Why do people hate Lwaxana Troi?

[Mojochi]

She is one of those TNG characters, much like Riker, that it took them nearly the entire series to finally flesh them out into a rounded person, whose more 2 dimensional traits actually began making sense. For Riker it was the facade of bravado he used to hide away his shame of having been a gullible young officer, that didn't surface until The Pegasus, & for Lwaxana, it seems to be that her ostentatiousness was also something of a crutch that she wore to cope with having had some rather hard personal tragedy befall her family, with a dead husband & a dead daughter, who we don't get the whole story about until later on as well, with Dark Page, & even Half a Life

This is where we kind of finally see through her persona, down to a person who is hurting, and acts the way she does because it makes her feel better, more admired, more loved, less loss, more attention. Even Deanna didn't know the whole story. Sadly, if she had, she might have better understood her mother enough, such that she wouldn't have had such an adverse reaction to her behavior, that she ended up becoming almost her polar opposite.

So as much as I have a hard time sitting through most of Lwaxana's episodes, I do quite like where they took the character... eventually. It at least made the character more believable.

 

[Commander Troi]

She is one of those TNG characters, much like Riker, that it took them nearly the entire series to finally flesh them out into a rounded person, whose more 2 dimensional traits actually began making sense. For Riker it was the facade of bravado he used to hide away his shame of having been a gullible young officer, that didn't surface until The Pegasus, & for Lwaxana, it seems to be that her ostentatiousness was also something of a crutch that she wore to cope with having had some rather hard personal tragedy befall her family, with a dead husband & a dead daughter, who we don't get the whole story about until later on as well, with Dark Page, & even Half a Life

This is where we kind of finally see through her persona, down to a person who is hurting, and acts the way she does because it makes her feel better, more admired, more loved, less loss, more attention. Even Deanna didn't know the whole story. Sadly, if she had, she might have better understood her mother enough, such that she wouldn't have had such an adverse reaction to her behavior, that she ended up becoming almost her polar opposite.

So as much as I have a hard time sitting through most of Lwaxana's episodes, I do quite like where they took the character... eventually. It at least made the character more believable.

Totally agree. One of the advantages of fiction is that we can often see why someone does what they do. Too bad we usually can't in real life.

 

[Pikirk_Janesisko]

I have such a contempt for her. She's extremely obnoxious and not funny at the slightest. She's basically a sitcom character thrown on the show, not much different from having Cosmo Kramer hanging around the Enterprise. But at least he was funny. Every episode with her is an instant skip. The only watchable episode with her it's "The Forsaken". For years people complained about Wesley Crusher, but he improved as the series went on, yet I rarely see anyone complaining about Lwaxana.

Dark Pages was terrible, an extremely forced and unnecessary way to add dimension to an already one-note character.

She is one of those TNG characters, much like Riker, that it took them nearly the entire series to finally flesh them out into a rounded person, whose more 2 dimensional traits actually began making sense. For Riker it was the facade of bravado he used to hide away his shame of having been a gullible young officer, that didn't surface until The Pegasus, & for Lwaxana, it seems to be that her ostentatiousness was also something of a crutch that she wore to cope with having had some rather hard personal tragedy befall her family, with a dead husband & a dead daughter, who we don't get the whole story about until later on as well, with Dark Page, & even Half a Life.

I don't get this about Riker. He's a well fleshed out character with defining characteristcs. The only real problem is that he got a bit stale after season 4, even then he still had his moments to show off his strengths. He's certainly no way comparable to Lwaxanna.

 

[Oddish]

don't get this about Riker. He's a well fleshed out character with defining characteristcs. The only real problem is that he got a bit stale after season 4, even then he still had his moments to show off his strengths. He's certainly no way comparable to Lwaxanna.

All the more reason why he should have taken his own ship then. BoBW showed that he was ready for the Big Chair.

 

[Qonundrum]

Q had a place in the show, partly by serendipity as he's a generic "incorporeal being" like in TOS except he's not saying "humanity has potential and great ice cream" but is more like Trelane, sans "nooclear family cliche" (and TOS was advertised as being geared to adults and here's Trelane's mommy and daddy... okey dokey...) But I stray. Q would become more defined as an example of "showing Picard another perspective" trope.


Lwaxana more or less did little more than to tell more often than not dated humor and be as narcissistic as one could pompously get... ?

Her ostentatiousness (thank you @Mojochi!) also made the Sixth Doctor positively subdued and comatose by comparison, as if she was a semi-conscious 4th parody, and I opine that only because early TNG in particular had more direct Doctor Who references, right down to the most bizarre family tree chart - a shame it wasn't included in the season 1 blu-ray as an extra prior to their changing it because HD made all the difference in its legibility... (so did removing Nomad and other self-aware jokes from panels and things, but there I go digressing again...)

As with a lot of TNG, season 2 would see improvements and the best came generally in season 3 onward where what worked great is now better and even what was lukewarm got a bit of polish and stronger purpose. A shame about Yar... That said, Lwaxana is still a relic of 1950s stereotypes, to the point that, if this were the Kirk era, he's slap and threaten to spank her too. (ugh)

In "Menage a Troi", she directly saves the day and where her personality shines wonderfully. And not just a stick figure with theme of "have her horny for the top two in command while desperate for her daughter to get married before becoming an old maid at 20".

I too would place "Half a Life", "Dark Page", and "Menage a Troi" as being her best outings by far.

And an honorable mention because I have a soft spot for most of her antics in "Manhunt", despite a couple of terrible throwback moments by 1988's standards.

And any time she's the computer voice. There's nary a better voice around.

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Now try that in season 1... or maybe not, they'd lose the balance of the scene (and episode!)...
(it also looks spectacular in blu-ray...)

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Her retort about "you just kill them" is done simply perfectly. (And proof more than 70s dystopia like "Logan's Run" could address issues revolving around aging, and in a thoughtful manner.)

 

[Mojochi]

I don't get this about Riker. He's a well fleshed out character with defining characteristcs. The only real problem is that he got a bit stale after season 4, even then he still had his moments to show off his strengths. He's certainly no way comparable to Lwaxanna.

The characters aren't comparable. That's not what I meant. The writing inconsistency is. They encountered the same kind of issue with the Riker character that they did with Lwaxana.

In the beginning, on paper, Riker is the quintessential hero male, up & coming fast track officer, as well as being a best friend to the crew etc... but as the show went on, the development was sort of at odds with that depiction. He stagnated, & more often than not, despite them maintaining that he's "Good Time Will" he's actually very often a jerk, especially to outsiders, & even in pulling rank & posturing.. Hell, Picard has a long conversation with Kolrami about Riker's joviality with the crew... & I'm left wondering WHAT joviality? The Riker I see is usually in a pissy mood when in command of anything or anyone lol

Which is a valid character & one that probably happened organically, but it took a long time for them to reconcile all these disparate aspects into a character that makes sense, & they did so with some hefty backstory, that sort of repaints Riker as a guy thinly veiling his own feelings of inadequacy with his posturing, & his heroics. The Pegasus was the best thing they ever did for Riker

So too Lwaxana had to finally make some sense. It couldn't just be an ongoing gag of a lady being outrageous all the time, with no meaning behind it. Dark Page & Half a Life gave that to her, & it was needed imho

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

She's not an interesting character and I never thought there was much chemistry between any of TNG cast members during its run.

* One of TNG's great problems and why its is not the kind of series that demands a re-watch often. Chemistry between characters--as if it ever needed to be said--is you know...important.

 

[Oddish]

While Dark Page was serious, it shows that Lwaxana clearly has some very serious issues. Losing a child is beyond horrible, but most people who suffer that loss don't just erase the youngster from history like that. I hope that Deanna found one of her colleagues on Betazed and asked them to give Lwaxana the help she needed.

As for that bunch in "Half a Life"... it would be poetic justice if that scientist guy they browbeat into killing himself had been the only person whose knowledge could have solved their whole "dying sun" problem.

 

[oldtrekkie]

Be it in TNG or DS9, I don't remember a single episode where she intervenes that is above par in the slightest. I don't think it's a coincidence.

 

[Commander Troi]

And any time she's the computer voice. There's nary a better voice around.

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Now try that in season 1... or maybe not, they'd lose the balance of the scene (and episode!)...
(it also looks spectacular in blu-ray...)

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Her retort about "you just kill them" is done simply perfectly. (And proof more than 70s dystopia like "Logan's Run" could address issues revolving around aging, and in a thoughtful manner.)

I always loved Majel as the computer voice.

I forgot all about that scene in Menage A Troi! Riker's and Deanna's facial expressions are priceless!

And then there's "Half A Life." That episode hits home for me far more now than it did in 1991. Wow.

 

[JesterFace]

In the beginning of 'Half a Life' we see the Lwaxana we know, happy and very talkative but in the end of the episode we see a serious Lwaxana when she wants to beam down with Timicin for his ritual.
I'm not sure this is absolutely correct line but she says something like this to Picard: "I promise I won't cause a scene down there".

 

[ThankQ]

I couldn't stand her when I watched the episodes when I was younger--either watching reruns in my 20s or going all the way back to watching them first-run on my early teens. She was like your girlfriend's one fried who never shut up, never had anything worth saying and always had the drama dialed up to 11.

Early LT--when the focus was more on her trying to marry off DT--still hits me the wrong way, but now 30 years later, I have much more appreciation for the later version of LT as her role became more about the passage of time, aging and mortality.

 

[imranbecks]

I thought she was hilarious. I love how she always teases and mocks Picard. Even more hilarious when she annoys Odo when she visited DS9.

 

[Commander Troi]

Mocking the strait-laced is an old and honorable avocation.

 

[STEPhon IT]

I don't get this about Riker. He's a well fleshed out character with defining characteristcs. The only real problem is that he got a bit stale after season 4, even then he still had his moments to show off his strengths. He's certainly no way comparable to Lwaxanna.

On Riker, some fans who critique him on his decisions to stay at his post but then talk about how they want "realism" in their characters and story ideas. Guess what? Not every EX-O leaves their positions to be Captains in the military, and there's nothing wrong with that. I appreciate a person who loves their job, do it well and have the notion they can have opportunities and options if one desires. To me, he's a phenomenal character and I thought he was noble, smart, and effective officer for Captain Picard and I thought he was far better 1st officer than TNG spin-offs. Kira took some time to get the handle of being one, and that's okay, she turned out good, and Chakotay was a door mat for G.O.A.T. Janeway, while I don't even remember who was the Ex-O on ENT. Riker had a presence which I loved and I agree with you, he was a well fleshed out character and shouldn't be ridiculed bc of plot points integrated in storylines.

 

[Mojochi]

while I don't even remember who was the Ex-O on ENT.

T'Pol, much like Kira held the post without actually being in Starfleet.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

In her worst appearances she’s basically Space Karen.

I do like her in Half A Life and Ménage a Troi. But in most of her appearances seeing her meant “No adventure today!” and her constant entitlement and lack of respect for boundaries made you just want her to go away.

I do think she comes off better in DS9 when she draws out Odo.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

On Riker, some fans who critique him on his decisions to stay at his post but then talk about how they want "realism" in their characters and story ideas. Guess what? Not every EX-O leaves their positions to be Captains in the military, and there's nothing wrong with that. I appreciate a person who loves their job, do it well and have the notion they can have opportunities and options if one desires. To me, he's a phenomenal character and I thought he was noble, smart, and effective officer for Captain Picard and I thought he was far better 1st officer than TNG spin-offs. Kira took some time to get the handle of being one, and that's okay, she turned out good, and Chakotay was a door mat for G.O.A.T. Janeway, while I don't even remember who was the Ex-O on ENT. Riker had a presence which I loved and I agree with you, he was a well fleshed out character and shouldn't be ridiculed bc of plot points integrated in storylines.

I think people’s issues with Riker staying as XO are less a problem with XOs sticking around in general and more a problem with it contradicting Riker’s established character traits.

 

[Oddish]

I think people’s issues with Riker staying as XO are less a problem with XOs sticking around in general and more a problem with it contradicting Riker’s established character traits.

That's the case with me. Riker shoots up from Ensign to Commander way faster than normal, is offered a command after 12 years (Jonathan Frakes was 34 when TNG started). He takes a tour on the flagship to turbocharge his career... and then he spends the next decade just stagnating in that job. And moreover, in BoBW, he proves unquestionably that he has command chops, and belongs in the Big Chair, not playing second fiddle to Picard.

I generally tolerate that particular unrealistic development (unlike a certain other non-promotion) because of the IRL reasons: Frakes and Stewart were both popular. But, that doesn't mean I'm not going to point it out every now and then.

 

[STEPhon IT]

I think people’s issues with Riker staying as XO are less a problem with XOs sticking around in general and more a problem with it contradicting Riker’s established character traits.

Such as William Riker wanted to be the heir and master of the starship Enterprise and nothing else. That drum had been beaten on through all seven seasons, I don't blame him, and being offered other ships which were not even as close to the ship he loved was not worth the challenge. Was there an episode where a Fleet leader offered Commander Riker a Galaxy Class vessel? What were the established character traits where the Enterprise wasn't part of his passion?