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Westworld discussion original movie and HBO series

But Abrams has a producer credit for Westworld
Abrams is better known for ''cool-izing'' his reimagined material, though not to complexify them.
When I browse the list of the crew on IMDB, he's not listed at all. Therefore, I think it's as @Tuskin38 points out, in that it's simply his production company. I don't think he was actually involved in the actual production, as that's the first I've heard of it. I do see his name further down into the 'Series Produced by' credits, but I don't see much material involvement.
As virtually none of HBO's dramas were ever dumbed down (to their credit), HBO itself may have encouraged so much smartening up, to the point of excessiveness.
But having seen DUNKIRK once without noticing or caring about its offbeat time-shifting in war, my guess is that one Nolan or two used HBO's approach and are thereby most responsible for the ''what the hell is happening'' reactions WW kept getting.
 
As virtually none of HBO's dramas were ever dumbed down (to their credit), HBO itself may have encouraged so much smartening up, to the point of excessiveness.
But having seen DUNKIRK once without noticing or caring about its offbeat time-shifting in war, my guess is that one Nolan or two used HBO's approach and are thereby most responsible for the ''what the hell is happening'' reactions WW kept getting.


It might very well be a combination of things that led to it being so confusing. To me, it felt like they were being purposefully confusing to distract away from a storyline that might not have made sense or had many plotholes.
 
Abrams has put his name onto shows before to help them get made, such as Fringe, but isn't involved otherwise.
 
Abrams has put his name onto shows before to help them get made, such as Fringe, but isn't involved otherwise.


That's true I guess lending your name to a production can help.

I love Fringe I think it is time for a rewatch sometime before Christmas.

Is it bad I thought Clementine was more attractive than Maeve and felt she was not given much to do on the show.
 
I think when it comes to producers, the best way to tell how involved they are is if they're also credited as a writer or a director, if they're not, then I don't think they had a lot of input.
 
I enjoyed Westworld quite a bit when it was airing on HBO. Shame it was axed before Season 5 so it could end out proper. Season 4 does kind of give us an end for the series, however it certainly felt a little anti-climactic in some areas (Maeve and MIB fate) Anthony Hopkins' character definitely elevated the show in earlier seasons. It's a shame the wild west town used for westworld (and fistful of datas) burned down while they were filming Season 4(or was it 3?)

IIRC, after the end of Season one, Season two had to be re-written. Some fans online had guessed that the big season two twist would be that Westworld was on the moon, and this may or may not have caused the showrunner (Jonathan Nolan?) to re-write the season. I imagine many viewers felt this to be the most confusing season because of the "twist" with non-linear storytelling. I enjoyed it, but at the time a big part of the drive to watch the show was ""WTF is going on and where is this going?"

I think Fallout's first season definitely benefitted from Jonathan Nolan and Lisa Joy's experience with WW. I find myself liking Fallout for many of the same reasons I enjoyed WW - still has a little bit of the "WTF is going on?" factor, albeit not as intense.
 
I can't recall where I first saw it posted, it was either reddit if not the Trekbbs thread on WW when it was airing. Fans analyzed some dialogue and other alleged "clues" dropped during Season one and cobbled up a theory that the park/island may be in a colony of sorts in some other worldly place.

I found this link but can't remember where I saw the moon thing pop up and now I am thinking it was more speculation than fact re: the moon, or the journalists misinterpreted a joke from the showrunners. - https://vocal.media/geeks/what-a-sp...westworld-season-2-because-of-reddit-spoilers

I found the old bbs thread where a poster mentions something about a moon theory being popular back when the show was on - maybe there is some truth to it? I didnt dig through the thread to find the actual moon theory stuff but it is mentioned in last post on page 39

 
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Shame it was axed before Season 5 so it could end out proper. Season 4 does kind of give us an end for the series, however it certainly felt a little anti-climactic in some areas

To be honest, I was quite surprised when they ended up with a 4th season. It felt that by the end of the 3rd season, things were coming to a close enough that they could have left it there. Season 4 felt quite weird and disconnected from everything else.

Is it bad I thought Clementine was more attractive than Maeve and felt she was not given much to do on the show.

I felt Maeve was mishandled so badly on the show. She was one of the more interesting characters, but I felt multiple host-resets had left her character rudderless.
 
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I definitely wondered throughout S1 if the park was on another planet. I'm pretty sure we never saw the moon, for instance, until the finale - and it was immediately revealed that said moon was a practical effect for Dolores' scene at the beach, watched by live human spectators. That wasn't an accident: they wanted to keep us guessing, and keep their options open. With S2's premiere, however, they quickly established "yeah, it's a Chinese man-made island or something, who cares, we're on Earth, moving on."

Anyhow, as I said last time...

I think a key problem here is that wondering if the hosts have achieved sentience is a lot more interesting - in the heady sense, at least - than seeing what they do once they definitely have it. (Much like wondering if Neo was indeed The One turned out to be a lot more interesting than watching him be The One.) If the hosts gain self-awareness only to become “destroy all humans” Terminators, that could make for a fun action series told from the human perspective, but they’d cease to be interesting as layered characters.​
On the other hand, if the hosts gain sentience and become more or less indistinguishable from humans, in that they’re equally capable of malice and beneficence, they can continue to deepen as characters, but that direction leads away from the kind of big, heady sci-fi concepts the showrunners gravitate to. Hosts can either develop consciences and rebel against their more ruthless peers (the Dolores/Teddy dynamic was one of S2’s stronger subplots), or they pretty much become humans with machine parts (like the Dolores-Charlotte bot who decides that being a Real Mom is more pleasant than being a murder-spy).​
With S1, the showrunners had a season that was both philosophically heady and psychologically rich. Rather than allowing the tone of the subsequent seasons to evolve, however, they keep trying to cram philosophical headiness into their stories of complex characters, and the results keep getting messier.​

Indeed, me! :p
 
A fun video released during S1 laying out the two-timeline theory:

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A fun video released during S1 laying out the two-timeline theory:

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That's neat.


Here's a fun music video


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This is why writers annoy me sometimes.

So what sime fans guess a twist. Why change it for the rest of the people that didn't guess lucky?

I'm reminded of DC Comics "Armageddon 2001" that was published in 1991 and ran across the Annuals.
The readers guessed that the super hero turned villain was Captain Atom, which forced DC to change the ending, making Hawk the hero that turned into Monarch, when all the clues and the powers displayed clearly pointed to Captain Atom. It made no sense whatsoever and actually made the whole event kind of pointless, seeing as they were setting Monach up to be the "Big Bad" in the JLA titles.
 
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I'm reminded of DC Comics "Armageddon 200" that was published in 1991 and ran across the Annuals.
The readers guessed that the super hero turned villain was Captain Atom, which forced DC to change the ending, making Hawk the hero that turned into Monarch, when all the clues and the powers displayed clearly pointed to Captain Atom. It made no sense whatsoever and actually made the whole event kind of pointless, seeing as they were setting Monach up to be the "Big Bad" in the JLA titles.


That sounds terrible
 
Has anyone else lain awake for hours at night, wondering if the deep red walls of Westworld's futuristic artificial Wild West control room was an homage to the deep red backdrop of TOS' artificial Wild West simulation in "Spectre of the Gun"? :p

Spectreofthegunhd0287.jpg


hbo-mwf-westworld-01-101-sub-03-5-17-2017000001-h-2017.jpg
 
This is why writers annoy me sometimes.

So what sime fans guess a twist. Why change it for the rest of the people that didn't guess lucky?

There's a rumor that fans of The Mentalist correctly guessed the identity of Red John, so they changed it to some random, underwhelming character that made no sense who hadn't left any impression on the show before.

Or maybe they're just trying to explain how the showrunner managed to bungle Red John so badly.
 
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