It’s the 26th century of a different timeline that changed from the 22nd century onward. Again, it’s not germane to the discussion.
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It’s the 26th century of a different timeline that changed from the 22nd century onward. Again, it’s not germane to the discussion.
Oh, okay then. I disagree. Same Starfleet, same system, different timeline. If you think they changed their registry policy because of the Sphere Builders or whatever, then it's just as likely they changed their registry policy a half-dozen times because of all the unseen stuff that happened in the prime time between 2399 and 3088.
100 years are 100 years, no matter the timeline
Sorry, you seem unable to grasp the concept of changed timelines. Does the Kelvin timeline Enterprise and Enterprise-A look like the prime Enterprise and Enterprise-A? No. Were they constructed at the same time as their prime universe counterparts? No again. You know why? Because the timeline changed in 2233. Same situation for the Enterprise-J.
try some grasping yourself: are the As in the different timelines in the same centuries or not? are the Ds in the thousands of realities in TNG Parallels similar Ds and in the same century, or not? is the mirror NX and mirror connie in the same century and very similar, or not? quite a concept to grasp alright XD
I can’t help that you don’t understand how things work.
it is you who doesn't understand the point here
it is you who doesn't understand the point here
No, you’re just being deliberately obtuse for some reason, so there’s no point in me responding to you any further on this topic.
It doesn't matter which timeline we're discussing. It's all Star Trek. The Enterprise-J (in its timeline) was the 11th (probably) vessel with a 1701 registry. We don't know when the J-timeline 1701 was launched, but it had to be late 22nd century at the earliest, probably closer to mid-23rd century as in other, more familiar timelines.
We have about 11 ships in about 300 years. That's all any statement about the Enterprise-J means. No need to get into arguments over temporal mechanics, which don't have anything whatsoever to do with starship registration.
I disagree. Something as cataclysmic as the Sphere Builders expanding the Delphic Expanse from the 22nd century onwards would make that universe and the prime universe completely incompatible, in my opinion. Each new Enterprise from the NCC-1701 onward would have been built expressly for the war effort, and would probably not have survived as long as its prime universe counterpart. We’re already into the start of the 25th century by the time of PIC, and for all we know the Enterprise-E is still in service. It’s possible that Starfleet could have built five more Enterprises in the span of one century, but it’s also possible that one Enterprise could have lasted for 100 years.
agreed - discussions with certain people are usually pointless. I'm done with your posts.
The Prime Time gives us 6 ships in at least 136 years (2245 to 2381). Double that (12 ships by about 2507) and you're pretty on set to have a matching pattern between Prime Time and the J-timeline. It seems that the J-timeline ships lasted longer or were safer than the Prime Time ships.
The Yelchins could very well have had some 100-year-old ships, unlike every Enterprise ever seen (longest seems to be the original at 40 years, possibly beaten by the Ent-B, but not by much), and they could've had some very long gaps. Maybe some Admiral decided to christen the Yelchin-A only in 2855 or something, after centuries of being forgotten and rediscovered through some means.
We don't know. There are too many questions, to make an accurate presumption.
The Yelchins could very well have had some 100-year-old ships, unlike every Enterprise ever seen (longest seems to be the original at 40 years, possibly beaten by the Ent-B, but not by much), and they could've had some very long gaps. Maybe some Admiral decided to christen the Yelchin-A only in 2855 or something, after centuries of being forgotten and rediscovered through some means.
We don't know. There are too many questions, to make an accurate presumption.
Who said they did? I thought Daniels just showed Archer a battle at Azati Prime, where the sphere builders were attempting another incursion. I haven't seen the episode in 15 years or so, but I remember none of that.
The thing that always got me about the Battle of Procyon V was the fact that a Dauntless-type starship was in the fleet alongside the E-J. That was a completely fake ship that was set up as a honeypot to trap Voyager into thinking they had a way home. Why would Starfleet even adopt that design? And even if they did, it would be a 200 year old design by the time of the events seen in Azati Prime. That never really sat well with me and it always made me think that alternate future was pretty damn broken, taking the E-J along with it.
Although I will say that the Universe class has grown on me since I’ve been flying it in STO for the past year. That thing is a BEAST! But steers like a cow.
Although I will say that the Universe class has grown on me since I’ve been flying it in STO for the past year. That thing is a BEAST! But steers like a cow.
How do you figure that? Daniels did not state that the battle was due to the spare builders expanding the expanse for 400 years.
All he said was, It was the final battle against the sphere builder's attempts to gain a foothold in our universe.
My point? It's entirely possible after their defeat in the 22nd century; they regrouped and tried again in the 26th century, and the Federation (Of which the Xindi were now a member world) defeated them for the final time (IE - between then and the 31st century, the sphere builders never returned.)
Daniels states that by the 26th century (of presumably the universe that Daniels came from), the Expanse had expanded to 50,000 light years from its original 2,000 LY in the 22nd century. Not only does that imply that the Expanse expanded over time to get that large (which didn’t happen in the prime universe), but after the Sphere Builders were defeated in the 22nd century, the Expanse no longer existed. Therefore what Daniels showed Archer was just one possible future, in an alternate universe where the Federation didn’t stop the Expanse from growing and was at war with the Sphere Builders. That universe ceased to exist when Archer defeated the Sphere Builders.
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But, Daniels stated the Federation WON that battle. It's implied if Archer DOESN'T stop the Sphere Builders (and their expanse) in the 22nd century; the Federation itself will never exist - and thus the 26th century battle that drove the Sphere Builders back into their realm for good, will never happen.
But that’s only the history Daniels knows from his timeline. After Archer ultimately defeats the Sphere Builders, the Expanse disappears, and the Sphere Builders are driven back to their realm in the 22nd century, not the 26th. So in the prime timeline, the Expanse never expanded, and the Federation never went to war with the Sphere Builders, regardless of whether they won the war or not in Daniel’s timeline.
Their incursion in the 22nd Century was because they saw they would lose in the 26th.
They didn't exist in the 22nd Century of Daniel's timeline.
They appeared somewhere/time else after the Federation of that timeline was formed.
And therefore by doing what they did in the 22nd century (and ultimately being defeated by Archer), the future we saw in the 26th century never happened in the prime timeline. Thats why Daniels stated that the Xindi attack wasn’t supposed to happen; because it didn’t happen in his timeline, but the Battle of Azati Prime did.
