already chatted about during the broadcast of the first series. Some fans thought the finale would be the reveal but it was the next one.

Don't think for a minute the Timeless Children, the most elaborate and intricate of Chibnall's plotting, wasn't on his mind when he was handed over the gig. The Fugitive Doctor? Probably not, it just segued into the Timeless Children thing. But the rest I have no doubt about.

 

[jaime]

The rumors about the Doctor's Morbius faces were already chatted about during the broadcast of the first series. Some fans thought the finale would be the reveal but it was the next one.

Don't think for a minute the Timeless Children, the most elaborate and intricate of Chibnall's plotting, wasn't on his mind when he was handed over the gig. The Fugitive Doctor? Probably not, it just segued into the Timeless Children thing. But the rest I have no doubt about.

I’m not sure if that makes it better or worse.
Especially considering how badly plotted it actually was.
I even sort of liked the police station Matrix bit at first, because it was very New Adventures.

If it had been the Master, I probably would have thought it was a great idea that made sense.

 

[TRON JA307020]

It's okay to decide that something just isn't making you happy any more and move on.

Looks like I might not have to. Davies is going to get one christmas episode to wrap his last storylinez up and it looks like the BBC will have to make some decisions. I really hope this is the end for Davies as show runner. His ideas failed and he had more money.

'It Wasn't a Better Show With More Money': Doctor Who Director Reflects on Disney's Ditched Funding Deal, and Admits 'Something Went Wrong' - IGN

Doctor Who, Daredevil and The Last of Us director Peter Hoar has reflected on Disney+ ditching its lucrative co-funding deal for Doctor Who, and admitted that ultimately "something went wrong."

www.ign.com

 

[Steve Roby]

I was going to tell myself to go touch grass, but...

 

[Set Harth]

Touch tree!

 

[jaime]

I was going to tell myself to go touch grass, but...

View attachment 51427

Dig?

 

[Starkers]

In my life, why do I give valuable time...

I had exactly the same thought.

 

[Steve Roby]

Touch tree!

Dig?

I’m feeling a bit too indoorsy. Already had my hot chocolate with espresso concentrate for the day, too.

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

Looks like I might not have to. Davies is going to get one christmas episode to wrap husband stuff up and it looks like the BBC will have to make some decisions. I really hope this is the end for Davies as show runner. His ideas failed and he had more money.

'It Wasn't a Better Show With More Money': Doctor Who Director Reflects on Disney's Ditched Funding Deal, and Admits 'Something Went Wrong' - IGN

Doctor Who, Daredevil and The Last of Us director Peter Hoar has reflected on Disney+ ditching its lucrative co-funding deal for Doctor Who, and admitted that ultimately "something went wrong."

www.ign.com

You're so insufferable.