Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 5x10 - "Life, Itself"

[fireproof78]

I actually think Trek would absolutely benefit from characters not automatically being "safe". Trek has adopted many modern prestige TV tropes, but not that one.

I do too but the popular consensus was this was bad until Discovery shows up then I see bizarre death wishes towards fictional characters like Trek had always done this before.

Imagine Trek if:

• Picard dies in Best of Both Worlds part 2.
• Spock stays dead after TWOK.
• Kirk dies in Tholian Web.
• Neelix can't be saved.
• Nog dies in the Dominion War.

Sounds very interesting.

I sometimes wonder if a somewhat darker ST series might be a good thing to try? Darker in the sense that main characters might die. Space is dangerous. Etc. But probably not. Probably best left to something else.

We had that with Tasha.

Do people like that? It would be Gene's vision after all. People can not mourn too.

 

[TimeIsAPredator]

The Trophy thread was a joke lads. Just a bit of fun and not a t all what it's being described as here.

 

[Yistaan]

I'm happy that (Michael Burnham x Cleveland Booker) got the happy ending they deserved.

Married with at least 1x Son who makes it to become a "StarFleet Captain".

President Archer: Unknown ending but he makes president.
Pike: Bad ending objectively no matter how you slice it, just hope Vina's treating him well.
Kirk: I'd say the ending wasn't great.
Picard: Maybe he's "happily" married to Crusher but I'd be wary of a woman who ghosted me for 20+ years without explanation.
Sisko: Unless he came back offscreen still a bad ending. He's mentioned in Lower Decks as still being missing as of 2381 so that's 6 years away from his family (admittedly the IDW ongoing comics, albeit noncanon, are currently ignoring this entirely)
Janeway: I don't speak French and the translated spoilers I have read aren't clear to me whether she gets a happy ending with Chakotay.

So I suppose Burnham's ending is good so far unless they derail that later on.

 

[mattman8907]

I actually think Trek would absolutely benefit from characters not automatically being "safe". Trek has adopted many modern prestige TV tropes, but not that one.

EDIT -

Small nitpick on Daneiovich... he didn't serve on "USS Enterprise". He was on "Enterprise".

The ship was rechristensened the USS enterprise after it got its refit.

 

[evilchumlee]

I sometimes wonder if a somewhat darker ST series might be a good thing to try? Darker in the sense that main characters might die. Space is dangerous. Etc. But probably not. Probably best left to something else.

I don't think it's a bad idea, but I would want it to still be true to Trek and not... too dark. Our characters are good and they're all about the ideals of the Federation and all that, BUT... people die.

S1 of PIC did that well for the most part, I thought. I know alot of people like to cry about Icheb and Hugh but I thought both were done well.

We had that with Tasha.

Do people like that? It would be Gene's vision after all. People can not mourn too.

It's all over the place. I liked Tasha's death specifically because it was kind of random and pointless. It felt... "real". It wasn't overly dramatic and signalled. It wasn't a heroic sacrifice. She just. Died.

The ship was rechristensened the USS enterprise after it got its refit.

Right, Daniels was gone by then. Unless he like, came back or something I guess.

 

[Mr Awe]

We had that with Tasha.

Do people like that? It would be Gene's vision after all. People can not mourn too.

Tasha is a bad example for something to replicate. Her death was totally meaningless with no greater point.

Having real personal stakes where bad decisions with no get out of jail card available can really amp up the tension. It makes the decisions, good and bad, more meaningful. Or, at least it can with good writing.

Tasha's death was I believe a product of both the actress wanting to leave combined with poor writing that basically got rid of her before you knew it. Although, it produced a few good character moments down the road with Data and Yesterday's Enterprise.

 

[aquova]

"Goodbye, Captain. And thank you again.

Now if you'll excuse me I need to go try out this really cool pair of horn-rimmed eyeglasses."

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I had forgotten about Daniel's goofy future uniform. As dumb as it looks, I do like how they went for something super futuristic.

 

[fireproof78]

Tasha is a bad example for something to replicate. Her death was totally meaningless with no greater point.

Having real personal stakes where bad decisions with no get out of jail card available can really amp up the tension. It makes the decisions, good and bad, more meaningful. Or, at least it can with good writing.

Tasha's death was I believe a product of both the actress wanting to leave combined with poor writing that basically got rid of her before you knew it. Although, it produced a few good character moments down the road with Data and Yesterday's Enterprise.

But, that's the thing. Not every death will have that meaning or point. That was Gene's whole point.

I don't think it's a bad idea, but I would want it to still be true to Trek and not... too dark. Our characters are good and they're all about the ideals of the Federation and all that, BUT... people die.

S1 of PIC did that well for the most part, I thought. I know alot of people like to cry about Icheb and Hugh but I thought both were done well.

I don't think it is either. I just know the reactions I've seen over the years and it's not been positive.

It's all over the place. I liked Tasha's death specifically because it was kind of random and pointless. It felt... "real". It wasn't overly dramatic and signalled. It wasn't a heroic sacrifice. She just. Died.

Which is the point, to @Mr Awe's idea. Space is dangerous and not every death is good or has a point.

The Trophy thread was a joke lads. Just a bit of fun and not a t all what it's being described as here.

It was not always.

 

[Captrek]

Right, Daniels was gone by then. Unless he like, came back or something I guess.

He like, came back or something at the end of Storm Front Part 2. Archer told him to leave Enterprise alone after that, but that doesn’t mean he did,

 

[Mr Awe]

But, that's the thing. Not every death will have that meaning or point. That was Gene's whole point.

Ok sure. But when we're talking about a series I'm watching, if the main characters are going to die, I'd prefer there's some point. Perhaps some are random, but many have a larger dramatic purpose. The possibility of characters dying really ups the stakes. As with anything, the execution (so to speak!) matters.

What Gene would've thought is really is irrelevant to me.

 

[fireproof78]

Ok sure. But when we're talking about a series I'm watching, if the main characters are going to die, I'd prefer there's some point. Perhaps some are random, but many have a larger dramatic purpose. The possibility of characters dying really ups the stakes. As with anything, the execution (so to speak!) matters.

I prefer a mix.

Some deaths have no point. That is the way of things in life, as well as in fiction.

 

[Daedalus]

Ha, Daniels, well I'll be. Not sure why they decided on that, but sure, I'll buy it.

It would've been funnier if he said "I'm just a guy, from the future...a future guy."*dramatic zoom*

Right, Daniels was gone by then. Unless he like, came back or something I guess.

He might've been on another USS Enterprise, plenty of SNW to go, right?

I'm happy that (Michael Burnham x Cleveland Booker) got the happy ending they deserved.

Married with at least 1x Son who makes it to become a "StarFleet Captain".

I would've put money on him boarding the Discovery B or Enterprise X. Good for Book, happy for the guy given all he lost.

 

[Airmandan]

pretty meh

 

[Yistaan]

It would've been funnier if he said "I'm just a guy, from the future...a future guy."*dramatic zoom*

Burnham: And Kovich is a code name meaning what?

Daniels: Keeper Of Valuable Information Causing Havoc.

 

[Nerys Myk]

You have to admit though it was surprising and brave.

Nope. Nope. And Nope

 

[cooleddie74]

"TATV...(ENT)" was everything anybody could have asked for a finale, only less.

 

[Quantum21]

Trekkies like to play it cool..."we've seen everything" now. Sometimes you just have to say: "this is great".

This was great.

I'm going to wait to rewatch for more thoughts about it, but I'm happy see the online community seems to feel the way I do about this historically great finale.

 

[cooleddie74]

Better than the Seasons 1 through 3 finales but, for me, still less impressive than the Species 10-C showdown and reveal from Season 4.

 

[Fateor]

Trekkies like to play it cool..."we've seen everything" now. Sometimes you just have to say: "this is great".

This was great.

I'm going to wait to rewatch for more thoughts about it, but I'm happy see the online community seems to feel the way I do about this historically great finale.

Using the normal way of judging online reviews by removing any 1's and 10's.

The community so far seems to feel like it's an average of around a 7/10.

 

[firehawk12]

Ha, Daniels, well I'll be. Not sure why they decided on that, but sure, I'll buy it.

It would've been funnier if he said "I'm just a guy, from the future...a future guy."*dramatic zoom*

He might've been on another USS Enterprise, plenty of SNW to go, right?


I would've put money on him boarding the Discovery B or Enterprise X. Good for Book, happy for the guy given all he lost.

I still think it'd be funny if Kovich removed his mask to reveal Riker and then it just ended with him saying "Computer, end program".

Doubly funny if it was actually revealed to be Benny Russell and that's how they get Brooks back into the franchise.