A father being willing to place the safety of their child first above all else, even to the point of implying that said child should have not taken actions that, in the father's mind, endangered the child even though said actions saved the lives of other children is not actually an unreasonable attitude to have, and it's genuinely disturbing to me to see said attitude vilified.
Umm, I am not sure what your point is? What is being villified is that Clark is essentially being told that he shouldn't be a hero. Which seems to contradict Jonathan's earlier "You need to decide who you will be" speech (which was a good one, actually... a modern way of challenging your child to be a good person without being preachy about it)
I saw nothing wrong with Jonathan's advice. Naturally he was worried about how humanity's reaction to Clark would affect the latter's emotional state. As it turned out, he had every reason to be worried. I don't recall Clark having ambitions to be a costumed vigilante.
I think the real problem is that many still want Superman to a one-note hero who always do and say the right things, instead of a complex individual or character. I find that sad.
You can be complex and struggle with being good (and even failing). The writing of MoS didn't do any of that.
The advantage of comics and TV shows is that you have time to build on that..... It is harder for movies but Captain America The First Avenger didn't delve as why Steve was a good person -- but it did
give him a journey (including time compressed montage) to successfully prove to us why he should be leader of the Avengers,
Speaking as a minority, I can say my parents never told me hiding my minority status should take precedence over letting a bunch of kids drown. That'd have been weird.
Amen to this --- what certainly i feel!
In terms of updating the Superman story.... i think the parallel to undocumented aliens should be a heck of a lot of prominent.
As you said, many of the undocmented are good people who would indeed put their "hiding their status" below saving a person's life.
(and i would suggest they also make Pete Ross a psuedenym for Pedro Rosario, whose undocumented family would help the Kent Farm... and because of his status, will be happy to keep Clark's secret.
He forgot that Clark has superspeed and could whoosh him out of there too fast for anyone to see what happened.
Did Clark even know he had superspeed at that point? I don't remmeber him knowing that in the movie.
More "unforgiveable" is how Clark was able to outpower an army of Kryptonians without real training on it. With the 70's movies, it felt like Clark had time to know himself and his powers, so that his takedown of Zod and team made sense.
Although the really unforgivable thing is that the filmmakers perpetuated the dangerous myth that you should hide from a tornado under an overpass, which concentrates the wind and debris and is the least safe place to be. That scene may have endangered real people's lives by getting that wrong, which is grossly irresponsible and far worse than any character assassination. Worse, Superman & Lois made the exact same mistake in its season 3 finale.
Maybe to you...but most "normal" people wouldn't care -- it's part of the conceit of this type of fiction.
Its vilified because some continue to buy into the ever-ridiculous notion that a child is born to be some propagandized soldier / daddy figure from birth, completely ignoring that any loving, real world father warns children who are different than the dominant society about the abuse and expected evil he would face from said society. As a member of a minority group, I have and always will find that conscious shoving aside of the meaning behind Jonathan's advice patently offensive. Any other advice is cartoony, PSA nonsense which makes the character impossible to relate to with what should be his core identity ans how he faces humans.
Well put. Some are still bending at the knee to Weisinger, who--in endless retelling of Superman's origin--had Clark as an out-of-the-box "hero" who lacked a lived identity (which is not those 50,000 "tales from Krypton" / the ghost of Superman's parents" published voyages into inanity) to the degree which would give Pa Kent pause before sending his son out as some idealized weapon.
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Where do you get this from??
There are plenty of "good" people --- from firefighters, to to nurses to social workers.
it's that type of person we want Clark to be -- and how we expect the Kents to raise him.
There's definitely dangers...see my comments about how the Undocumented situation could certainly be a part of the modernization.
Also, MoS actually had a
great way to show why Clark would be a Superhero....but sabotaged it.
When they had Ma Kent help teach Clark to use his powers...it reminded me of therapists for special needs kids.
What
should have been done was then have Martha decide to become a
professional therapist. Then as an adult, have Clark come in, and see his mom wrap up a session, ending with the client giving her a hug, and Clark telling Martha "you're my hero".
Maybe that sounds too 50's "Golly gee willickers" to you....but i think that would perfectly demonstrate why Clark would become a superhero, and care about "normal" people, or really, the vulnerable.
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Exactly, and its that lack of realistic complexity that played a role in the quick fall of the Salkinds' Superman films, and the worshipful Singer film .
the Salkind's films were a product of the 70's, where even the Incredible Hulk was relatively a simple formula.... We can definitely grow beyond that... but the personalities that Christopher Reeve and Lynda Carter exuded.... many want to see a remnant of that in there. I think that is one reason why people embraced Gal Gadot as Wonder Woman. (And really could have embraced Henry Cavill, if he had better writing).
So, I guess this thread should now be titled
DC Movies - From 1941 to 2012 and From 2021 Onwards ONLY 
Well, I guess thats what we all get for posting on what is apparently one person's personal social media page. What did we think TrekBBS was, a public discussion forum? What a ridiculous notion.
Well, there
was a thread about DC movies until 2020 (too lazy to find and post the link), but this one was created but it
seemed like this would parallel the MCU in longeviity.
We are in this weird place where we haven't quite ended the DC Film Universe (we are waiting to see if the next 2 will carry over, or end like Flash), but are still long awaiting the DC Omni Universe.
Kai brings up a fair point though, we've been through this conversation literally dozens of times, if not hundreds, since MoS came out, and it plays out the exact same every time with the mostly the same posters saying the same things every time. It really is just getting pointless and repetitive and distracts from other more recent developments with the DC movies.
See above
I mean, Kai is making a fair point. And the Henry Cavil/Zack Snyder Superman films are over. That version of Superman is never coming back. At what point does repeating the same debate endlessly cease to have any purpose?
Maybe there will be lessons that be learned and applied so we get a different result.
Or maybe we can find our selves vindicated when proven right. Finally.
We debate everything endlessly.
Including this.
Indeed
