Raffi's poverty

[GMDreia]

This is something that comes up in every Trek space I'm in:
"Picard is Bad Trek because there's still poverty."
Usually Raffi is the example given; that she "lives in a hovel," et cetera.

Here is my issue with this complaint...
We NEED to see people who are living at the absolute bottom baseline of a Federation lifestyle, EXACTLY so that we can see how things are better.
If how Raffi is living is what the Federation considers "poverty" - then *absolutely* we have gotten better. It looks to me like the standard of living has gotten much higher.
Raffi is not exactly homeless or living in Section 8 housing or a shantytown or trying to survive on disability, you can get by without money, everyone has access to quality medical care, and everyone has access to the same much higher baseline of education. Maybe she *chose* to live in the middle of nowhere, we haven't see how other people live on nothing. That actually looks like a pretty decent lifestyle to me and if that's what poverty looks like, then heck, sign me up! It's better than some lifestyles which pass for middle class where I live.

24th century poverty is clearly not 21st century poverty. Whatever kind of poverty Raffi is (if she is arguably even poor at all) is not exactly the kind that inspired the Bell Riots.

What are people asking for here??

 

[NCC-73515]

I also found it odd that such a house near such a famous geological and film-historical location is supposed to be "humiliating"
I'd love to live there! Imagine being able to walk up that rock and take in the sunset every day!
Aliens and 5th Element did a good job showing minimal housing, some apartment like that would've made sense if they really wanted her to feel poor.

 

[Tuskin38]

Exactly, nothing of her situation implies poverty.
She has a computer, nothing says she doesn't have a replicator as we never seen the inside of her home.

Maybe she *chose* to live in the middle of nowhere,

That's the impression I got from the show. Remember she was paranoid and anxious, believing in a deep rooted conspiracy theory (which turned out to be true).

She probably wanted to be as off the grid as possible (though terrible choice, the closest town is uh, only a couple KMs away? lmao)

 

[fireproof78]

There is nothing about Raffi that indicates poverty. It's a BS line to knock Picard as series because it dares to show that life isn't perfect.

 

[The Wormhole]

Yeah, Raffi can only be considered poor in comparison to Picard, since she doesn't have vast property and Romulan housekeepers. By today's working class standards, she's living quite luxuriously.

 

[Burning Hearts of Qo'nos]

Raffi was living my dream, honestly lol. I mean, decorative vines around your home that one can just stick in a vape? In a society where I probably just take a hypo once a week to repair the damage, no less. A replicator (presumably), no goddamn neighbors, AND access to high speed internet. This is low-key one of the best scenes to illustrate how wonderful Earth life must be.

 

[fireproof78]

Honestly, it is only poverty because people declare is so because of Raffi's anger at Picard.

 

[BillJ]

Honestly, it is only poverty because people declare is so because of Raffi's anger at Picard.

I think it is more driven by the "wealth doesn't matter" mindset we were sold in the Berman-era 24th century shows. The Socialist utopia clearly never came to pass. The workers aren't bossing Picard around on his Chateau.

And I don't think Musiker lives anywhere near the bottom of the 24th century economically.

 

[valkyrie013]

There is probably a "hard bottom" to trek life. You get a place to live, access to replicator, medical care. Can travel anywhere. Etc. That's someone sitting at home vaping vines, and watching holo novels doing Jack shit. There will always be people like that, however "enlightened" we become.
Now trek social improvement is based on doing something. If you want to be a grape grower they'd give you land. Picard land has been his family for generations, unless he craps the bed at making wine, they'll let him keep it.

 

[Tuskin38]

The Socialist utopia clearly never came to pass.

There's no evidence either way.

 

[GMDreia]

There is probably a "hard bottom" to trek life. You get a place to live, access to replicator, medical care. Can travel anywhere. Etc. That's someone sitting at home vaping vines, and watching holo novels doing Jack shit.

Yep. You can be a mumble rapper if you want. But also, a feral cat rescuer or a volunteer senior companion. You can do anything you want. You can also just take classes. You can spend all of your time just improving yourself. You can just be a musician, and you're not forced to make the bad deals with labels that modern musicians have to make, because survival and security are absolute givens. You can be a stay-at-home parent and your children will have good opportunities. A "hard bottom" like that, solves a lot of problems for society, and for individual people. Poverty in Trek society is comparable to being a trust fund baby in today's.

There will always be people like that, however "enlightened" we become.
Now trek social improvement is based on doing something. If you want to be a grape grower they'd give you land. Picard land has been his family for generations, unless he craps the bed at making wine, they'll let him keep it.

Yeah, and grape growing in real life does tend to be a thing that's passed down through families... I imagine that it's the same for people who grow up on working family farms at that point in time.

 

[Turtletrekker]

I would love to live in Raffi's "hovel".

 

[GMDreia]

I would love to live in Raffi's "hovel".

Heck yeah. It looks like a really sweet pad. It's even nicer than most mobile homes.

 

[WarpFactorZ]

This isn't the first time a Trek character has sought to "get away from it all", so to speak. As I recall, Bones retired from Starfleet medical post-TOS / pre-TMP and went to live as a hermit ... a disco hermit, at that. Imagine what he was smoking (or hypospraying, or...).

 

[FederationHistorian]

Its not so much that Raffi’s poor and more that she was drawing attention to Picard’s castle and having a purpose in life, neither of which she had. Even Raffi using drugs while Picard is clean and sober is drawing to those parallels.

Although unhappy when we first see her, she’s clearly doing better than what is considered poverty today.

 

[GMDreia]

Its not so much that Raffi’s poor and more that she was drawing attention to Picard’s castle and having a purpose in life, neither of which she had. Even Raffi using drugs while Picard is clean and sober is drawing to those parallels.

Although unhappy when we first see her, she’s clearly doing better than what is considered poverty today.

Yeah, I'm not sure I buy that Raffi is poor even by Fed standards. I think people reading too much into a throwaway line expressed in anger/frustration.

I want to see, all the more, what a "poor" person by Federation standards, would live like. What is the bottommost standard of living on 24th century Earth?

 

[Tuskin38]

where are these claims that she lives in poverty from then ?

People not understanding how she's living her life.

 

[Grizzlor]

Look Gene Roddenberry's vision for the future was quite gallant but it was simply not realistic. It went against many core human desires. One could argue that TNG really shown brighter, and may well have been rescued, when he stepped back after the first couple seasons. He refused to allow conflict between the ship's characters, it was highly counterproductive.

 

[DarKush]

How can there be poverty in a moneyless economy, assuming the Federation is still moneyless in 2399. I think the economics of Trek haven't really been thought through. Did they say Raffi was poor on the series? I've only looked at it once and don't desire to look at it again. I do remember her living off the grid, but does that mean she was lacking in money?

Perhaps if they had had Raffi subsisting on Freecloud or a non-Federation world the idea of her being poor, or poverty still existing in the 24th century, would make more sense. Even in Berman Trek I think it's a safe assumption that poverty existed on non-Federation worlds.

 

[valkyrie013]

I'm pretty sure you could "Slip through the cracks" but it would have to be a consious choice, as it you want to get off the grid. help is provided at all levels.