Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 3x06 - "Scavengers"

[Photoman15]

They jettisoned Nhan to man USS Trotsky last week. Otherwise she would've been the new XO .

My guess it would likely be either Culber or Stamets.

Huh? First, Culber is a doctor, not in the command division. I think Stamets is classified in Science and/or Engineering. Neither of them would be First Officer. It'll go to either Tilly (outside chance) or the girl who was given the conn last week (forgot her name).

 

[Campe]

Huh? First, Culber is a doctor, not in the command division. I think Stamets is classified in Science and/or Engineering. Neither of them would be First Officer. It'll go to either Tilly (outside chance) or the girl who was given the conn last week (forgot her name).

Nilsson.

 

[RAMA]

SMG has made some comments offscreen about how Michael is not entirely sure that Starfleet is right for her any longer. I wonder if we're working towards her exiting the main character by the end of the season?



Except we have absolutely no reason to suspect it was a deliberate attack, rather than some accidental thing that just happened (with or without input from sentient beings).

It's like presuming because an asteroid falls on your house and destroyed it some alien decided to make it land exactly there.

The only reason we have to believe this is the Producers themselves, who say there is an adversary here. Whether they took advantage of something occurring already or caused it or facilitated IS pretty important to discover. Also, if the UFP recovers only to fall prey to this same adversary? Yeah, you kind of want to know what the source is.

it is possible Burnham's story will deviate from Discovery. She may have parallel or side adventures without the crew in season 4, and yes, we may see her totally out of Starfleet by the end. All pretty unusual and interesting developments for a Trek character.

I believe her time away influenced her in this direction and reinforced what her personality already was...a risk-taker. I also believe we may see a few flashbacks still of their time together.

RAMA

 

[Romulan_spy]

I think I would have preferred it if Michael had not violated orders. Instead, have Michael and Saru take Book's message to Vance and have Vance approve Michael's side mission. I would have liked to see Michael at least try to follow Starfleet rules instead of so casually throwing them out at the first chance she gets.

 

[RAMA]

I think I would have preferred it if Michael had not violated orders. Instead, have Michael and Saru take Book's message to Vance and have Vance approve Michael's side mission. I would have liked to see Michael at least try to follow Starfleet rules instead of so casually throwing them out at the first chance she gets.

Well...Vance's orders are "safe" and cautious". If this were Kirk we'd be cheering him for breaking orders to find out what the fuck is going on...but because it's Burnham (and her "Cowboy Diplomacy", 23rd century ways)...its a problem for some. A shame.

RAMA

 

[eschaton]

The only reason we have to believe this is the Producers themselves, who say there is an adversary here. Whether they took advantage of something occurring already or caused it or facilitated IS pretty important to discover. Also, if the UFP recovers only to fall prey to this same adversary? Yeah, you kind of want to know what the source is.

If we need to rely upon off-camera comments from the producers and weird clairvoyant actions by the main character to decipher the seasonal arc, it's a sign of bad writing. They set up a scenario where the threat was simply too obscure for a reasonable person to suspect it without weird metaknowledge, and decided to not tip off the viewers that something is up for some reason.

Edit: All we needed was a brief scene of something like a gloved hand pressing a button, and ships blowing up in like the first episode or something. That would be enough to let us know as the viewers something is afoot without giving away the mystery box in total.

 

[KirkusOveractus]

I think I would have preferred it if Michael had not violated orders. Instead, have Michael and Saru take Book's message to Vance and have Vance approve Michael's side mission. I would have liked to see Michael at least try to follow Starfleet rules instead of so casually throwing them out at the first chance she gets.

Which is funny, given how there are so many overblown bits of dialogue from her about what Starfleet is or what the Federation is, but yet she doesn't demonstrate it at all.

And reading these, "Oh, but Kirk would have done that, blah blah blah..." Um, no. Kirk didn't plunge Starfleet into a full scale war (in fact, prevented it in some cases) or endanger his ship and crew unnecessarily. Kirk bent rules when there was shortsightedness in the orders or mission, but I don't remember him running off like Burnham has done over the series.

 

[fireproof78]

Well...Vance's orders are "safe" and cautious". If this were Kirk we'd be cheering him for breaking orders to find out what the fuck is going on...but because it's Burnham (and her "Cowboy Diplomacy", 23rd century ways)...its a problem for some. A shame.

RAMA

Exactly. Shes a 23rd century officer, like Janeway described.

Also, since no one knows what caused tte Burn assuming it was a possible attack is not unreasonable for the characters.

 

[eschaton]

Going back to the narrative issue with the Burn, there's also "show not tell."

So far, the only reason we have to believe that the Burn is some ongoing problem which affects the Federation is because Michael Burnham told us so. There has been zero evidence onscreen it actually is an ongoing issue. There were plenty of ways they could have dealt with this within the narrative of the show - like having the remaining dilithium continue to be unreliable and likely to crack or burn out at the worst moments. But they have chosen to display a galaxy that - post Burn - is in political chaos, but technologically seems just fine.

 

[fireproof78]

What we've seen so far indicates there is more to the Burn to learn.

 

[Jadeb]

Well...Vance's orders are "safe" and cautious". If this were Kirk we'd be cheering him for breaking orders to find out what the fuck is going on...but because it's Burnham (and her "Cowboy Diplomacy", 23rd century ways)...its a problem for some. A shame.

A better analogy might be Spock's mutiny to take Pike to Talos IV. But here there was no compelling reason for Burnham to mutiny (again) and abandon her captain, her ship and her crew. There's no real evidence that finding out what went on 100 years ago will have any concrete benefit, but there's clear evidence that Burnham can't be relied on to put her ship and crew above her own desires and impulses.

SMG has made some comments offscreen about how Michael is not entirely sure that Starfleet is right for her any longer. I wonder if we're working towards her exiting the main character by the end of the season?

I don't think Burnham is leaving the show. Starfleet, maybe briefly. We got foreshadowing for that with the badge removal at the end of the episode. But I expect she'll be back for a tearful reunion and a nice speech before long, after she's been proved right and fixed the Federation.

 

[Romulan_spy]

Going back to the narrative issue with the Burn, there's also "show not tell."

So far, the only reason we have to believe that the Burn is some ongoing problem which affects the Federation is because Michael Burnham told us so. There has been zero evidence onscreen it actually is an ongoing issue. There were plenty of ways they could have dealt with this within the narrative of the show - like having the remaining dilithium continue to be unreliable and likely to crack or burn out at the worst moments. But they have chosen to display a galaxy that - post Burn - is in political chaos, but technologically seems just fine.

Good points. As far as we can tell, Starfleet has not lost its values. And sure, there is political chaos after the Burn which is understandable but it seems like Starfleet and the Federation will be able to rebuild just fine on their own. It will just take time. Michael is the one that insists that they have to solve the mystery of the Burn right away and must restore the Federation exactly to what it was before the Burn as soon as possible. I think solving the Burn is her way of feeling useful and giving her life purpose. And restoring the Federation is her way of trying to make the world go back to something more comfortable. It is her way of coping with the loss of being 930 years into the future.

 

[eschaton]

What we've seen so far indicates there is more to the Burn to learn.

It's a big mystery, true, but there are so many possibilities:

1. It was an entirely natural phenomena
2. It was something that happened due to an accident (scientific experiment, some sort of "subspace pollution," etc.)
3. It was deliberate, but by some being beyond the abilities of Starfleet to deal with (Q or some other godlike energy being)
4. It was deliberate, but whoever was responsible is long since dead, and there is no continued threat.
5. It was deliberate, and whoever us responsible is still out there, a threat, and can do it again.

Only in two cases would it possibly matter to the Federation. In the second case, so whatever mistake happened doesn't repeat (this is where I hope they are going). And of course the fifth case. But there are lots of potential scenarios where it's clearly not an ongoing threat.

 

[Campe]

I don't think Burnham is leaving the show. Starfleet, maybe briefly. We got foreshadowing for that with the badge removal at the end of the episode. But I expect she'll be back for a tearful reunion and a nice speech before long, after she's been proved right and fixed the Federation.

Agreed wholeheartedly. She may even have the opportunity to come back at the end of the season and not take it. All may not be 100% right as we enter season four. But a few episodes down the line, she'll be back on Disco.

 

[fireproof78]

It's a big mystery, true, but there are so many possibilities:

1. It was an entirely natural phenomena
2. It was something that happened due to an accident (scientific experiment, some sort of "subspace pollution," etc.)
3. It was deliberate, but by some being beyond the abilities of Starfleet to deal with (Q or some other godlike energy being)
4. It was deliberate, but whoever was responsible is long since dead, and there is no continued threat.
5. It was deliberate, and whoever us responsible is still out there, a threat, and can do it again.

Only in two cases would it possibly matter to the Federation. In the second case, so whatever mistake happened doesn't repeat (this is where I hope they are going). And of course the fifth case. But there are lots of potential scenarios where it's clearly not an ongoing threat.

But they don't know and appear to be living in survival mode. Vance states they don't have the resources to investigate further and haven't since it happened. Even if it isn't an ongoing threat, it clearly impacts their ability to function.

 

[eschaton]

But they don't know and appear to be living in survival mode. Vance states they don't have the resources to investigate further and haven't since it happened. Even if it isn't an ongoing threat, it clearly impacts their ability to function.

I can understand that, but the other part of the "mystery" is it stretches credulity that no one has had the resources to look into this for the past century. Presuming this is a galaxy-wide issue, there were what - quadrillions of sentient lifeforms affected? Maybe more. Why did it take a century, and why does it have to be Michael?

 

[fireproof78]

I can understand that, but the other part of the "mystery" is it stretches credulity that no one has had the resources to look into this for the past century. Presuming this is a galaxy-wide issue, there were what - quadrillions of sentient lifeforms affected? Maybe more. Why did it take a century, and why does it have to be Michael?

Because they were surviving.

 

[eschaton]

Because they were surviving.

Everyone, everywhere? In the whole galaxy there wasn't a single polity that came through relatively unscathed?

 

[fireproof78]

Everyone, everywhere? In the whole galaxy there wasn't a single polity that came through relatively unscathed?

Apparently. Remains to be seen.

 

[KennyB]

On second watch......if it took Grudge 3 weeks to reach Discovery how did Burnham make it there and back so fast?