What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
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All of Star Trek is a holodeck program.
Humans never invented warp travel or contacted aliens, this is the work of a 23rd century author and the equivalent of our current day TV shows as holodecks are a common medium in most households around the world.
The furthest humans ever got to in space is a base on Mars in the late 21st century.
Humans never invented warp travel or contacted aliens, this is the work of a 23rd century author and the equivalent of our current day TV shows as holodecks are a common medium in most households around the world.
The furthest humans ever got to in space is a base on Mars in the late 21st century.
It can get more bizzare than Star Trek being a holodeck program created in the 23rd century.
See my answer here:
https://scifi.stackexchange.com/que...-sf-continuities-besides-nivens/254629#254629
Which is linked to this Trek BBS thread: https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/star-trek-is-part-of-mcu.293148/
So some television fans who believe in the Tommy Westphail Universe believed that Star Trek was imagined by a 20th century Earth boy. And so some people might consider Tommy Westhail to be the creator god of the Star Trek universe.
So if any creators of future Star Trek programs and movies believe that, Tommy Westphail could show up as an all powerfull god in some Star Trek productions.
Actually, barring terrible disasters, humans should have sent robotic probes to a few nearby stars, and received data from them, long before the 23rd century.
And they should have sent manned and/or unmanned expediitions to mine asteroids and comets for raw materials for Earth, the Mars bsse, and various artifical space habitats they build as they begin the colonization of the Solar System.
This is actually funny, as the actor that played Tommy Westphall appeared in the TNG episode Suddenly Human, as the boy Jono.
That's neat @MAGolding I like that thread on stack exchange. I know of the whole Tommy Westphall theory ever since St Elsewhere happened.
I started to reply to your post but decided to start a separate thread.
https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/alternate-universes-in-tos.309295/
This is an opinion about canon, so it has to be controversial by default.
I don't think the Okuda Chronology should've had the five-year mission in TOS lasting from 2264 to 2269. And I don't think "Q2" (VOY) should've established the five-year mission as ending in 2270.
I think the five-year mission should've been from 2266 to 2271. If you're going to retroactively establish TOS as taking place 300 years after when it first aired, then ending the five-year mission in 2271 is a nod to the fact that had TOS run five seasons, it would've ended in 1971.
I don't think the Okuda Chronology should've had the five-year mission in TOS lasting from 2264 to 2269. And I don't think "Q2" (VOY) should've established the five-year mission as ending in 2270.
I think the five-year mission should've been from 2266 to 2271. If you're going to retroactively establish TOS as taking place 300 years after when it first aired, then ending the five-year mission in 2271 is a nod to the fact that had TOS run five seasons, it would've ended in 1971.
True, but if the first season of the show largely takes place in year 2 of the 5 year mission, with WNMHGB being the only year 1 episode, then ending in 2270 makes sense from a certain point of view.
Plus the canon existence of TAS allows you to fill in at least some of the 2269-70 gap between "Turnabout Intruder(TOS)" and the Enterprise returing home for her refit.
"Where No Man Has Gone Before", at least the '90s syndicated version that I first watched, didn't have the "Space, the Final Frontier" monologue. Between that and the different uniforms, I figured WNMHGB took place before the five-year mission.
I'll go with the Star Trek Spaceflight Chronology timeline where the five year mission lasted from roughly 2210-2213.
What made the "five"-year mission end early?
It notes that it ended after three years, "the much-used Enterprise was returned to Earth drydock". It doesn't go into the details. I think it still meshes with TMP, giving Kirk command during two separate missions.
Who knows if it ended early and if it did why but perhaps it's called a five year mission because it was originally planned for being a five year mission?
I think Kirk knows.
Kirk: "I'm replacing you as Captain of the Enterprise. You'll stay on as Executive Officer. Temporary grade reduction to Commander."
Decker: "You personally are assuming command?"
Kirk: "Yeah."
Decker: "May I ask why?"
Kirk: "My experience, five years out there dealing with unknowns like this, my familiarity with the Enterprise, this crew."
Decker: "Admiral, this is an almost totally new Enterprise. You don't know her a tenth as well as I do."
Kirk: "That's why you're staying aboard. I'm sorry."
Decker: "No, Admiral. I don't think you're sorry. Not one damn bit."
TMP came out in December 1979. The Spaceflight Chronology came out in 1980. In fairness, they probably wrote and/or researched the bulk of (if not all of) that chronology before having a chance to see the movie.
One of the assumptions made by the Okudas was that then an event is said to be X hundred years early it is exactly X hundrd years before.
One of the other assumptions of the Okudas were that TOS episods happen 300 years after TO wa first broadcast, in 2266-2269.
In "The Savage Curtain" Mr. Scott makes a gesture while saying:
And Spock corrects him.
Abraham Lincoln died in 1865, so 300 years later would put "The Savage Curtain" in 2165.
That would be a few years after the latest date mentioned in TOS, 2156 in "Wolf in the Fold", and so seems quite possible.
If "The Savage Curtain" happens in 2269, Abraham Lincoln wouldhave to die in 1969, 109 years after being born, due to some sort of science ficiotnal event.
We can assume that Spock would have corrected Mr. Scott about the time since LInclon died, instead of the currect direction to Earth, if the time span Scott mentioned was too far off what Spock considered a reasonable allowance for human vagueness.
So what margin would Spock have allowed an dnot bothered to correct? I don't know. But I consider it certain that Spock would have corrected Scott if Scott mentioned the wrong number of centuries. Therefore, "The Savage curtain" should happpen sometime between two centuries and four centuries after 1865, or sometimes between 2065 and 2265.
And even the latest date in that very liberal date range, 2265, is a few years before the date of 'The Savage Curtain" according to the Okudas.
A latest possible date for "The Savage Curtain" of 2265 does agree with the date of the early 2260s in various Star Trek technical works and championed by what's his name, as well as with the date in about the 2250s in the earliest Star Trek chronology I know of, in the fanzine Star Trek: An Analysis of a Phenomenon in science ficiton.(1968), and the 2200s date in the Star Trek Spaceflight Chronology, and many other dates in various Star Trek chronologies.
Scotty was just ballparking the death date. Kind of how people today will say that the American Revolution was "two hundred years ago" when it was more than that.
Agreed, in part. I mean, I like to follow the continuity of some of the novels, in which there was a second five year mission following the events of TMP, but in essence I do think TWOK was basically a soft reboot of TMP, and events from the first film were never referenced again.
It is alway a little odd to see the arc of desk-bound Kirk goes back into space repeated like the first arc never happened. The JJ movies did this sort of thing where you had the upstart Kirk getting thrown out of the center seat, creating a weird bubble in the character's growth.
As a fan of TMP, I feel it was a little bit of a shame that we didn't see more of THAT Enterprise crew. I would have liked to have seen how that vision continued. But I understand that TWOK in all likelihood was the only reason why the movie franchise continued.
Yes, I know. I said that in my earlier post.
I wasn't talking about when TOS was set. TOS only represents three years of the five-year mission. I only disagree about where they placed the other two years.
I know all of this too. I knew it when I was in junior high.
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