Based on? Since we don't have any real-world examples of spaceships of that size and capabilities.
Is this something that has been said in the show, or something you've made up?
Emotion rarely makes sense, we get by anyway.
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
- Start date
Based on? Since we don't have any real-world examples of spaceships of that size and capabilities.
Is this something that has been said in the show, or something you've made up?
Emotion rarely makes sense, we get by anyway.
It was good enough for Defiant and other vessels that it becomes a standard feature on StarFleet ships moving forward in time.
We can change that in shows covering future time frames.
Are you so afraid of me justifying why I made the decisions I made?
Or just don't like the fact that I do justify it somehow?
And all things in Star Trek can be changed if their is will behind the writing staff on-board to change it.
Do you not encase Safe Rooms in as much Concrete and Steel Doors as possible?
Do you not create Bunker rooms with Concrete and Earth on top to protect from aerial attacks?
It's the same principle. Encasement in structure.
Look at the layout of Voyager, look at the floor plans.
I've neever seen a backup bridge or control room for that vessel.
Never is it even mentioned on screen either.
Nobody who worked on the deck layout ever mentions it either.
And there are others who will fix the problem for you anyways.
This should tell you all you need to know about Trek.
So, what you did say was, to quote you:
I'll leave it to others who might care, to judge whether what I said, "You've asked people to think of you as our reference master, as the author of our tech books," is a fair reading of this.
I'm out of this sidebar, and I return myself back to discussing controversial opinions, going forward, other controversial opinions.
Well, yeah, the whole point of the CIC is to be within the hull of a vessel. Even Star Trek adheres to this, in that the closest thing we've had to a CIC in Trek would be the command center installed on the NX-01 for the Xindi mission, which was located within the hull. Even on The Expanse, the CIC might have been within the hull of their ships, though that doesn't rule out the possibility there was also a bridge at the ship's top most point. As was supposed to be the case with Nu BSG, though this was only established in a brief throwaway line in the pilot miniseries, and as the show went on the CIC began sloppily being referred to interchangeably as the bridge anyway.
No, no, no. The writers are only to be concerned with the story and the characters. The science/technical people are not writers, they are consultants. They provide input, the writers may include their input if they desire, but ultimately the needs of the story come first. If that means ignoring what the consultants have to say, then they are ignored. The story and characters are what carries the show, not the technical minutia. Like on BSG, one time the entire writers room began arguing over the ship's internal layout and how one would move about the ship, pulling up ship schematics and cutaway diagrams and all manner of nonsense until finally Ron Moore got fed up and sent everyone home early for the day. The next day everyone comes in to find written on the room's white board in all caps "IT'S ABOUT THE CHARACTERS, STUPID!" Ron Moore knew that at the end of the day, it was the characters and storyline the audience were going to remember and discuss, not Galactica's internal layout and deck plans and made sure the rest of the writers knew to prioritize the characters and story over everything else.
This basic principal is true no matter what kind of television you're watching. Everyone knows the various cop, lawyer, hospital and firefighter shows on network TV don't have a shred of realism to them. But that doesn't matter, most of them succeed because the audience becomes invested in their characters and want to watch what happens to these characters. Unless people give a damn about the characters in a work of fiction, that particular work of fiction isn't going to last no matter how scientifically or technically accurate it might be.
My next controversial (?) opinion:
Especially post-TAS, after the life support belts considered for "The Tholian Web" had been realized on screen, other shows should have had personal force fields for protection against some amount of phaser fire and other weapons as standard landing party equipment.
Would it have gotten in the way of telling good stories? I don't know; maybe, sometimes. But Star Trek has survived deflectors on starships, even if the shields down to 47% trope has super-annoyed many people.
Especially post-TAS, after the life support belts considered for "The Tholian Web" had been realized on screen, other shows should have had personal force fields for protection against some amount of phaser fire and other weapons as standard landing party equipment.
Would it have gotten in the way of telling good stories? I don't know; maybe, sometimes. But Star Trek has survived deflectors on starships, even if the shields down to 47% trope has super-annoyed many people.
Well, I looked through some of my books on modern naval warships and, indeed, several have what is considered a secondary command center buried deep within the ship where it can be run just as well as from the primary command center and it is manned during emergencies.
Two things though.
One - sailors prefer a bridge/command center location that offers views of the outside to get a broader view of the situation and increases response times to incoming threats.
Two - if you're commanding the ship from the secondary command center, that means topside is well and truly fucked, and any chance you might have getting topside to a lifeboat if the ship goes down are minimal, because the upper decks are probably blocked by fire and debris.
Two things though.
One - sailors prefer a bridge/command center location that offers views of the outside to get a broader view of the situation and increases response times to incoming threats.
Two - if you're commanding the ship from the secondary command center, that means topside is well and truly fucked, and any chance you might have getting topside to a lifeboat if the ship goes down are minimal, because the upper decks are probably blocked by fire and debris.
Last edited:
Again, it sounds like you want to fundamentally change the design language of Star Trek.
No, I just think bad fanfic has its place. Not that all fanfic is bad, but yours certainly is.
Last edited:
I've never heard anything about that first part.
The story I heard was that Moore was struggling to come up with a satisfying resolution to BSG's mysteries in the show's finale and then had that "It's about the characters, stupid" epiphany. He realised it was less important to wrap up the plot than it was to wrap up the characters.
People had opinions afterwards about how well he succeeded at that.
That's one way to do it.
I concur.
We can change that dyanmic / relationship / structure for the specific domain expertise.
This way the core writers never have to worry about solving those technical issues.
You hand off those issues to the specific domain experts, they'll come up with a solution.
The Storyline/Character writers will integrate the solutions.
Sure, I'm sure we can find a way to make the needs of the Writers happen while the Science/Technical/Domain experts handle the rest and solve their problems.
That makes for a boring show to me.
I loved it when "24" brought realism to the drama and followed the time clock.
Adding Realism doesn't have to hurt the Drama IMO.
As Real as Possible can also be dramatic & engaging, it doesn't have to be mutually exclusive IMO.
That's Ron's way of handling things.
We can change that moving forward, having more dramas based on IRL Cops, Lawyers, Hospitals, FireFighters.
No more fake Hollywood non-sense.
There's very good reason why everybody clowns on Hollywood and how fake / trashy it is that it's as a trope in and of itself.
It's a good thing that other shows seperate the technical work and the storyline writers.
There is actually a reference in DS9's Homefront/Paradise Lost to the security personnel patrolling Earth's streets being equipped with personal force fields, we just don't see them.
"It's about the characters, stupid" was a recurring motif in the BSG's writer's room. It began with what I mentioned, the writers obsessing technical details irritating the shit out of Moore and became Moore's mantra until finally he had to remind himself of it while writing the show's ending.
It always irritates me when the bridge needs to be abandoned and the characters set up a command post in engineering for that very reason, but most of the time, I try to roll with it since the lack of time or money to build another set for the auxiliary control room is probably deciding the matter for them. That said, I never did understand why in TNG's Brothers the bridge crew went to engineering after evacuating the bridge instead of going to the battle bridge. This was only two or three episode after TBOBW, where we do see the battle bridge, so the set was likely still standing.
You simply don't have a clue of what you're talking about. Have you ever questioned why certain shows make the decisions that they do?
i vaguely recall them being mentioned in one of the episodes of ds9 where sisko is on earth, the UFP president's bodyguards being equipped with them or something? but we never actually saw them. and i think when artie tried to steal data away to the warehouse, hehad something? idk.
99.99% of viewers wouldn't even notice the difference unless I pointed it out to them.
That's how little they pay attention to the details like "Bridge Module Placement".
Ah, because it's my Fan-Fic, and it contradicts tradition.
Got it, you don't like what I have to say because it goes against what you're comfortable with.
Did the NX-01 have a BackUp bridge?
I think your vessel needs a certain amount of size to have a entire dedicated backup bridge.
Otherwise, just route the controls around to your PADD and control it from where ever you want on the vessel.
That's the beauty of computerized controls & terminals.
You can pilot the ship from your bed if yo have to.
Usually $$$ & Ratings.
Because reality is boring. No one wants to spend eighteen years following one case, trial, treatment and so on. People don't want reality, they want people of poor judgement to still come out as heroes regardless of how bad a situation is fucked up. They don't want to follow the trial of Philip P. Phillips for five years of court jockeying before a trial ever starts.
Thank you! The line is ["Homefront" transcript]:
LEYTON: Mister President, we can use the Lakota's transporters and communications system to mobilise every Starfleet officer on Earth in less than twelve hours. We've been preparing for something like this for a long time. We have stockpiles of phaser rifles, personal forcefields, photon grenades, enough to equip an entire army. I can start getting men on the streets immediately.
---
There's also the personal forcefield that Worf rigged on the holodeck in "A Fistful of Datas," using
---
The Borg, of course, had them.
---
Maybe there are some other examples?
Thiiiiiiiiiis, so much this.
There have been two ways I have seen from the original scripts and from interviews how the science consultant was used on Star Trek in the Berman and Kurtzman eras:
1) The writer puts together their outline and/or draft. Within, you'll find [TECH] written in place of sections of technobabble, which Andre Bormanis or Dr. Erin Macdonald would then fill in to add the flair of verisimilitude. This is where the saying [TECH] the [TECH] comes from.
2) A writer has an idea for an episode that needs some kind of "weird space shit" in order to accomplish a story beat or a character beat. They go to the science consultant and ask, "how could we make this happen in a plausible-for-Trek manner? Bonus points if it's real science, but as long as it's plausible for the story."
That. Is. It. For that position.
The consultants are not considered a part of the writing staff as such. Indeed, once Naren Shankar and Andre Bormanis wanted to graduate from consulting on the show to actually writing for the show, they had to submit their specs and try out for a slot just like every other hopeful. Dr. Erin is also trying to get staffed on shows herself now.
Or just do the Stargate thing. Though there were technical consultants for the science and military aspects of the show, the writers made it very clear that if their suggestions interfered with the show's story, they would be ignored. They managed ten seasons, two spin-offs and two DVD movies with this approach, I'd say it worked.
24 was never particularly realistic. Even in the early seasons when they weren't as liberal about what Jack Bauer could accomplish in an hour as they were in later years, there was still the rather convenient fact that though the clock continued to tick during commercial breaks, nothing important happened during those two minutes when the audience wasn't watching.
What does that even mean, reality shows following actual lawyers, doctors and first responders? If so, then a show about real lawyers is already out of the question, since there are still many places in the US that don't allow cameras into court rooms, that's why when there's news coverage of trials, they show illustrations of what goes on in court.
Regardless, even reality television is very unrealistic and is nine times out of ten staged. Indeed, there have been a few shows over the years following actual police officers such as Cops and Live PD among others, both of which have been accused of obviously staged and selective editing.
That emotions don't matter in design language; only logic.
I can accept it fine. I don't agree with it and have stated why.
For emergencies as previously stated.
It's not about justification. Otherwise the same is true for why it's on top
It's about the preponderance of evidence from the show itself. This isn't just ship building 101 class. It starts with the design language of the show.
It's not. It a hierarchical organization.
Similar threads
- Locked
