How would DS9 be different, if it were made today instead of in the 90's ?

[Takeru]

That wouldn't be it's purpose here.

But it was the reason why they came up with the wormhole as part of the show during development, so I figured they wouldn't come up with the idea today because the underlying reasons don't exist anymore.
The religion/alien aspect could still be there, Star Trek is full of non corporeal aliens but I don't think they'd live in a wormhole to a distant part of the galaxy.

 

[fireproof78]

But it was the reason why they came up with the wormhole as part of the show during development, so I figured they wouldn't come up with the idea today because the underlying reasons don't exist anymore.
The religion/alien aspect could still be there, Star Trek is full of non corporeal aliens but I don't think they'd live in a wormhole to a distant part of the galaxy.

Oh, I think a similar idea could work extremely well.

 

[PoorSailorsAirline]

Good question, maybe one that goes beyond what's posed and right to the heart of Trek lore.

Does the Prime Directive permit non-interference to the level of condoning slavery, forced family separation, comfort women, puppet governments and disastrous strip-mining? I can see where the Prime Directive concept may have come from in the 1960s and the 1980s, but in the lens of the 2020s, would the UFP actually let the Cardassians get away with that? As Keeve Falor said in TNG's Ensign Ro in 1991, "you sat and watched behind a line on a map." (I'm taking some off-the-cuff liberties with the exact quote, but you get the intention.)

I can't imagine the Cardassians would have even been able to build DS9 or any of the other "___ Nor" stations--they'd have been blockaded, sanctioned, and totally shut out of any levers of influence. They may have occupied Bajor to solve their shortages, but other major powers would have moved to shut them down harder than if they hadn't invaded.

In short, I think a central premise of the show would have been untenable if it was made today, because the Cardassians would never have gotten that far in the first place. Our collective consciousness now seems less likely to accept the "not my problem" factor posed by the Prime Directive when facing obvious cruelty and despotic behaviour. Cardassians invading Bajor would have just made their problems worse, and they wouldn't even be a factor in galactic affairs.

Basically: we'd be so disgusted, we'd whoop their bony asses without firing a shot. There would be no DS9.

Now, the Ferengi using Bajor and the wormhole as an intergalactic tax haven while igniting a trade war with the Dominion, where the UFP tries to keep both sides happy? That I could see being made in 2024.

Notwithstanding the rant above, I agree with several others that one of Trek's beauties is it's timelessness. Take out that modern perspective, and DS9 has a storyline for everyone. No matter when we watch it! Bad is bad, good is good, black and white is grey, money drives everything except altruism--which requires money, sometimes the bad guys are good guys, religion is in the eye of both the believer and the atheist, and complexity is...everywhere. It's really a great show.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

there's less incentive to add a macguffin that literally spits out random alien plots to get 26 stories per year

Didn't work for the last season of Disco.

 

[Poltargyst]

Good question, maybe one that goes beyond what's posed and right to the heart of Trek lore.

Does the Prime Directive permit non-interference to the level of condoning slavery, forced family separation, comfort women, puppet governments and disastrous strip-mining? I can see where the Prime Directive concept may have come from in the 1960s and the 1980s, but in the lens of the 2020s, would the UFP actually let the Cardassians get away with that? As Keeve Falor said in TNG's Ensign Ro in 1991, "you sat and watched behind a line on a map." (I'm taking some off-the-cuff liberties with the exact quote, but you get the intention.)

I can't imagine the Cardassians would have even been able to build DS9 or any of the other "___ Nor" stations--they'd have been blockaded, sanctioned, and totally shut out of any levers of influence. They may have occupied Bajor to solve their shortages, but other major powers would have moved to shut them down harder than if they hadn't invaded.

In short, I think a central premise of the show would have been untenable if it was made today, because the Cardassians would never have gotten that far in the first place. Our collective consciousness now seems less likely to accept the "not my problem" factor posed by the Prime Directive when facing obvious cruelty and despotic behaviour. Cardassians invading Bajor would have just made their problems worse, and they wouldn't even be a factor in galactic affairs.

Basically: we'd be so disgusted, we'd whoop their bony asses without firing a shot. There would be no DS9.

Now, the Ferengi using Bajor and the wormhole as an intergalactic tax haven while igniting a trade war with the Dominion, where the UFP tries to keep both sides happy? That I could see being made in 2024.

Notwithstanding the rant above, I agree with several others that one of Trek's beauties is it's timelessness. Take out that modern perspective, and DS9 has a storyline for everyone. No matter when we watch it! Bad is bad, good is good, black and white is grey, money drives everything except altruism--which requires money, sometimes the bad guys are good guys, religion is in the eye of both the believer and the atheist, and complexity is...everywhere. It's really a great show.

What if it wasn't about the Federation "letting" the Cardassians do any of those things? What if he Cardassians were so militarily powerful that the Federation couldn't stop them without a horribly costly war?

 

[kkt]

Hm. Had the Federation even become aware of the existence of Cardassia and Bajor when the occupation started?

 

[Poltargyst]

I think the OP said that the quality would remain high, but I suspect the quality of DS9 wouldn't be as good if it was made today.

 

[kkt]

On any show for American TV they would drastically change Kira's character after 9/11. No sympathetic terrorists, please. And they might have told Bashir "hands off the patients".

 

[PoorSailorsAirline]

Hm. Had the Federation even become aware of the existence of Cardassia and Bajor when the occupation started?

I need some groupthink here to make sure I've got my story straight, but wasn't it in TNG The Wounded when Picard said he basically had to duck-and-run from the Cardassians when he was on patrol on the Stargazer? I took it for granted that the Cardassians were one of those background antagonists who'd been around for a long time, and assumed the Federation must have known what was up on Bajor. But it's a big galaxy and hard to have eyes everywhere...you might be right!

What if it wasn't about the Federation "letting" the Cardassians do any of those things? What if he Cardassians were so militarily powerful that the Federation couldn't stop them without a horribly costly war?

Great point. Actually, that kind of ties in re: Picard/Stargazer. It was DS9 who introduced the Cardassians as a beta power who were brutal to the Bajorans, but easily overrun by the Klingons and forced to turn into Dominion subjects. DS9 made them seem evil, certainly, but hardly infallible. In TNG they were seen as quite scary, despite Picard's mention that a Galor-class wouldn't stand up to a Galaxy-class. (Something about "you would be at a disadvantage" IIRC.) Perhaps Federation Intel overestimated the Cardassians and were fearful of retribution, which would blow up my premise that Cardassia couldn't do what they did on Bajor without the UFP stepping in.

I'm still stuck on my idea for a circa-2020s reboot about a wormhole-related trade war instead of the occupation/prophets aspect. Next up on Star Trek: Deep Space Succession... (Succession)

 

[PoorSailorsAirline]

On any show for American TV they would drastically change Kira's character after 9/11. No sympathetic terrorists, please. And they might have told Bashir "hands off the patients".

100%! Post 9/11, a Leia-style rebel might have been scripted, but absolutely not the "I did what I had to do" Kira we saw.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I need some groupthink here to make sure I've got my story straight, but wasn't it in TNG The Wounded when Picard said he basically had to duck-and-run from the Cardassians when he was on patrol on the Stargazer? I took it for granted that the Cardassians were one of those background antagonists who'd been around for a long time, and assumed the Federation must have known what was up on Bajor. But it's a big galaxy and hard to have eyes everywhere...you might be right!

True

PICARD: Last time I was in this sector, I was on the Stargazer, running at warp speed ahead of a Cardassian warship.
TROI: Running, Captain? You? That's hard to believe.
PICARD: Believe it. I'd been sent to make preliminary overtures to a truce. I'd lowered my shields as a gesture of good will. But the Cardassians were not impressed. They had taken out most of my weapons and damaged the impulse engines before I could regroup and run.

 

[kkt]

So how long before The Wounded was Picard in the Stargazer?

 

[cooleddie74]

He commanded the Stargazer from 2333 to 2355, so twelve to thirty-four years before "The Wounded(TNG)."

 

[at Quark's]

I think the OP said that the quality would remain high, but I suspect the quality of DS9 wouldn't be as good if it was made today.

Quite possibly.

What I had in mind was the question what we would have got, had they wanted to make DS9 today, so same general storylines and quality and themes, so a series fairly 'close to' classic DS9, just with the things changed that we'd really do differently today.

(But of course there's no telling what would have happened, and 'had the series come out today it would have been drastically different' would be a perfectly valid answer).

 

[Lynx]

Just have to get through WW3 first

But Henry Starling and his time-dabbling may have spared us from that scenario too.

 

[publiusr]

Openly genderfluid, non-binary, and trans characters would be a part of the show. And it would not just be exclusive to humans either, Trill…

It surprised me how gruff Odo was made…no more fluid than that.

A similar character can be found in Imajica…from 1991.

 

[Farscape One]

DS9 would be a very different series if it were made today, and definitely not as good. And for a reason that I haven't seen mentioned yet.

All the 'little moments' for all the characters would be almost completely gone. Moments and scenes like...

"CAPTIVE PURSUIT" - Sisko addressing the sexual clause of the Dabo girl's contract.

"PLAYING GOD" - the Hamlin flute joke to O'Brien.

"SHAKAAR" - O'Brien's winning streak.

"REJOINED" - Dax performing magic tricks.

"THE QUICKENING" - Quark's ad being run on the monitors. That entire scene is just pure gold.

"NOR THE BATTLE TO THE STRONG" - the 'Quarktajino' scene.

"BLAZE OF GLORY" - Nog trying to earn the Klingons' respect.

"TAKE ME OUT TO THE HOLOSUITE" - Odo practicing his umpire moves.


And hundreds of other moments and scenes that not only show us these are people living a life but CONNECT us to them.

One of the things I miss about the older shows that is hardly seen in the current era are those moments. Everything is too centered on the world/galaxy ending threat or situation that's going on. Add to that we have such short seasons, and we lose the flavor of those characters. Someone said before 'when everything matters, then nothing matters'... and that's accurate. If we don't get those day in the life moments, we're not going to really connect with these characters, or care about what happens to them.

And the ironic thing is that the streaming format is actually perfect to have a bunch of these moments peppered into each episode. Doesn't even need to be a great deal of time added... many of the scenes I am talking about were done in a minute or so, sometimes less. DS9 managed to do this in virtually every episode while still under a strict time limit for episode length.

And we NEED those moments to make the whole work. It's truly an embodiment of how the little things really matter.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

One of the things I miss about the older shows that is hardly seen in the current era are those moments. Everything is too centered on the world/galaxy ending threat or situation that's going on. Add to that we have such short seasons, and we lose the flavor of those characters. Someone said before 'when everything matters, then nothing matters'... and that's accurate. If we don't get those day in the life moments, we're not going to really connect with these characters, or care about what happens to them.

While I agree with you that they would go missing, is it not possible that they would merely be victims of the 10-episode season, not having enough time to process character development?

That said, I still think character development would go missing--or at least in the context of relationships. New Trek really likes turning into the "found family" trope. In the case of the Stamets Family, it makes sense. It validates an aspect of LGBT culture. However, it is even an imperfect fit: Stamets, Culber, Adira, and Gray are clearly not associating wth one another out of necessity. None of them has been shunned by biological family or by society in general. Nonetheless, it helps frame personal relationships in a way that is typical of contemporary LGBT families.

In other places, it seems to be an excuse to force emotional bonds without having the characters change. With some exceptions, the characters in Discovery, Picard, and Strange New Worlds were formed in situ. The crew of the USS Discovery doesn't have a lot of depth (largely because casting them was largely secondary). Pike has moments of reflection on his already prophesied fate, but he has largely been a personable, charming individual who buddies up to the crew. Spock ... sorry, can't say much without spoiling season two, but as much as it make sense to have him be a less mature vulcan, it doesn't seem like we are seeing any actual development.

Character moments in DS9 meant the characters played off one another. O'Brien and Bashir grow together as friends, and their interactions lead to self-discovery. Quark starts out as a committed capitalist, but by the end of the season, despite his pledge to hold the line against reform, he is a committed family man (to his extended family). And Sisko's commitment to marriage is a slow burn, something which is exploited in the finally, where in a bittersweet fashion, his "destiny" comes into conflic with he own goals. Their character development is maturation, focused on interpersonal bonds. They are not a "found family." They are a "band of brothers," brought together with a purpose, but who learn about each other individually and commit to each other's happiness.

 

[Lynx]

DS9 would be a very different series if it were made today, and definitely not as good. And for a reason that I haven't seen mentioned yet.

All the 'little moments' for all the characters would be almost completely gone. Moments and scenes like...

"CAPTIVE PURSUIT" - Sisko addressing the sexual clause of the Dabo girl's contract.

"PLAYING GOD" - the Hamlin flute joke to O'Brien.

"SHAKAAR" - O'Brien's winning streak.

"REJOINED" - Dax performing magic tricks.

"THE QUICKENING" - Quark's ad being run on the monitors. That entire scene is just pure gold.

"NOR THE BATTLE TO THE STRONG" - the 'Quarktajino' scene.

"BLAZE OF GLORY" - Nog trying to earn the Klingons' respect.

"TAKE ME OUT TO THE HOLOSUITE" - Odo practicing his umpire moves.


And hundreds of other moments and scenes that not only show us these are people living a life but CONNECT us to them.

One of the things I miss about the older shows that is hardly seen in the current era are those moments. Everything is too centered on the world/galaxy ending threat or situation that's going on. Add to that we have such short seasons, and we lose the flavor of those characters. Someone said before 'when everything matters, then nothing matters'... and that's accurate. If we don't get those day in the life moments, we're not going to really connect with these characters, or care about what happens to them.

And the ironic thing is that the streaming format is actually perfect to have a bunch of these moments peppered into each episode. Doesn't even need to be a great deal of time added... many of the scenes I am talking about were done in a minute or so, sometimes less. DS9 managed to do this in virtually every episode while still under a strict time limit for episode length.

And we NEED those moments to make the whole work. It's truly an embodiment of how the little things really matter.

All such moments would be replaced by a constant arguing and bickering in the worst Stargate Universe way if DS9 was made today.

 

[Farscape One]

While I agree with you that they would go missing, is it not possible that they would merely be victims of the 10-episode season, not having enough time to process character development?

That said, I still think character development would go missing--or at least in the context of relationships. New Trek really likes turning into the "found family" trope. In the case of the Stamets Family, it makes sense. It validates an aspect of LGBT culture. However, it is even an imperfect fit: Stamets, Culber, Adira, and Gray are clearly not associating wth one another out of necessity. None of them has been shunned by biological family or by society in general. Nonetheless, it helps frame personal relationships in a way that is typical of contemporary LGBT families.

In other places, it seems to be an excuse to force emotional bonds without having the characters change. With some exceptions, the characters in Discovery, Picard, and Strange New Worlds were formed in situ. The crew of the USS Discovery doesn't have a lot of depth (largely because casting them was largely secondary). Pike has moments of reflection on his already prophesied fate, but he has largely been a personable, charming individual who buddies up to the crew. Spock ... sorry, can't say much without spoiling season two, but as much as it make sense to have him be a less mature vulcan, it doesn't seem like we are seeing any actual development.

Character moments in DS9 meant the characters played off one another. O'Brien and Bashir grow together as friends, and their interactions lead to self-discovery. Quark starts out as a committed capitalist, but by the end of the season, despite his pledge to hold the line against reform, he is a committed family man (to his extended family). And Sisko's commitment to marriage is a slow burn, something which is exploited in the finally, where in a bittersweet fashion, his "destiny" comes into conflic with he own goals. Their character development is maturation, focused on interpersonal bonds. They are not a "found family." They are a "band of brothers," brought together with a purpose, but who learn about each other individually and commit to each other's happiness.

They definitely would be a casualty of the short seasons, but as I mentioned, you can still have a number of those scenes or moments peppered into each episode. Adding just a minute or two for each episode with these things would help connect the audience more with the characters. And given the streaming format with bo barrier for time constraints, this is easily achieved.

And you make a good observation, and I agree with you, about the found family themes of the current era vs. the band of brothers of back then.

All such moments would be replaced by a constant arguing and bickering in the worst Stargate Universe way if DS9 was made today.

I'd actually take that over nothing at all. Because at least it's something for me to latch onto with the characters.

Plus, those arguments and conflicts can lead to growth. Or at least show us different takes about a situation and how each character would likely view other situations. Certainly would help us see how that character views things, which in itself IS a form of connecting with them.