Saucer Separation wasn't a good idea

[Takeru]

When TNG was developed the idea was that the Enterprise would be on a 20 year mission outside of federation space, that was the main reason families were on board and the ship basically looked like a hotel, the crew would live there for a very long time.

So it does make sense to have a way to for civilians to avoid battles but why dump them in a vessel with no warp drive which could easily leave them hundreds of years away from federation space at impulse making them sitting ducks should star drive be lost?
Andrew Probert's initial idea for the battle section was that it would detach from the front of the saucer and that made more sense, a smaller vessel with most likely limited warp drive to engage the enemy while the bulk of the ship's crew and all civilians keep the main engines as a way to escape.

Obviously the ship ended up mostly in federation space often hauling cargo or ambassadors around, being first responder in emergencies etc. so saucer separation worked under those circumstances but that was not the plan when the feature was added to the ship so why did they tell Probert to separate the saucer instead of his original idea?

 

[Oddish]

I think it's because the battle section would need to be tied in with the main engines, since that's the primary source of power for the phasers.

 

[shapeshifter]

If it did not separate everyone would be dead.

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Better stranded somewhere than dead, right? Besides, the saucer has engines, it has a chance of limping to somewhere.

I don't see how his original idea is really any different or better.
http://fsd.trekships.org/art/images/ded-3tn.gif

 

[JirinPanthosa]

The problem with that argument is that it assumes the meta-knowledge that we are in a television show and random events favor the entertaining. Given their in-universe knowledge base, the saucer would always be much safer on its own in the middle of nowhere than charging to the frontlines.

 

[Orphalesion]

Yeah I do think that the Saucer Section should have had a small, secondary warp core, in case the engineering section is destroyed.

Though didn't they "throw" the Saucer Section forward at some level of warp speed during the pilot? They separated at warp speed and later on the Saucer Section arrived at Farpoint Station some time (but not very long) after the Engineering Section arrived iirc.
So it seems to be possible to "throw" the Saucer Section towards friendly space at warp?

 

[shapeshifter]

I missed where it said a mini engine in the saucer. I guess that could work, at the expense of losing a ton of room otherwise occupied by beings.

Is the trade off worth it?

 

[JoseNoodles]

Yeah I do think that the Saucer Section should have had a small, secondary warp core, in case the engineering section is destroyed.

Though didn't they "throw" the Saucer Section forward at some level of warp speed during the pilot? They separated at warp speed and later on the Saucer Section arrived at Farpoint Station some time (but not very long) after the Engineering Section arrived iirc.
So it seems to be possible to "throw" the Saucer Section towards friendly space at warp?

Yeah it seems there were at least one or two instances where the ship separated at warp, which would seem risky if the saucer section wasn't able to generate its own warp field. You'd think it would immediately slow down and possibly slam into the Stardrive Section, which would still be traveling at warp. So I have wonder if the Saucer didn't have some (limited) form of warp drive, at the very least some way to maintain a warp field.

 

[Ssosmcin]

The worst part was Picard calling it "emergency saucer sep." Did losing "aration" really save much time? If you're gonna abbreviate, then ESS would have been fine. Troi would have been right at home exclaiming "Emergency Saucer Separation?!"

 

[NCC-73515]

In those cases where they separated at warp, the drive section turned around and flew back, IIRC.
So I guess the plan was to warp away from the fight, release the saucer with all civilians and kids and pets, then return and fight. The enemy would have to get past the drive section to get to the saucer.

 

[Orphalesion]

In those cases where they separated at warp, the drive section turned around and flew back, IIRC.
So I guess the plan was to warp away from the fight, release the saucer with all civilians and kids and pets, then return and fight. The enemy would have to get past the drive section to get to the saucer.

I just checked the transcript for Encounter at Farpoint and the Enterprise stays at Farpoint Station and the Saucer Section comes to it, and that's within that time limit Q gave them to solve the mystery of Farpoint Station.

I think that was the reason they did the emergency separation at Warp speed, so it use that to travel at some level of warp speed to meet up with the star drive section at Farpoint

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

There will be no more isolation
In our Saucer Separation

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[Takeru]

I think it's because the battle section would need to be tied in with the main engines, since that's the primary source of power for the phasers.

I don't remember the phasers running on warp plasma.

If it did not separate everyone would be dead.

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Better stranded somewhere than dead, right? Besides, the saucer has engines, it has a chance of limping to somewhere

If the warp core is about to blow up being stranded in the saucer is obviously preferable to being dead but the stated main reason for saucer separation was to leave the civilians behind when the battle section faces an enemy. In that case the civilian part of the ship should have warp drive especially if it's outside of federation space.
A life boat not having warp drive is one thing but saucer separation was supposed to be a regularly used feature, one part of the ship not having warp engines was a weird choice in that case.

I don't see how his original idea is really any different or better.
http://fsd.trekships.org/art/images/ded-3tn.gif

The little wedges at the end could easily be warp nacelles, they match Andrew Probert's rules that he used when designing, they are a pair ad there's a line of sight between them.

 

[Oddish]

I don't remember the phasers running on warp plasma.

Whatever they run on, they undoubtedly require immense amounts of power. Same with the engines. It doesn't make sense to have seperate power sources.

 

[Captrek]

I don't remember the phasers running on warp plasma.

It’s mentioned in TMP, which is why the Enterprise can’t use her phasers when the warp engine goes into imbalance. Also in TWOK, the Reliant can’t fire on the Enterprise when its warp drive is damaged.

It’s not clear whether the same design is used in the 24th Century.

 

[NCC-73515]

The saucer has its own torpedo tube at least XD

 

[Takeru]

Whatever they run on, they undoubtedly require immense amounts of power. Same with the engines. It doesn't make sense to have seperate power sources.

It does when your ship has the ability to separate and operate as two vessels. And the saucer has impulse engines powered by fusion reactors, those should produce more than enough energy for the phasers. The saucer being unable to use its two massive phaser strips after separation makes no sense at all.

It’s mentioned in TMP, which is why the Enterprise can’t use her phasers when the warp engine goes into imbalance. Also in TWOK, the Reliant can’t fire on the Enterprise when its warp drive is damaged.

It’s not clear whether the same design is used in the 24th Century.

DS9 showed them displaying used up phaser power cells on the Defiant during the war, so they don't seem to be tied directly into the warp drive in the 24th century.

 

[puzzledtea]

Something else that didn't quite make sense to me is, how often would there be enough time to evacuate everyone to the saucer?

In Generations there was about 5 minutes till the warp core breached. So that gave the crew less time than that to evacuate. I think it's safe to assume that would be a typical time for the separation to be done by.

But if a battle had started with an ambush, that'd not give them time to separate safely. Or if they were in the middle of a battle and the ship was in danger, I can't see how there'd even be chance to get the saucer to safety.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

Besides, the saucer has engines, it has a chance of limping to somewhere.

If the main battle section were to be taken out by something, that something could just catch up to the saucer section and pick it off as it was limping.

I've never really thought about it before, but "emergency saucer sep" really isn't a hot idea...

 

[Oddish]

Just because it doesn't solve every conceivable problem doesn't mean it's a completely awful idea.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

Just because it doesn't solve every conceivable problem doesn't mean it's a completely awful idea.

True, but if it doesn't solve the problem it was conceived to solve (getting civilians out of a combat zone) then at least we can say it's awful in that sense.