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Lost Sulu scene from Trek 4

G

Grant

Commodore
Commodore
Regarding the lost scene of Sulu and his ancestor played by a child actor who didn't work out.....

While they were trying to get the kid to perform did they shoot the "coverage" shots of Takei with the camera on him saying his lines? I wonder if using today's technology they could complete the scene by combining old footage of Takei with a new young actor. Not they would ever bother to do such a thing because it would be rather pointless except as a curiosity like the original "memory wall" sequence from Trek 1 being assembled. From the script........



The rest of the crew having spread out per Kirk's
instructions, are waiting as A YOUNG JAPANESE BOY
passes Sulu, does a double take and comes up to him.
The scene will be played IN JAPANESE with English
sub-titles.

THE BOY
(in wonder)
Ojichan? Akira ojichaan dewa naino?
Koko de nani shiteru no?
(translation)
(Uncle Akira?! Is that you? What
are you doing here?)

SULU
(in classical Japanese)
Gomen nasarei. Hito chigai de
gozaranuka na.
(translation)
I'm sorry, my son. You have mis-
taken me for someone else.

THE BOY
Ah, chigaau hito da. Hanashi kata ga
okashii.
(translation)
Yes, this must be true. You talk
funny.

He starts to back away apologetically but Sulu stops him.

SULU
Chotto omachi nasarei. Namae
wa nanto moosareruka na.
(translation)
Wait my son. What is your name?

THE BOY
Sulu Hikaru.

SULU
(visibly moved)
Ah, sorenara mazu mazu nagaiki wo
sareru to mira.
(translation)
Ah... Then I am sure that you will
have a long and happy life.

THE BOY
Arigato. Sayonara.
(translation)
Thank you, honorable sir.

The boy departs and Bones steps to Sulu.

BONES
Who was that?

SULU
That, Doctor, was my great
great grandfather.





Additional lost scenes I'd love to see is the "Climbing Mt. Seleya" and "Hall of Ancient Thought" scenes from Trek 3. In the movie they land look up the mountain and then bam they are at the top. They shot the "climb" with the little girl giving the Vulcan salute and verbal greeting and then the "Hall" but they felt the hall didn't look real enough to keep in. With today's technology they could finish the FX so we could get a look at what they wanted it to be. Nimoy even laments that missing shot in his trek 3 commentary. From Memory Alpha........
Deleted scene | Memory Alpha | Fandom
 
Interesting. But why would Sulu know classical Japanese and not the modern language? Maybe the idea was that 20th-century Japanese was archaic compared to the 23rd-century version, and he was trying to adjust to the era and overshot by a few centuries, like trying to use Shakespearean English in the Victorian Era.


Grant said:
THE BOY
Arigato. Sayonara.
(translation)
Thank you, honorable sir.
Click to expand...

This is weird, and kind of wince-inducing, because "honorable sir" is an outdated Western stereotype of how Japanese people talk. (I think the "honorable" was a stilted attempt to interpret the -san honorific.) My guess is that the screenwriter wrote the lines in English and a translator added the Japanese translation to the script. But there is no way to translate "honorable sir" into Japanese, because there is no generic Japanese title that corresponds to "sir/ma'am." If anything, the boy would probably just switch from Oji-chan to Oji-san, because "Uncle" is used as a polite address for any man moderately older than the speaker. But that would've confused the audience, so the translator just substituted "Goodbye."


My Japanese is mediocre at best, but I can recognize some other lines where they had to change the Japanese from the scripted dialogue:

Grant said:
SULU
(in classical Japanese)
Gomen nasarei. Hito chigai de
gozaranuka na.
(translation)
I'm sorry, my son. You have mis-
taken me for someone else.

THE BOY
Ah, chigaau hito da. Hanashi kata ga
okashii.
(translation)
Yes, this must be true. You talk
funny.
Click to expand...

There's no "my son" in the Japanese; the closest thing I can think of would be boku, "boy." Sulu's line is actually "Pardon me. I am a different man." The boy replies "Ah, you are a different man. Your way of speaking is strange."


Then, of course, there's the improbabiity of "Sulu" as a Japanese surname. Also, why would a young Japanese boy in San Francisco be speaking Japanese instead of English, unless he's a recent immigrant? Well, maybe he just assumes Akira-ojichan would speak Japanese, and since Sulu responded in Japanese, neither of them realized they could just switch to English.
 
Grant said:
Regarding the lost scene of Sulu and his ancestor played by a child actor who didn't work out.....

While they were trying to get the kid to perform did they shoot the "coverage" shots of Takei with the camera on him saying his lines?
Click to expand...

Supposedly it was late in the day, the light was fading, and the shooting of the scene was abandoned.

Grant said:
They shot the "climb" with the little girl giving the Vulcan salute and verbal greeting
Click to expand...

A friend of mine from Sydney was in Perth, Western Australia, for the ST III premiere, and swears she saw the scene with the young Vulcan girl (Katherine Blum in the closing credits) that night, but no one else I know in Perth have remembered it that way.

Mandela Effect.
 
Right, but I meant that in the meantime while trying to get the child to perform it would have made sense to shoot the coverage shots of Takei -- closeups, single shots and the shots of Sulu talking to McCoy about the child. There was more to shooting the scene than just to master shots of the two of them and closeups of the kid. I thought they would "shoot around" him while trying to cajole him. I guess we'll never know,
 
I always found the scene would have been a poor inclusion in the film. I mean, his ancestor "recognizes" Sulu? The odds would be fairly illogical, and pretty lame. Nimoy likely would have cut it anyway. I felt bad for George's sake, because he wasn't given very much to do in that film.
 
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Grizzlor said:
I always found the scene would have been a poor inclusion in the film. I mean, his ancestor "recognizes" Sulu? The odds would be fairly illogical, and pretty lame.
Click to expand...

It's not so implausible. People often bear a family resemblance to their ancestors. Especially in fiction -- just look at the Soong family.


I felt bad for George's sake, because he wasn't given very much to do in that film.
Click to expand...

Yeah, he was the one who lost the most of his material in the final cut. Not just the ancestor scene, but the scene where he stole the helicopter.
 
Christopher said:
It's not so implausible. People often bear a family resemblance to their ancestors. Especially in fiction -- just look at the Soong family.
Click to expand...

did spit take on that one, ha ha ha!!! :biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:


Christopher said:
Yeah, he was the one who lost the most of his material in the final cut. Not just the ancestor scene, but the scene where he stole the helicopter.
Click to expand...

Wasn't the helicopter scene included on the broadcast version? Or perhaps even "restored" on the director's cuts?
 
No. He did not steal the helicopter in the shooting script perhaps in the novelization but in the script he definitely did not steal the helicopter. Logically that was part of the deal that got them all the expensive plexiglass. They traded the formula for transparent aluminum for the plexiglass and the helicopter to deliver it where they needed it.
 
Dukhat said:
The scene was in the comic book adaptation. Perhaps that's what she was remembering.
Click to expand...

The thing is, the comic adaptation was hard to come by here. The movie itself was delayed six months Down Under. She wasn’t a comic collector.

But yes, extra scenes in novelizations, comics and trailers are often responsible for the Mandela Effect.

Grizzlor said:
Wasn't the helicopter scene included on the broadcast version? Or perhaps even "restored" on the director's cuts?
Click to expand...

Sulu in the helicopter yes, and the windscreen wipers scene, but not how he obtained it.

There was no TV version of ST III.
 
Last edited:
Did the Sulu and ancestor scene ever progress beyond the initial screenplay?

I definitely remember it from the novel for STIV (based on the screenplay, usually a very early version)
 
I recall reading some comment by Takei down the years that this was filmed, but the child asked to be Sulu's ancestor wasn't gifted in saying dialogue. It was an extension of the Yellow Pages sight gag moment and editing to linger on that, instead of talking to Japanese local shouting at her son while exiting the door, probably felt right to Nimoy. Like the lady asked about "Nuclear Wessels", they filmed guerrilla-style and asked permission of residents and passers-by after. So maybe it couldn't be used because of complications to do with that.
 
Last edited:
Ar-Pharazon said:
Did the Sulu and ancestor scene ever progress beyond the initial screenplay?

I definitely remember it from the novel for STIV (based on the screenplay, usually a very early version)
Click to expand...

The child actor was cast and was on set, but it's unsure if they ever filmed anything with him...even a performance that wasn't good.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E3eQrGuUUAArxKa.jpg

There's another picture with Takei and the child I've seen but can't find it now.

From Memory Alpha "According to William Shatner's Star Trek Movie Memories, the scene was an idea pitched to Harve Bennett by George Takei, who was delighted when he discovered the scene was to be shot. However, when it came time to film the scene, the child they hired to play the role of Sulu's great-great-great grandfather was not a professional actor, and his mother was on set, causing the child to be extremely nervous. Consequently, they couldn't get anything done with the boy and eventually they had to move on."
 
They probably should have gone with a slightly older actor who had a couple of small roles under his belt. The kid froze up big time after his mom yelled at him.
 
Grant said:
Regarding the lost scene of Sulu and his ancestor played by a child actor who didn't work out.....

While they were trying to get the kid to perform did they shoot the "coverage" shots of Takei with the camera on him saying his lines? I wonder if using today's technology they could complete the scene by combining old footage of Takei with a new young actor. Not they would ever bother to do such a thing because it would be rather pointless except as a curiosity like the original "memory wall" sequence from Trek 1 being assembled. From the script........



The rest of the crew having spread out per Kirk's
instructions, are waiting as A YOUNG JAPANESE BOY
passes Sulu, does a double take and comes up to him.
The scene will be played IN JAPANESE with English
sub-titles.

THE BOY
(in wonder)
Ojichan? Akira ojichaan dewa naino?
Koko de nani shiteru no?
(translation)
(Uncle Akira?! Is that you? What
are you doing here?)

SULU
(in classical Japanese)
Gomen nasarei. Hito chigai de
gozaranuka na.
(translation)
I'm sorry, my son. You have mis-
taken me for someone else.

THE BOY
Ah, chigaau hito da. Hanashi kata ga
okashii.
(translation)
Yes, this must be true. You talk
funny.

He starts to back away apologetically but Sulu stops him.

SULU
Chotto omachi nasarei. Namae
wa nanto moosareruka na.
(translation)
Wait my son. What is your name?

THE BOY
Sulu Hikaru.

SULU
(visibly moved)
Ah, sorenara mazu mazu nagaiki wo
sareru to mira.
(translation)
Ah... Then I am sure that you will
have a long and happy life.

THE BOY
Arigato. Sayonara.
(translation)
Thank you, honorable sir.

The boy departs and Bones steps to Sulu.

BONES
Who was that?

SULU
That, Doctor, was my great
great grandfather.





Additional lost scenes I'd love to see is the "Climbing Mt. Seleya" and "Hall of Ancient Thought" scenes from Trek 3. In the movie they land look up the mountain and then bam they are at the top. They shot the "climb" with the little girl giving the Vulcan salute and verbal greeting and then the "Hall" but they felt the hall didn't look real enough to keep in. With today's technology they could finish the FX so we could get a look at what they wanted it to be. Nimoy even laments that missing shot in his trek 3 commentary. From Memory Alpha........
Deleted scene | Memory Alpha | Fandom
Click to expand...

Thats Interesting
 
It's kind of weird that in all of San Francisco he bumps into his ancestor. I would rather have more of Sulu talking to that helicopter pilot or learning how to fly it or something. But poor George getting two of his film scenes bumped. :D
 
somebuddyX said:
It's kind of weird that in all of San Francisco he bumps into his ancestor.
Click to expand...

Maybe not. We're talking 300 years, maybe 25 years per generation, that's 12 generations. If he has two parents, four grandparents, eight great-grandparents, etc., then 12 generations ago he'd have 2^12 direct ancestors, or 4096 people. Or... no, wait, that wouldn't work, because the boy shares his surname, and presumably only one ancestor in each generation would pass a patrilineal surname to the next one. (Which just underlines how silly it is to define ancestry patrilineally, because the farther back you go, the smaller a fraction of your ancestry it represents.)

Still, it's somewhat justified in that they were roving around the city streets searching for whatever, so they probably walked past thousands of people.
 
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