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Spoilers 'Obi-Wan Kenobi' series [Spoiler Discussion]
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I'd rather have the real deal than a computer. And there's no way they couldn't strengthen Jones' legit recordings without resorting to complete fabrications. They're doing it just because they can instead of looking for more creative solutions.
Same here! I think just about every episode had a quotient of 2-3 stupid things in it, but fortunately most were balanced by some really good stuff, too.
In episode 4, the scales tipped way too far in the stupid direction without much of anything to compensate for it.
Yeah I think that was me a while back. Posted this and said it’d be cool to see something like that and get to see Hayden under the mask. Pretty much exactly happened, even down to the very same line of “Then you will die”
Poor Vader, gets his ass handing to him by his former Master, then 6 years later the same thing happens from his Padawan too. How embarrassing
One can be resigned to a death and still be sad. There is still an attachment there. At least to my reading.
Not saying Vader doesn't have to die; he does. But that doesn't make Kenobi dancing on the hilltops and singing "Ding-dong, the Vader's dead..."
Still not seeing the contradiction.
You have a source for that? I've seen multiple articles making that claim and the best they can seem to come up is that at the time he had a pinned tweet basically saying he hasn't seen the episode yet, because whatever hotel he was saying at during the release doesn't carry Disney+. Which means exactly dick all about anything, except maybe he got sick of people asking him what he thought about the episode he hadn't seen yet.
Just a load of click-bait headlines that lead back to the same articles, where the only substantive quote is from Matt Wood just describing how the neural net builds the sounds from a dataset of clean ADR from the archives, plus a bunch of audiobooks he recorded in the 80's.
On the other hand the 'Gallery' episode has plenty of footage of Hamill on set, in costume, acting out the scenes in collaboration with his body double to deliver his physical performance. What we know of the previous run at this in Mando's 2nd season finale was that the vocal performance WAS done by him (again, the Gallery literally shows footage of him recording the ADR lines) and THAT is what gets fed into the AI software to rebuilt the sound of his voice. So yeah, not one sound that you hear in the dialogue was recorded by Mark Hamill, but it's still his performance that forms the backbone of the whole thing. Basically all of this is exactly like saying "Robert Downy Jr., Woodey Harrelson, Keanu Reeves & Winona Ryder didn't record a single frame of footage for 'A Scanner Darkly'!!!" It smacks of deliberately obtuse nonsense and false outrage. Indeed the tone of a lot of these articles sounds exactly like this.
The reality is there simply is not an AI program in the world right now that can dynamically go straight from text to speech and actually deliver a *performance* that sounds anything close to a believable character, according to direction. Flat and neutral? Sure. But nothing nuanced, or remotely natural sounding that isn't directly sampling from actual speech.
This isn't marketing smoke and mirrors. This is technology they're very eager to show off precisely because ILM wants other studios to hire them to do this stuff. How stupid would it be if they were advertising it was a voice replacer, when in fact what they had was a 100% AI actor. They'd be screaming that from the rooftops, because they could charge *sooo* much more then.
Now, I'm not sure if James Earl Jones recorded dialogue for 'Kenobi' or not. If I had to guess I'd say probably yes, and just like with Mark, it's his performance that forms the backbone for the voice replacer that's keyed to his voice circa 1976 - '83-ish (again, using an archival dataset.) Failing that, the next logical possibility is that it's Hayden that recorded all the dialogue and they put that through the replacer, and even so; the only logical reason to do it this way would be if JEJ is physically not well enough to record.
Either way, Jones is being credited, so he's still getting a paycheck regardless.
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The character inconsistency would be Kenobi acting in any way that suggests he's "resigned" to a view or position as if there's regret when his OT self was assured in his belief that Vader was nothing except evil who had to be killed, sans any sort of resignation to his view or the mission.
View on the mission I think he was committed to.
That Anakin had to die I think there is a measure of resignation. A distinction without a difference but I don't see the inconsistency that others do. I see Obi-Wan willing kill Vader, but Anakin is a different story and he had to work through that in the next ten years receiving training from Qui-Gon in doing so.
Does killing Darth Vader / Anakin really solve anything? Palpatine is the problem. If Vader falls, I'm sure he's already got a backup apprentice candidate in mind. Probably not Luke at this point, but I'm sure there is somebody.
Like Ahsoka, Obi-Wan realized that he could not save Anakin, only destroy him, and they chose not to do that. In the end, it was the proper decision. Anakin, the chosen one, brought balance to the Force by destroying the Emperor, just as the prophecy foretold.
I think my biggest gripe with the series is how much they borrowed from other canonical sources rather than come up with something completely new. Obi-Wan's assault on the Inquisitors headquarters came directly out of a video game and the duel in the finale was essentially reworking of the duel between Vader and Ahsoka in Rebels.
Like Ahsoka, Obi-Wan realized that he could not save Anakin, only destroy him, and they chose not to do that. In the end, it was the proper decision. Anakin, the chosen one, brought balance to the Force by destroying the Emperor, just as the prophecy foretold.
I think my biggest gripe with the series is how much they borrowed from other canonical sources rather than come up with something completely new. Obi-Wan's assault on the Inquisitors headquarters came directly out of a video game and the duel in the finale was essentially reworking of the duel between Vader and Ahsoka in Rebels.
Agree 100%, but they needed to ugly him up just a bit more.
Agree 100% and posted something very similar earlier in the thread. Obi-wan walking away from a defeated Vader totally blew the tiny shred of credibility this show had left out of the water. Inexcusable.
Above Book of Boba, yes, but worse than 'not bad'. This was a stinker. Young Leia was almost enough to redeem it, but not quite.
Too late for that plot-thread now, but before the prequels, I always imagined that Owen or Beru might be a sibling of Kenobi's. It would have made sense in world where Anakin Skywalker didn't grow up on Tatooine with his mother marrying Clieg Lars. It would also explain Owen's seemingly innate dislike of Kenobi, inasmuch as he considered him a danger to Luke.
See, this is the part that makes this series (and several other films and series) very fun for me. There are a lot of repeated themes throughout and I love them all. The Inquisitors, and Reva and the Grand Inquisitor's story in particular, reminds me of Jedi Knight. I love the weaving of different themes and stories throughout, and it felt appropriately mythic in it's presentation.
So what I'm seeing here, is that we need Jerec and Kyle Katarn. It is totally not too late to retcon them straight back into canon, just like it's not too late for Zahn's trilogy, Mara Jade, Talon Kaarde, and the rest, with an Ahsoka twist. I'm just sayin'. Really. I'm just sayin'...
Fire Kennedy, and give the whole thing to Filoni and Favreau to run, and Disney will score millions of new fans, retain the old, and make money hand over fist despite their wicked, woke, corporate ways.
That's fair. And certainly isn't a deal breaker or even a major gripe, just a little sense of having seen it before? Not to the extent of The Force Awakens and other aspects of the sequel trilogy, but just a little bit of deja vu in the storytelling. But as @Sketcher rightly pointed out as I was composing this post, the inherent "poetry" nature of the Star Wars storytelling according to George Lucas is well established.
I'll walk.
Not just poetry, but just mythology, which, like poetry, is about themes.
So... that's not a NO on Jerec and Katarn?
Too bad they'd have to be recast. Wasn't lip-licking Jerec the most scenery chewing villain since old Palps himself?
That's a no on firing Kennedy and putting Filoni and Favreau in charge. I don't trust them that much.
As for Katarn and Jerec, both would be fun. I think Jerec is a great villain but not everyone's cup of blue milk either. That would be nostalgia bait, more than anything, and I'm quite satiated on that.
I don't see this point of view, personally. Opinions will vary, sure, but just about everything Kennedy has taken a direct hand in has turned into a train wreck, while Filoni and Favreau have arguably saved it for Disney with The Mandalorian. Maybe it's just a matter of my own fandom running parallel to theirs, but those guys GET Star Wars the way only someone who saw the original when they were a pre-teen or teen can get it.
I don't love EVERYTHING Filoni has done, but I love way more of it than I don't, and Kennedy and her woke, raging feminism has done severe damage to the franchise. I'm well aware opinions will vary violently on this.
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