Why Didn't Harry Get Promoted?

[Oddish]

How about this for a barometer...

Even LOWER DECKS had each of them go from Ensign to Lt. j.g. in about 3 years. And NONE of them were department heads.

And honestly, that's what Harry should have been, too: a lower deck special who grew in rank and responsibility. Just like B'Elanna should have been an assistant engineer who had to learn to control her temper, and Kes should have been a character who lived life in all its beauty and horror, while the Maquis began as renegade who had little use for Starfleet and slowly learned to work with the crew.

Harry was a single symptom of a serious issue.

 

[Ragitsu]

The real reason: everything on a starship has to come from (fairly) limited supplies...supplies often converted into replicator energy. New pips may constitute just enough salt to spruce up some chicken thighs.

 

[Oddish]

Then Janeway would simply talk to Neelix, and he uses some random scrap from his cargo hold to manufacture enough pips to promote everyone to fleet captain.

 

[Detached Nacelle]

Lieutenant Commander Cavit died and left only one hollow pip on the ship to be raffled off.

 

[fireproof78]

Other pips were used on bingo nights.

 

[Guy Gardener]

How about this for a barometer...

Even LOWER DECKS had each of them go from Ensign to Lt. j.g. in about 3 years. And NONE of them were department heads.

There's a Buck Rogers from 79... Called "Shgoratchx" where the wierdies of the week was a crew with 6 generals bossing around one very disgruntled Private.

Oh.

Tony Cox.

Still kicking.

 

[Oddish]

That explanation is right up there with "Janeway hates clarinet music" or "Janeway was dumped in high school by a guy named Harry". It's amusing, but there's no evidence backing it up.

 

[DonIago]

...now I'm imagining TNG poker nights involving the officers putting in their pips for their wagers...

 

[Oddish]

Data and Riker would be swapping the captain's chair between them, while Picard would probably wind up back in that blue shirt he had in "Tapestry".

 

[Guy Gardener]

That explanation is right up there with "Janeway hates clarinet music" or "Janeway was dumped in high school by a guy named Harry". It's amusing, but there's no evidence backing it up.

You generally get a promotion when you transfer between ships, but Kim did not edge words the Equinox or the Dauntless with any care or verve.

...now I'm imagining TNG poker nights involving the officers putting in their pips for their wagers...

In TNG the money was just for keeping score. The chips actually had no intrinsic value, but on Voyager they had a black market for replication rations and security was cracking down.

 

[Oddish]

You generally get a promotion when you transfer between ships, but Kim did not edge words the Equinox or the Dauntless with any care or verve.

Oh, you mean like...
Geordi. Promoted twice. Went from Enterprise to... Enterprise.
Or Worf. Also promoted twice.
Or Wesley, if you count acting ensign to full ensign a promotion. And I do. He stayed on Enterprise.
Or Deanna, they made a whole episode about it.
And Ogawa and Lavelle. Both got promotions. Neither left Enterprise.
Or Sisko. Made captain. Went from. DS9 to... wait a minute. DS9?
Or Dax and Bashir. Did they leave DS9 when they were promoted?
Or the five Lower Deckers. Surely they left the Cerritos upon their promo... oops, no.

But let's talk about Tuvok and Tom. They got promoted, so surely they left Voyager to go over to... oh. Voyager.

I guess you CAN get a promotion without leaving your ship. Imagine that.

 

[Tosk]

Oh, you mean like...
Geordi. Promoted twice. Went from Enterprise to... Enterprise.
Or Worf. Also promoted twice.
Or Wesley, if you count acting ensign to full ensign a promotion. And I do. He stayed on Enterprise.
Or Deanna, they made a whole episode about it.
And Ogawa and Lavelle. Both got promotions. Neither left Enterprise.
Or Sisko. Made captain. Went from. DS9 to... wait a minute. DS9?
Or Dax and Bashir. Did they leave DS9 when they were promoted?
Or the five Lower Deckers. Surely they left the Cerritos upon their promo... oops, no.

But let's talk about Tuvok and Tom. They got promoted, so surely they left Voyager to go over to... oh. Voyager.

I guess you CAN get a promotion without leaving your ship. Imagine that.

Guy didn't say you only get a promotion by switching assignments. I believe he's saying that you generally do get a promotion when doing so.

 

[Oddish]

It's been a common argument that Harry deserved to be stuck at ensign because he didn't change assignments. I was simply demonstrating that that argument holds as much water as your grandmother's colander.

 

[Guy Gardener]

It's been a common argument that Harry deserved to be stuck at ensign because he didn't change assignments. I was simply demonstrating that that argument holds as much water as your grandmother's colander.

Ezri transferred to DS9 and got a promotion.

Worf Transferred to DS9 and got a promotion.

They never said so, but if Beverly was in Charge of Starfleet Medical on Earth, it's likely that she was "briefly" an Admiral, or at least a Captain if she was charge of thousands of more officers and support staff than Jean-Luc.

Chechov was the XO of the reliant, a rank superior to any we know that he had on the Enterprise.

"sigh"

I was actually repeating something a soldier wrote here about real life, years ago, about promotions and transfers, that seemed truthful.

 

[Oddish]

Worf Transferred to DS9 and got a promotion.

Worf was promoted to LCDR in "Generations". He simply moved from the security division to the command division on DS9, hence the red uniform.

I was actually repeating something a soldier wrote here about real life, years ago, about promotions and transfers, that seemed truthful.

And it's probably mostly true in the IRL military. On an actual USN ship in Voyager's position, no one would have gotten promoted unless someone died. But Starfleet is not the IRL military, and people on Voyager were promoted.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

They never said so, but if Beverly was in Charge of Starfleet Medical on Earth, it's likely that she was "briefly" an Admiral, or at least a Captain if she was charge of thousands of more officers and support staff than Jean-Luc.

There's a certain amount of ambiguity about the issue, but originally the organisation (or at least the management authority of it) was the Surgeon-General's Office, and a couple of the more specific references to "Starfleet Medical" in "BermanTrek" suggested that at least some of the time it actually refers to a place (likely Starfleet Medical Annex - San Francisco) rather the organisation as a whole*, and the CO of such a facility could easily be a Captain or even an experienced Commander appointed in an acting capacity**.



*A similar thing seems to be going on with Starfleet Command/Headquarters.
** Similarly Sisko was a Captain acting in a Commodore's billet in Homefront/Paradise Lost.

 

[Farscape One]

While it's true position doesn't always require a higher rank to be in it, there are cases where a somewhat lower rank than we usually see (or believe should be) in a given position is acceptable.

Like Sisko being appointed Chief of Earth Security in "HOMEFRONT"/"PARADISE LOST". While a captain is NOT a low rank at all, it is likely lower for that position than we would expect to see. But the situation of a potential threat to Earth security by the Dominion needed the head of it to be VERY familiar with the Dominion... and as Leyton pointed out, no one in Starfleet was more familiar with the Dominion and their tactics than Captain Sisko. So his appointment to that position made sense.


By contrast, Tilly was made acting XO in DISCO. TWICE!. Neither time made a lick of sense when there were many more experienced, higher ranked officers on just the bridge alone.

And don't get me started on the stupidity of Kelvinverse Kirk in '09 move from cadet to command.

Logical, sensible position appointments seem to be an afterthought from '09 onward... it's entirely done because of 'the feels'.

 

[Oddish]

Logical, sensible position appointments seem to be an afterthought from '09 onward... it's entirely done because of 'the feels'.

Earlier too. Braga's statement ("somebody gotta be duh ensign") was utterly devoid of rational explanation. After all, TNG got rid of its ensign in the 4th season (about when Harry should have gotten his hollow pip) and DS9 never had an ensign in its main cast at all.

 

[fireproof78]

And don't get me started on the stupidity of Kelvinverse Kirk in '09 move from cadet to command.

Lieutenant to Captain.

Earlier too. Braga's statement ("somebody gotta be duh ensign") was utterly devoid of rational explanation. After all, TNG got rid of its ensign in the 4th season (about when Harry should have gotten his hollow pip) and DS9 never had an ensign in its main cast at all.

"The feels" have dominated ranks in Trek for a while now. The idea of being a captain means more than reasonable advancement. People can turn down rank at any time and opt to not advance their career because of their feels. Being a captain is the only place you can really make a difference so don't leave the bridge.

This is not a new phenomenon in Star Trek. Bring a captain is great and being an admiral is horrible. If that isn't about the feels I don't know what is.

 

[Farscape One]

Earlier too. Braga's statement ("somebody gotta be duh ensign") was utterly devoid of rational explanation. After all, TNG got rid of its ensign in the 4th season (about when Harry should have gotten his hollow pip) and DS9 never had an ensign in its main cast at all.

I was thinking more about promotions into positions, but you're right about Braga's statement. (I should have been clearer before about what I was going for.)


And technically, DS9 did have an Ensign in their main cast... for 3 episodes. Ezri got her pip at the end of "AFTERIMAGE".