Vulcan society is really horrifying when you think about it

[Nerys Myk]

I heard it both ways.

Surak- Father of Vulcan philosophy
Sarek- Father of Spock.

 

[WarpTenLizard]

What really has me questioning Vulcan society is the Romulans. Originally they were the Vulcans who gave into their volatile emotions, and as a result were a society of war-mongers. But TNG-onward has softened them to a point that Romulans don't seem inherently any more violent than Vulcans. And many can apparently still perform mind-melds and all the other things Vilcans can, without suppressing their emotions. It's starting to seem like the Vulcans are just overreacting to ordinary emotions.

 

[Nerys Myk]

What really has me questioning Vulcan society is the Romulans. Originally they were the Vulcans who gave into their volatile emotions, and as a result were a society of war-mongers. But TNG-onward has softened them to a point that Romulans don't seem inherently any more violent than Vulcans. And many can apparently still perform mind-melds and all the other things Vilcans can, without suppressing their emotions. It's starting to seem like the Vulcans are just overreacting to ordinary emotions.

The first Romulans we meet are a couple of guys tired of war and one glory seeking suck up. The Commander is a nice enough fellow who Kirk feels could have been a friend in other circumstances. The next time we see them ( as opposed to stock footage), they're still militaristic but not exactly war mongering. The Federation is kind of in the wrong in that one. What with the espionage, deceit and technology theft.
The Praetor at that time seems to want a war and is testing the Federation's defenses, but following the events of BOT, apparently changes his mind. He and the Empire seem content to remain behind their own borders. Only acting when someone provokes them.

 

[cooleddie74]

The Romulan ships in "The Deadly Years(TOS)" only show up after Commodore Stocker takes the Enterprise into the Neutral Zone so it's not as if the Star Empire attacked the Federation outpost on Gamma Hydra IV. That was wiped out by the hyperaccelerated aging disease.

 

[fireproof78]

What really has me questioning Vulcan society is the Romulans. Originally they were the Vulcans who gave into their volatile emotions, and as a result were a society of war-mongers. But TNG-onward has softened them to a point that Romulans don't seem inherently any more violent than Vulcans. And many can apparently still perform mind-melds and all the other things Vilcans can, without suppressing their emotions. It's starting to seem like the Vulcans are just overreacting to ordinary emotions.

Sure but a society of war mongers can only go so far. The Romulans utilized duty to the state above all else as their form of logic, sublimating their volatile emotions in to loyalty to the Empire, channeling intensity in to combat ability and subterfuge.

 

[Henoch]

One would think that the Romulans are now like the 20th Century Soviet Union, and not U-Boat Nazi's anymore...wait long enough and they might become isolationist China for a hundred years...

 

[Nerys Myk]

One would think that the Romulans are now like the 20th Century Soviet Union, and not U-Boat Nazi's anymore...wait long enough and they might become isolationist China for a hundred years...

Well, they were North Korea for that one episode.

 

[Voodoowoman2]

Australia has recently announced that anyone who does not subscribe to the current "scientific" view of Climate Change ideology is to be labeled as mentally ill. Think about that. It isn't just religions that do this. It is political ideologies as well.

 

[Voodoowoman2]

Given that their civilization almost nuked itself into oblivion barely 2,000 years before TOS and as late as ENT was still dealing with the absence of Surak's full teachings until the discovery of the Kir'Shara in 2154(thus still displaying some very retrograde and at times violent behavior to outsiders) I'm sort of glad they adopted the stoicism of logic and used it to turn their world into a harbor for scientific exploration and monastic studies.

We know what Vulcans before the time of Surak were like (Spock's regression in "All Our Yesterdays(TOS)" and the way the Romulans typically behave) so it's probably in the best interests of the Vulcan people that they found a way to channel their aggressive behavioral patterns into things more constructive and peaceful, even if that meant many Vulcans never fully expressed their love for those they cared deeply about.

I have my theories on the beast inside Vulcans. I think it is a separate entity. That is Vulcan's big secret.

 

[Kor]

Perhaps it could even be described as the secret of.... Vulcan Fury, to coin a phrase.

Australia has recently announced that anyone who does not subscribe to the current "scientific" view of Climate Change ideology is to be labeled as mentally ill. Think about that. It isn't just religions that do this. It is political ideologies as well.

Not to derail the discussion, but... my understanding is that an outspoken Australian news anchor made an unfavorable report on a small study by one psychologist that reached such a conclusion. That's hardly an official declaration or announcement.

Kor

 

[Voodoowoman2]

I'm going to give Vulcan a pass on Amok Time. The Pon Farr drives the males to fight to the death for a mate. It is biological and they can't change it. It's like blaming elephants for going into their breeding season where the males do the same thing. My problem is the Vulcans of Enterprise who are Machiavellian, scheming, tyrannical and false.

 

[Farscape One]

Given how super secretive Spock was about his own family to his very closest friends... brothers in everything but blood... and how secretive Vulcans are about the pon farr, I actually think ENTERPRISE did a good job of portraying Vulcans as secretive and somewhat Machiavellian.

The arrogance was definitely in full throttle there, but as I have mentioned in the past, it's not surprising because Vulcans are:

1. Supremely intelligent.
2. Stronger than a LOT of other humanoids.
3. Live a VERY long time, so long that retiring at 200 seems 'young' for them.

I'd say their arrogance is somewhat deserved. (I personally don't like arrogance, but I can see why the Vulcans are.)

 

[Greg Cox]

Given how super secretive Spock was about his own family to his very closest friends... brothers in everything but blood... and how secretive Vulcans are about the pon farr, I actually think ENTERPRISE did a good job of portraying Vulcans as secretive and somewhat Machiavellian.)

Spock gets that from his dad, who hid a serious heart condition from his own wife.

The Vulcans have always held their cards close to their chest.

 

[cooleddie74]

Even Michael didn't mention Sybok as being part of her family and she's HUMAN. So the Vulcan tradition of keeping things confidential until the right moment for a reveal is something that extends even to those who aren't of their species.

 

[fireproof78]

Even Michael didn't mention Sybok as being part of her family and she's HUMAN. So the Vulcan tradition of keeping things confidential until the right moment for a reveal is something that extends even to those who aren't of their species.

Sybok strikes me as a person who values control. Controlling information is one the highest forms of that desire.

I think the Vulcans in Enterprise were of a similar idea-humanity was brand new on the stage, jumping out in to things it knew nothing about and the Vulcans struggled with not being able to control them. Interestingly enough, the Vulcans in ENT were a bit like the Talosians in the Cage.

 

[Ronald Held]

Secrecy is a Vulcan cultural norm, not biologically driven.