Spoilers Batwoman - Season 1

[Qonundrum]

That's the result of review bombing by people with agendas.

Plenty of agendas exist on both extremer sides of the gamut. The funny part might be if they're both being trolled by the show.

Take the Captain Marvel movie for example, it had more negative reviews, (like thousands) before the movie had even opened than any other MCU movie had gotten overall the entire time they had been reviewable.

Because CM didn't have the entire Avengers saga to help prop it up beforehand? Without the Avengers saga in existence, would CM have gotten the same figures? No, like me nobody knows. But it's a poor correlation to suggest, that CM did oh-so-well solely because of hate reviews and not because of its place in the franchise.

As for ratings, it's like saying "50 million smokers can't be wrong!" A cliched line but often true nonetheless. But always listen to most opinions across the gamut, regardless if one agrees or not. What they say doesn't always equate to what one believes they say. One always hears what one wants. That's what some of these review sites seem to be about.

 

[Christopher]

But it's a poor correlation to suggest, that CM did oh-so-well solely because of hate reviews and not because of its place in the franchise.

Whaaa? Turtletrekker wasn't even remotely saying that CM did well because of the hate reviews -- on the contrary, the point was that the hate reviews had no relation to its actual performance or popularity, because they were the artificial result of a small bloc of misogynists making a coordinated effort to drive down the review score, as they have done lately with every major action movie with female leads.

 

[theenglish]

The hate reviews were far outweighed by the Marvel brand. People can complain all they want but the MCU has built an audience because it produces solid, entertaining films--that audiences have faith enough in so that they return to the cinema again and again. Think Amazon. Amazon became what it is because it provides a quality service and stands behind that service.

People can complain all they want but both franchises are successful because they have earned the support of their customers. As long as they do that they will thrive.

Captain Marvel was a solid entry in the MCU and only built upon that customer satisfaction.

 

[John Clark]

Well, (unless I've missed mention elsewhere), E4 has apparently got it for the UK according to the C4 site.
Bet they won't air in time for it to match with Crisis on Sky though.

(Harley Quinn is joining it too)

 

[Morpheus 02]

The days of great and/or memorable TV theme music are long gone. The Walking Dead 's main theme was--probably--the last time a truly memorable (and unique) theme was created for a TV series, and that's now a decade old.

Interesting... this DOES kinda feel true... I guess what, Game of Thrones maybe more recent? But again, that too is many years old

 

[JD]

DC's websites has posted an interview with Meagan Tandy, there's nothing real revealing in it, but it's still worth a read.

 

[thribs]

That twist at the end.
It was okay but having Batwoman reveal her sexuality seems like a very bad idea. I agree with Luke. Just makes it easier for people to connect Batwoman with Kate.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Batwoman
Season 1 - Episode 10 - "How Queer Everything is Today!"

Kate/BW: The entire "problem" of thinking she's living a lie was silly. Aside form the clear-as-day first meaning of this "lie" sub-plot, she already understands that being a costumed vigilante means she cannot--by the very nature of that kind of job--share her private life for...I don't know...reasons such as her enemies would target everyone in her private life...reduce her ability to be an effective crimefighter. The usual.

"I live in shadows, I wear a disguise and let people believe I'm dating Captain America." Ah, a stunt reference and much like stunt cameos, it does not mean a Marvel character or a Marvel universe exists in this world. Its just a one-off, fun reference. Nothing more.

Luke: As always, its great to see his growing bond with Kate. He's so protective of her, and his birthday cupcake was a sweet gesture. They successfully bookend each other more than they know.

Mary: A bit more tolerable this week.

Alice / Mouse: For the first time, Alice's back-and-forth with Kate makes little sense--even for a psychopath. There's no advantage in "breaking down" Kate into exposing herself, and as noted earlier about Kate, even Alice knows that being a costumed vigilante is--or should be--more than just some game or career choice for Kate. As much as her Alice ID is a part of who she is, Batwoman should be a part of Kate in the way Batman was for Bruce Wayne. In other words, the natural "other half" of her personality.

Alice being arrested...yep that's going to last. Just waiting for Mouse to do something...

"Alt-Alice"--obviously a result of COIE, which promises appearances from other doubles across the CW shows (e.g., Brainy). Smart money is on "Alt-Alice" either being used/corrupted by the real Alice (like being set up to be the target for all who want to bring her to justice and/or kill her--like her father) or losing her life.

Jacob: Pretty rough seeing him in prison, along with the expected taunting from fellow inmates, and on that note, I'm hoping he does not become a target for revenge...

If he survives to see the Alice double, I wonder if he will focus on her--as a way of restoring his lost relationship. Better question is what kind of relationship/family past does she come from.

Sophie: Betraying Tyler and her identity issues triggering her angry reactions could be seen coming a mile away, but her trying to relate to Mary's loss by referencing it was a "WTF" moment if ever there was one.

NOTES: The Parker Torres identity issue sub-plot was waayyy too on the nose (yeah, we get it--its actually referring to you-know-who), and above all else, someone attempting to harm the innocent because of her problems is no excuse nor will it ever make her a sympathetic "victim".. She needed to be arrested on the spot/eventually jailed, not get a mere 150 hours of community service.

Too early to know how the post-COIE doubles issue will impact this series, but I hope it has minimal effect; I missed the grit and darkness of this show, which does not mix well with multiverses and doppelgangers.

GRADE: B.

 

[DEWLine]

Parker Torres: she's still a minor for one thing. How she gets handled would depend on the prosecutor assigned to the case for another. Even in Gotham, there's such a thing as bad PR.

 

[Skipper]

because they were the artificial result of a small bloc of misogynists making a coordinated effort to drive down the review score, as they have done lately with every major action movie with female leads.

With the unfortunate exception of Battle Angel Alita... MRA people loved it... Now I feel dirty because I didn't dislike it...
How Alita: Battle Angel Found an Unlikely Fanbase in MRA Trolls

Aside form the clear-as-day first meaning of this "lie" sub-plot, she already understands that being a costumed vigilante means she cannot--by the very nature of that kind of job--share her private life for...I don't know...reasons such as her enemies would target everyone in her private life...reduce her ability to be an effective crimefighter. The usual.

It's a little off-topic, but this was the reason why Pre-Crisis Comics Superman didn't reveal his secret identity to Lois Lane of his friends too. The problem was that Clark Kent and Superman had virtually exactly the same friends. I don't know how many times some super-villain kidnapped the Daily Planet staff to lure Superman in some overcomplicated trap. And he was quite unique in the superhero business in this almost perfect overlapping between the people who he frequented in his both personas. Bruce Wayne didn't spend his free time with Commissioner Gordon or Spider-Man didn't have the five o'clock tea with aunt May.

PreCrisis Superman was a dick.

 

[Christopher]

Well, so far Batwoman's world is barely changed post-Crisis, aside from that big twist at the end, presumably. The main fallout is personal, with Kate wrestling with what being the Paragon of Courage means when she's hiding herself. Other than that, the only real post-Crisis touch was seeing that Catco exists in Kate's world now. It's a nice touch that Kate went to Kara Danvers for the interview where Batwoman outed herself. It shows their friendship is ongoing. (The magazine cover also mentioned Lena Luthor and STAR Labs. STAR Labs was on Batwoman's Earth before, but this is the first time the show has really acknowledged the larger Arrowverse.)

It's a cute touch that the "Captain America" cop the public shipped Batwoman with was named Slam Bradley. Bradley was a Detective Comics character even before Batman was, debuting in the very first issue of the title and co-created by Superman's creators Siegel & Shuster. He was a two-fisted private eye rather than a cop, though. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slam_Bradley

The problem was that Clark Kent and Superman had virtually exactly the same friends. I don't know how many times some super-villain kidnapped the Daily Planet staff to lure Superman in some overcomplicated trap. And he was quite unique in the superhero business in this almost perfect overlapping between the people who he frequented in his both personas. Bruce Wayne didn't spend his free time with Commissioner Gordon or Spider-Man didn't have the five o'clock tea with aunt May.

Oh, there were lots of comics heroes who followed the Superman template and its "love triangle" dynamic between the hero, their civilian identity, and their love interest who constantly associated with both -- see Green Lantern and Carol Ferris (who was also his supervillainess Star Sapphire), Flash and Iris West, Wonder Woman and Steve Trevor, etc. After all, it's basic economy of storytelling -- there isn't room to have two separate supporting casts for the lead character's two identities. Especially not back in the Golden and Silver Ages when comics stories were shorter and there were two or more stories per issue.

And in fact, Bruce Wayne did hang out with Commissioner Gordon, or at least he used to. Literally the first page of the first Batman story ever written shows Gordon hanging out with Bruce and inexplicably inviting his dissolute socialite friend to join him at a crime scene. And on the '60s TV show, Bruce and Gordon were friends who often socialized, and in season 3, Bruce and Barbara Gordon were dating, at least tentatively.

 

[Greg Cox]

As I recall, Catwoman and Slam Bradley had an affair in the comics several years ago.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

It's a little off-topic, but this was the reason why Pre-Crisis Comics Superman didn't reveal his secret identity to Lois Lane of his friends too. The problem was that Clark Kent and Superman had virtually exactly the same friends. I don't know how many times some super-villain kidnapped the Daily Planet staff to lure Superman in some overcomplicated trap. And he was quite unique in the superhero business in this almost perfect overlapping between the people who he frequented in his both personas. Bruce Wayne didn't spend his free time with Commissioner Gordon or Spider-Man didn't have the five o'clock tea with aunt May.

True. What kind of hero would have his or her costumed and private life so connected in this world of constant information exchange / threats to personal security? It would be a supervillain's dream to face heroes who blur the lines of their lives.

 

[dahj]

So MCU existing in the Arrowverse evidently survived the Crisis

Mary should have a chat with Barry on account of the whole father wrongfully imprisoned for murdering mother thing and also because he's good at this sort of thing, and also because he's a CSI who could have a look see at the case, and also have there been any shapeshifters on The Flash and also if Martian Manhunter's now a part of this Earth wouldn't the public be aware of people with shapeshifting abilities to just dismiss Mary's claims out of hand and I've gone on overthought the whole thing, haven't I?

Here's that lovely cover then:

 

[Guy Gardener]

The Winter issue?

4 issues a year.

Its a new universe and print media is already dying.

 

[Christopher]

and also have there been any shapeshifters on The Flash and also if Martian Manhunter's now a part of this Earth wouldn't the public be aware of people with shapeshifting abilities to just dismiss Mary's claims out of hand and I've gone on overthought the whole thing, haven't I?

Yeah, that occurred to me too when the doctor dismissed human-skin masks as "science fiction." The world he lives on has both aliens and metahumans as familiar presences now, so something like Mission: Impossible masks should barely set off the weirdness meter.

Oh, not to mention that Lena introduced image inducers a couple of years ago, so anyone on Earth-Prime should be able to buy a holographic face-changing gizmo from LuthorCorp (since Lex changed the name back when he rewrote history, as we saw in last night's Supergirl).

Ugh, I knew that merging the Earths would create a ton of continuity problems, just as it did in the comics.

Here's that lovely cover then:

I worry what such a clear photo of Batwoman would allow someone to do with a good facial recognition program. Or what that photo of her utility belt would let them deduce about her capabilities.

Also, it seems a bit contrived to put the name of the interviewer on the cover along with the subject, but Kara did win the Pulitzer last year, so that could explain it.

 

[Skipper]

True. What kind of hero would have his or her costumed and private life so connected in this world of constant information exchange / threats to personal security? It would be a supervillain's dream to face heroes who blur the lines of their lives.

I recently read some Superman stories just before the reboot, and the people of the Daily Planet were really his friends. Perry White, for example, was having problems with his wife and confiding in him. But in the meantime they were also friends with Clark Kent! So he constantly lied and endangered people who had placed their trust in him (in both his personas).

Yeah, this is Truth, Justice, and the American Way for you.

 

[Greg Cox]

So MCU existing in the Arrowverse evidently survived the Crisis

Mary should have a chat with Barry on account of the whole father wrongfully imprisoned for murdering mother thing and also because he's good at this sort of thing, and also because he's a CSI who could have a look see at the case, and also have there been any shapeshifters on The Flash and also if Martian Manhunter's now a part of this Earth wouldn't the public be aware of people with shapeshifting abilities to just dismiss Mary's claims out of hand and I've gone on overthought the whole thing, haven't I?

Here's that lovely cover then:

Thanks for posting that cover. I missed that the story was by Kara when it flashed up briefly on our TV screen.

Speaking of which, am I the only person who gets annoyed when modern TV shows expect us to be able read people's text messages when the characters glance at them on TV. I always have to rewind, pause, then get up from the couch and go squint at the TV from a few inches away--just to get a vital plot point.

I get that people communicate by text these days--and may even text important messages to each other, but do shows have to assume that we can read some tiny little letters on the screen while looking over the character's shoulders? And I have a reasonably big screen at home. How on earth are you supposed to follow the plot if you're watching an ep on your phone or laptop or something?

Some shows have texts pop up in bubbles on screen, which are easier to read, IMHO.

Anyway, end of rant, although I find this is very much a staple of CW shows in particular. (Looking at you, RIVERDALE, NANCY DREW, etc.)

 

[DEWLine]

The one doctor we saw on-camera talking with Mary is living in denial. If they're interested in following up on why...that could be fun viewing.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Double truth.

If every one is confiding in Superman and Clark Kent, to spare his sanity, Clark has to make one of his persona's a bit of a dick.