"Such men dare take what they want..."--Khan: Sexy or creepy?
- Thread starter Neopeius
- Start date
Definitely, incontestably true. However, I have to say . . . well, there's some early (and very good) Star Trek novel in which Kirk is having a frank debriefing with some junior officer (probably an audience substitute who was the de facto protagonist) about a serious communication problem between the two of them. I don't remember the novel or the author, but one terrific line has stuck with me for decades and decades. The junior officer gives her perspective, and as Kirk silently realizes just how wrong he has been about the whole thing, the narrator says something like (paraphrasing) "Kirk marveled at the infinite capacity for misunderstanding in the universe." I always expanded that in my head to the infinite capacity for differing opinions. IDIC, one might say, if one were selling merch/trinkets.
I mean, *both* Shatner and Nimoy overshadowed in charisma, for the length of the series, by Montalban in just about every role he ever played?? To say nothing of Doohan, Kelley, and the others? Well . . . it's certainly a very interesting viewpoint. I admire it.
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Honestly I never found many of the Star Trek men attractive either. Definitely none of the TOS or TNG crews.
On DS9, I do say I think Sisko is rather attractive, and Bashir would be hot if it wasn't for his personality.
On Voyager I suppose Tom isn't bad.
But that's it. I personally never understood the heaps of attention Kirk, Spock or Riker got either. But that's just my personal taste. People find different traits attractive.
Wenn it comes to new Trek, however;
On SNW however I do think Pike is very handsome (only on SNW, not his Cage incarnation). And even though he's a cartoon character, I have a bit of a thing for Rutherford.
McIvers painted a painting of Khan after she met Khan.
Are we sure?
What if McIvers painted a painting of Khan before she met Khan.
She didn't just fall in love with him.
She had already been in love with Khan for years.
Weirder stuff has happened.
Are we sure?
What if McIvers painted a painting of Khan before she met Khan.
She didn't just fall in love with him.
She had already been in love with Khan for years.
Weirder stuff has happened.
Given that the episode's action seems to take place over perhaps three days, I agree that was some fast (and pretty good) painting if she didn't already have it in her catalog.
Living with a (Hugo Finalist!!!!) artist, I can tell you that such work is perfectly feasible.
That's so fascinating to me. Anson Mount is the worst part of SNW for me. Smarm and bland in one milquetoast package.
But Picard climbing those chains in First Contact, biceps rippling? <fans self>
Living with a (Hugo Finalist!!!!) artist, I can tell you that such work is perfectly feasible.
No kidding! That's awesome.
And frankly, this is another example of why I love this board. It had never occurred to me that McGivers might have painted Khan before the encounter. But I guess that's because the command staff seemed to have so much difficulty identifying him with the bleeping computer (another of the episode's massive flaws that it somehow makes up for). It seems unlikely that she figured out who he was when they couldn't. Plus, there's that bit where she says (not checking the transcript, memory only) "I know exactly you who are" and somesuch, and Montalban has this nice reaction shot where he looks alarmed, and then he relaxes when he realizes that she just means that he's a man *like* Leif Erikson, not a more contemporary example of the same sort of character.
I don't think the dialogue in that exchange bears close examination, but I'm pretty sure we were supposed to believe that McGivers was just as slow as management in identifying Khan. (They had similar trouble not too long before with a far more recent vanished miscreant in Kodos, after all.) So she probably did the painting during the period covered by the episode.
No kidding! That's awesome.
And frankly, this is another example of why I love this board. It had never occurred to me that McGivers might have painted Khan before the encounter. But I guess that's because the command staff seemed to have so much difficulty identifying him with the bleeping computer (another of the episode's massive flaws that it somehow makes up for). It seems unlikely that she figured out who he was when they couldn't. Plus, there's that bit where she says (not checking the transcript, memory only) "I know exactly you who are" and somesuch, and Montalban has this nice reaction shot where he looks alarmed, and then he relaxes when he realizes that she just means that he's a man *like* Leif Erikson, not a more contemporary example of the same sort of character.
I don't think the dialogue in that exchange bears close examination, but I'm pretty sure we were supposed to believe that McGivers was just as slow as management in identifying Khan. (They had similar trouble not too long before with a far more recent vanished miscreant in Kodos, after all.) So she probably did the painting during the period covered by the episode.
Consider how isolated and lonely Marla is/was.
An Earth Historian in deep space.
She sits in a room by her self waiting for the Captain to find a reason for her to be of service to the ship.
Unless McIvers studied history and engineering, she's not even had the training to work in security, which is 90 percent standing in front of doorway waiting to be murdered.
I doubt the ship had historians on board before they "invented" time travel.
Although they found a Greek historian on board that time they met Apollo.
Maybe they are Engineers who minored in History at College?
Given that McGivers, Palamas, and Mulhall all wore red instead of blue, that suggests that anthropology/archaeology/history/astrobiology are not under the blue "sciences/medical" umbrella. Three instances is way too consistent to be a costuming fluke.
Astrobiology is more a fluke since we have biologists who do wear blue. On the other hand, at the time, study of extraterrestrial life was more commonly "exobiology" -- it may be that astrobiology deals with alien cultures than internal processes.
If we go with that, and don't try to assume some technical main job for these red-shirts, then rank is probably more indicative of education than time in service. Sort of like how doctors get commissioned as Majors in the army.
How's this for a fun: After "Miri", when the possibility of finding other Earths with Earth history, Kirk recquisitioned (or was assigned) an historian. One who proved singularly useless until "Space Seed" (and then remained pretty useless...)
Astrobiology is more a fluke since we have biologists who do wear blue. On the other hand, at the time, study of extraterrestrial life was more commonly "exobiology" -- it may be that astrobiology deals with alien cultures than internal processes.
If we go with that, and don't try to assume some technical main job for these red-shirts, then rank is probably more indicative of education than time in service. Sort of like how doctors get commissioned as Majors in the army.
How's this for a fun: After "Miri", when the possibility of finding other Earths with Earth history, Kirk recquisitioned (or was assigned) an historian. One who proved singularly useless until "Space Seed" (and then remained pretty useless...)
Ah sh*t.
It’s quite likely some officers have more than one role or specialty.
Lt. Charlene Masters worked in Engineering and yet she also wore blue. Uhura briefly wore gold early on.
Lt. Commander Anne Mulhaul wore red, but it was never specified what section she was in. She didn’t impress as someone connected to Security. She could have been connected to any of the Engineering and Support departments. With the rank of Lt. Cmdr. she could even have been an assistant Chief Engineer after the possible departure of Lt. DeSalle.
Lt. Charlene Masters worked in Engineering and yet she also wore blue. Uhura briefly wore gold early on.
Lt. Commander Anne Mulhaul wore red, but it was never specified what section she was in. She didn’t impress as someone connected to Security. She could have been connected to any of the Engineering and Support departments. With the rank of Lt. Cmdr. she could even have been an assistant Chief Engineer after the possible departure of Lt. DeSalle.
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Maybe. Or maybe history is/was a red-shirt uniform. My explanation is as good as any, and better than some.
I liked the idea that Masters was a physicist working on the warp engines, not a regular engineer. Comms seems to have been a goldshirt job at first.
Absent information to the contrary, I find it easier to believe that her specialty warranted a red tunic for some reason.
We know once or twice Uhura took to the nav console. Given early on we saw her wear gold it’s possible she was perhaps once in the command division and manned the nav and/or helm console. Then she switches permanently(?) to red and appears to be the lead communications officer, perhaps even being Chief of Communications although thats never actually established.
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Maybe. Or maybe history is/was a red-shirt uniform. My explanation is as good as any, and better than some.
I liked the idea that Masters was a physicist working on the warp engines, not a regular engineer. Comms seems to have been a goldshirt job at first.
Absent information to the contrary, I find it easier to believe that her specialty warranted a red tunic for some reason.
Historian is thinky in blue.
Archeologist is practical in red.
I was thinking that Marla was attracted to historical figures, and would have signed her virtue over to any historical figure she happened to meet out in space.
That's a fetish.
Abraham Lincoln.
Leonardo DaVinci
Zephram Cochrane
Colonel Green.
Best part of SNW and most of Trek for me now. Feels like a human.
I'm glad you like him, really.
Sucker for a Pike. Won't keep me coming back but, oh well.
Interesting. I've always taken it as McGivers figuring out the truth before the rest of the crew. (And I'd also imagined she'd started the painting before they discovered Khan, but I think that's more debatable.)
