Indeed. Asshole kids/teens have never been too endearing to audiences, which is why I found the animated Teen Titans Robin (Cartoon Network) annoying to no end.
DC Movies - To Infinity and Beyond
- Thread starter dahj
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Indeed. Asshole kids/teens have never been too endearing to audiences, which is why I found the animated Teen Titans Robin (Cartoon Network) annoying to no end.
Gunn has said some things that do seem to suggest that:
https://deadline.com/2023/01/dc-mov...-batman-swamp-thing-green-lantern-1235244926/
Granted that "lead into" is a little vague, though "connected to" is less so. Either way, it certainly sounds to me like there's a possibility Superman will be linked to, and perhaps even appear in, the Authority film.
I have less stomach for that sort of thing for Waller than for mobsters and assassins because there's no serious strain of thought that assassination or mob activity are acceptable. Meanwhile, there are too many people who genuinely believe the government needs to sometimes do the 'hard' thing for the greater good.
And it's all well and good to say a story isn't actually supporting the protagonist's behavior, it doesn't make that much difference if it's giving the behavior the gloss of cool and sexy, which still does its part in glorifying it.
True, but that can be challenged by a story that centers on a character who believes that, and then showing how their attempt to do that ends up having harmful consequences rather than good ones. Of course, a lot of people will be too closed-minded to get that message, but all creators can do is try their best to get the idea across to the people who are willing to see it.
Of course. As always, it comes down to the choices made in the execution. For any subject matter, any category of story, there are ways to do it well and ways to do it badly. Although, of course, for every right way to put the pieces together, there are uncountable wrong ways. Which is why entropy happens.
I'm just saying that Amanda Waller plus Viola Davis has the potential to be really good, if it's done right. As with Patrick Stewart as Professor X, this is a case where my ideal head casting for a comics character ended up actually happening. What we've gotten so far has not begun to scratch the surface of that potential, unfortunately (at least in what I've seen, which does not include Peacemaker). I'm just hoping that a Waller focus series could do better with the character and be more worthy of the actress. But that, of course, does not guarantee that it will.
I don't personally see anything in that quote that automatically says 'Superman will be in The Authority', particularly given the emphasis that Gunn has put on the team's origins in Wildstorm, but time will tell.
The interest in Waller as a character study is in the bridge someone will eventually cross to see and believe in the "benefits" of what some might describe as government abuse (whether legally sanctioned or not). Why she's modified (or abandoned) whatever moral codes she had pre-job position into supporting the extremes of her job is fascinating--certainly more than the typical conquer-the_________-type villain (see: Thanos, for one example).
Some of the most endlessly interesting real world testimony comes from former government actors who reveal the why of their actions beyond "its the job"; it paints a far different picture than just the cardboard "evil government" type poor writers continue to use. Black Lightning's Percy Odell was a case of a government actor who appeared immoral, but the seeds of of his actions spoke to a more compelling person behind the villain, so depth and reasoning can be achieved with such characters. The DCEU was moving in that direction with Waller, but it was brought to an end, so its reboot time again, and one can only hope a healthy part of her story--the why--will be explored, and not simply end up as some 20-minute prologue, but how she grows into the position.
I wonder is it entirely coincidental that James Mangold has tweeted a pic of Swamp Thing the day after the big announcements https://twitter.com/mang0ld/status/1620686622152077313?s=46&t=M6cMrO1cnz2qt0zU-mQfKQ
I'm sure he's just a fan.
Derp. I stand corrected.
Other than a few vax fundementalists, i think most people at THIS point, don't actually care. Practically no one i see on TV is wearing a mask, and basically acting pre-pandemic. I think the main problem is that Ant Man will have come out the month before -- people might not be ready tospend money on a suerhero movie that quickly
Am i the only one who feels this comment is part of a lowlevel misogynistic behavior? (i.e. dehumanizing women to how they look)I'm not sure what to make of the idea of the Amazon prequel series being "Game of Thrones-ish." If that means it's grim, dark, and ultraviolent, I'm not on board. On the other hand, if it means it'll have lots of sex and nudity on an all-female island, then I'm all for it.
NO, i think it is strategic, influenced by Zaslav. The last 2 have movies YET to come out. Based on the interviews, it sounds like if Auqaman 2 ALSO becomes a bliion dollar blockbuster, Zaslav will want to hold on to Jason Maoa as Aquaman and squeeze out that money befor ehe gets a chance to be Lobo.
As for Ezra Miller... with all the money they sunk into it, a tax writeoff ain't an option. They won't say a bad word about the movie or actor (in fact Gunn literally hyping it as one of the best Superhero movies ever) . They will wait until the movie has made the most money they can before quietly putting away Ezra Miller and moving on.
At least early on, but even now,
The thing is, even if it is really good, i just don't seeBatgirl being so popular that it will keep rolling wiht free postive publicity or adding more subscribers the way Game of Thrones House of the Dragon is doing for HBOMax.
A movie release is the only way to make itnot worth a loss. And the fact that they shelved it already, as well as erasing the significance of DCFU appearances, makes it hard to get it to be marketable, at least to a level where it makes sense financially. If the rule of twice the movie budget is needed JUST to break even, I can see why they are willing to take the tax write off loss. And really, they haven't spent any money on marketing, the math can make sense (unfortunately).
The original DC Film Universe could have started it like this waaaay back then. They had the characters, they just needed to have the confidence to go with a film that felt like SUperman along with their changes.
As goofy as Peacemaker was, they did begin that process with Waller and her daughter. The Waller show might do the serious take on those relationships (minus PEacemaker)
And my take on the news
“Superman: Legacy” - this feels like this is the way to please Zaslav's demands. As i inetrpret the interviews, Gunn definitely agrees with all of us (even most of those with issues how the DCFU got started) that Cavill got the shaft, and was a good actor to be cast. In my opinion, there were parts that were poorly written/directed, and the reason why Man of Steel wasn't a bllion dollar movie, and that deflated momentum.
“The Authority” - I guess i am not clear if this is part of the the new DCOU or not. (This came out after i stopped collecting comics). It kinda ffels like Black Adam in a sense... "anti-heroes" that could eventually fight the Justice League. SOmething DC could have had before Marvel is ighting a villain team, but i think Secret Wars will beat them to it.
“The Brave and the Bold” - Damian sounds reasonable ... having Batman with his actual son, as opposed to putting an unrelated kid in danger, seems "less controversial". Also, Batman can still be in his mid-to late 30's for this to work. it's still messy with Pattinson's Batman
“Supergirl: Woman of Tomorrow” --sounds like Argo City won't survive? Again, this might be messy depending on how it goes with The Flash.
“Swamp Thing” - Um, OK. Feels a little early for this, but it definitely will attract non-superhero people.
“Creature Commandos” - This feels like itis a way to get non DC fans into the DCOU. They can severe it if needed. This also feels like This is Gunn's way of beginning to integrate his Suicide Squad into the new universe. People had already commented on what they felt was favoritism (keeping Gunn's work while dumping Cavill), so i think this will be Gunn's way of brining his characters back in a subtle way
“Waller” Ditto on what I said, especially with these quotes = “They are crushing it,” Safran said of Henry and Carver’s work on “Waller.” “It’s just the greatest show ever,” Gunn added.
“Lanterns” - i know everyone remmebers Green Lantern movie as a failure... but for me, that first half on Oa felt Cosmic, and excactly how GL should be shown. It was the Earth based 2nd half, with no other Lanterns and villain like RIse of Silver Surfer's Galactus, that killed it. And really, JOhn Stewart is needed. The diversity is needed, and was one of the good things about the Snyderverse.
“Paradise Lost” -- this just feels wrong. This is the origin of PAradise Island, right? i know it was a hard journey... but i don'tsee how this will work? I just hope they can still use Gal Gadot. She was an awesome Wonder Woman, and it is a waste to end her WW career.
“Booster Gold” -- this can be fun, and can make sense for a TV show. But i feel like this would be lower budget, but a venue for various DCOU appearances to help with interconnectivity.
Reading Gunn's thoughts on what happened with the previous regime.... there is a lot of truth, but i fesr Zaslav's demands is going to make this a rough sell.
Peacemaker season 2 is still on the way? I hope so. I really enjoyed season one.
I thought it was on hold, with the Waller show in its place?
definitely not immediately, while Gunn has Guardians 3 and the new-new-new SUperman to do first. But i am sure there is stuff being planned...just not announced, because it would be a bad look, especially with Cavill now officially out.
I think they might wait until Flash and maybe even Aquaman comes out before any new Peacemaker announcements come out. Maybe when they film Waller they might do some Peacemaker stuff there too.
That's been a consistent message since even before all the James Gunn business. I don't really get how you spend that much money and make something that wouldn't work at all on the big screen or what that even means exactly. Maybe it wasn't *blockbuster* enough or I don't know. I could see if it was like some CW show or something but if they are writing off $90 million on this thing?
A budget of $90 million is in the range of a single season of a modern cable or streaming show. It's less than half the budget of a DC theatrical feature these days.
There's also the question of what the money is spent on. Superhero movies these days are expected to be full of huge, extended CGI action set pieces. Maybe the action in the Batgirl movie was on a smaller scale, more the level of something like Arrow or Daredevil.
Don't forget, they have to also pay for marketing which the rule of thumb is the same as the movie budget. And the mo movie needs to make all that back just to break even.
There's a good chance it won't. With the tax break, they are looking at losing $70 million.
Different priorities.
The regime that commissioned Batgirl was looking to move away from a filmic business model that nigh-exclusively prioritized the Theatrical Release strategy, whereas the regime that replaced them sees no reason to not continue prioritizing the Theatrical Release strategy.
I would actually like to see them include Jason, but only to have him as Red Hood, and that's primarily because I see it as an interesting way to add some dramatic tension to Damian's character arc. He comes to Bruce very much a product of the League of Shadows, but is it too late for Bruce to show him another way? Does he end up good, like Dick/Nightwing, or... not so good, like Jason/Red Hood?