Fighting for your home: joining the Maquis?

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I'm sure there were multiple Maquis sects with goals that didn't always align. That's another thing that groups like this do. A lot of competition over who's most loyal to The Cause.

Groups led by Chakotay or Hudson might even come to the Federation with intel, if they thought Eddington was planning something that might blow back in their faces...

 

[DonIago]

I had thoughts of it going even further, with a more moderate cell actively helping to prevent an attack by Eddington.

In any case, it's a shame the Maquis were ultimately depicted in such a monolithic manner, at least if the goal was to earn any audience sympathy. At least from this audience.

 

[Lynx]

Good afternoon.

To the best of your imagination and reasoning, if you had been placed in a similar situation to that of the Maquis, would you have elected to join their cause or would you have simply moved without any (or much) protest?

I would definitely have joined The Maquis in that case.
As a kid I was forced to move from my home province due to misery and unemployment caused by the policy of a stupid government and since than I've had a soft spot for freedom fighters whi fight for independence and refuse to be deported.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I'm just reminded of something I read in a VOY novel (can't remember which one), and it's something that really cracked me the fuck up at that time: the appearance of "Maquis admirals".

I'm like, what the hell? Groups like this don't have senior leadership. Hell, they barely have ANY leadership. From their perspective, it would seem to be defeating the purpose.

It's like when Eddington was talking about the colonies seceding from the Federation and forming their own independent state. STATE? What state? Groups like this don't believe in a state!

 

[DonIago]

The Maquis might have been more successful if there had been some coordination though...

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

The Maquis might have been more successful if there had been some coordination though...

"Are you the DMZ People's Front?"
"Fuck off! We're the People's Front of the DMZ."

 

[Ragitsu]

"If I have to join the Maquis, I'd want to be part of Chakotay's crew."

I'm just reminded of something I read in a VOY novel (can't remember which one), and it's something that really cracked me the fuck up at that time: the appearance of "Maquis admirals".

Post-Voyager or...?

If you were a Maquis member that became part of Voyager's crew, I imagine the slate would've been wiped clean due to your many accomplishments; those Maquis were probably allowed back into Starfleet proper and some of those that made the decision to "reenlist" could very well have risen to Admiral one day.

 

[Takeru]

I would have left, all we ever saw where small settlements of maybe a few dozen people, there was no reason they couldn't have all moved to another planet together and kept the community intact, it's not ideal but it's better than giving up your federation citizenship and choosing to become citizens of an oppressive police state. I feel bad for the children who weren't asked, everyone else chose their fate.

 

[STEPhon IT]

Good afternoon.

To the best of your imagination and reasoning, if you had been placed in a similar situation to that of the Maquis, would you have elected to join their cause or would you have simply moved without any (or much) protest?

It all depends on where I am in my life. Who I am now, I would fight for my land. If I had children and a growing family, I would pack up and leave without resistance because family means more to me than land.

 

[Orphalesion]

I feel bad for the children who weren't asked, everyone else chose their fate.

The ones who had children and didn't move to safety were the biggest criminals of all.

 

[Ragitsu]

The ones who had children and didn't move to safety were the biggest criminals of all.

Maquis Daycare...not a growth industry?

 

[Orphalesion]

It all depends on where I am in my life. Who I am now, I would fight for my land

But I really don't understand why. Why fight for "land" in a society and setting where land, including breathtakingly beautiful land with the mildest climate(especially considering weather control systems) and oceanview, is so readily available? Would you really join a ragtag band of guérilla fighters and fight the Cardassians for land with the knowledge that you just could to go to the Federation and ask them for some new land? Knowing what the Cardassianz do to rebellious populations?

 

[Ragitsu]

Knowing what the Cardassianz do to rebellious populations?

Hell, even if you do manage to avoid an energy blast to rear of your skull (i.e., a field execution), you'll end up dealing with the Cardassian "legal" system.

 

[Tosk]

Just a random question, unrelated to anything. If the U.S. ever sliced off a small section of their land (on paper) and declared it the property of Russia, do you think every person living in that space would just move or would there be violent opposition? And would y'all support their efforts or just say, "Jeez, just move already. Deal's done, it's their land now."

 

[Paul Weaver]

Just a random question, unrelated to anything. If the U.S. ever sliced off a small section of their land (on paper) and declared it the property of Russia, do you think every person living in that space would just move or would there be violent opposition? And would y'all support their efforts or just say, "Jeez, just move already. Deal's done, it's their land now."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Purchase
"Nearly all Federation settlers left the DMZ in the aftermath of the purchase"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisiana_Purchase
The DMZ Purchase was negotiated between the Federation and the Cardassian Union, without consulting the various Marquis tribes who lived on the planets and who had not ceded the planets to any intersteller power. The four decades following the DMZ Purchase was an era of court decisions removing many tribes from their planets corewards of Marva IV, culminating in the Trail of Tears.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adams–Onís_Treaty#Florida
"Evek said the Cardassian Union had to take control because the DMZ (along the border of Cardassian Territory) had become "a derelict open to the occupancy of every enemy, civilized or savage, of the Cardassian Union, and serving no other galactic purpose than as a post of annoyance to them"

 

[jackoverfull]

Nobody mentioned that some of the settlers had a *religious* attachment to what they saw as their holy land or whatever. That makes it much harder to leave.

Personally? I wouldn’t turn to violence for sure, especially not so stupidly, but I understand some of the motovations.

Just a random question, unrelated to anything. If the U.S. ever sliced off a small section of their land (on paper) and declared it the property of Russia, do you think every person living in that space would just move or would there be violent opposition? And would y'all support their efforts or just say, "Jeez, just move already. Deal's done, it's their land now."

Israel/Palestine cough cough

 

[Orphalesion]

Just a random question, unrelated to anything. If the U.S. ever sliced off a small section of their land (on paper) and declared it the property of Russia, do you think every person living in that space would just move or would there be violent opposition? And would y'all support their efforts or just say, "Jeez, just move already. Deal's done, it's their land now."

And that analogy, just like any real life analogy doesn't work, because the displaced people in that scenario would probably have to settle in a place that is very unlike their original home, with (somewhat) different culture and would probably have to downgrade their living standard to some extend. As an example; the family of my great-grandfather on my mother's side owned an estate in East-Prussia. After World War II, Russia annexed the place and they had to settle with my great-grandmother's family in an apartment in Vienna and became working class. They became strangers in a strange land and had to downgrade their living standards, like it is the fate of most displaced persons throughout history and today in real life.
However if their situation had been like that of the that of the Marquis they would have kept their standard of living by getting a completely new estate in untouched virgin country(something that doesn't exist any more on our Earth), built and stocked by the state, free of charge and probably with at least a good portion of their village living with them like before in a landscape that would have greatly resembled their old home, keeping their culture and community.
That's why no real-life analogy works for the Marquis.

Nobody mentioned that some of the settlers had a *religious* attachment to what they saw as their holy land or whatever. That makes it much harder to leave.

Personally? I wouldn’t turn to violence for sure, especially not so stupidly, but I understand some of the motovations.

I don't really think that religion should be a valid reason for throwing your life away either.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

If you were a Maquis member that became part of Voyager's crew, I imagine the slate would've been wiped clean due to your many accomplishments; those Maquis were probably allowed back into Starfleet proper and some of those that made the decision to "reenlist" could very well have risen to Admiral one day.

Actually I was talking about Admirals who ARE in the Maquis. Not ex-Maquis who returned to Starfleet.

 

[DonIago]

And that analogy, just like any real life analogy doesn't work, because the displaced people in that scenario would probably have to settle in a place that is very unlike their original home, with (somewhat) different culture and would probably have to downgrade their living standard to some extend. As an example; the family of my great-grandfather on my mother's side owned an estate in East-Prussia. After World War II, Russia annexed the place and they had to settle with my great-grandmother's family in an apartment in Vienna and became working class. They became strangers in a strange land and had to downgrade their living standards, like it is the fate of most displaced persons throughout history and today in real life.
However if their situation had been like that of the that of the Marquis they would have kept their standard of living by getting a completely new estate in untouched virgin country(something that doesn't exist any more on our Earth), built and stocked by the state, free of charge and probably with at least a good portion of their village living with them like before in a landscape that would have greatly resembled their old home, keeping their culture and community.
That's why no real-life analogy works for the Marquis.

FWIW, it's Maquis, not Marquis.

The other thing of course is that if they don't like the place where they end up living, or miss where they used to live, entire virtual environments that appear to be nearly indistinguishable from the real thing can be created. Or for that matter, something entirely different from either their old or new home. Want to live in the White House? Knock yourself out!

Don't like your new home? Get a holodeck and program it with a record of your old home!

 

[Lynx]

I'm just reminded of something I read in a VOY novel (can't remember which one), and it's something that really cracked me the fuck up at that time: the appearance of "Maquis admirals".

I'm like, what the hell? Groups like this don't have senior leadership. Hell, they barely have ANY leadership. From their perspective, it would seem to be defeating the purpose.

It's like when Eddington was talking about the colonies seceding from the Federation and forming their own independent state. STATE? What state? Groups like this don't believe in a state!

Not entirely correct.

I agree that "Maquis Admirals" is over the top. Groups like The Maquis seldom have a military hierarchy like this. If they have, then there's something bigger involved, like a government in exile or so.

But an independent state is another thing.

Freedom fighers or terrorists might fight for the independence of a province, a planet or part of a planet (like the Ansata terrorists in the TNG episode The High Ground).

When it comes to Eddington's statement, I'm sure that he wanted the colonies ion the Demilitarized Zone to become an independent area, not occupied by cardassia but not members of the Federation either. I guess that he and most of the maquis weren't too fond of the Federation after their homeworlds were sold out to the Cardassians.