Dropped storylines
- Thread starter Kor
- Start date
I wonder whether a year was really enough time to make any difference though. I mean, if you get a year's notice of a threat but it takes at least two years to make any significant changes in technology, then...well...
I guess it may have been enough time to at least warn people of the possible threat, though for the average joe being warned of a potential Borg threat is akin to being warned of hurricanes or tsunami.
I guess it may have been enough time to at least warn people of the possible threat, though for the average joe being warned of a potential Borg threat is akin to being warned of hurricanes or tsunami.
I always thought Tasha was cool character and security officer, but I do understand the criticism.
Sela seemed hateful just for the sake of being hateful.
I also have to wonder why in the world would Sela look exactly Tasha and sound exactly like Tasha. Never really paid attention to it at first, but once you notice it, it does seem flaky.
Poor Denise. She thought TNG wasn't going anywhere so she left to become a film superstar.
12 months later TNG's star was rising and Denise's was...not rising. Her Wikipedia page is grim reading indeed for someone who did six months on Star Trek in 1987 and left to do greater things. Compare and contrast the length of the 'Star Trek' and 'post Star Trek' sections
But look, it's 2019 and thirty years have passed and it's great to see she's not at all bitter
If only she stuck it out like Lavar and Gates and some of the others. Eventually they all got a number episodes dedicated to them and today they're pretty much iconic.
TNG was way better at featuring the supporting characters than TOS. And I usually tend to criticize TNG for being a little hollow and two dimensional with its style.
You've also got to remember that Q had an interest in Picard specifically, and Riker to some extent. By sending the Enterprise out in 'Q Who' he made Picard a person of interest to the Borg, which ultimately lead to Picard's assimilation, rescue by Riker, and defeat of the Borg thanks to Picard's experience.
I hope Q wasn't expecting Picard to thank him for his Locutus experience. 
It is a bit of a double-edged sword though...Janeway "thanks" Q for introducing the Federation to the Borg, but if the Feds had run into them more naturally, things might have gone much worse. But we don't know when that might have happened in general...
Of course, later Trek episodes make it feel like it was much more predestined to occur, but those are retcons.
It is a bit of a double-edged sword though...Janeway "thanks" Q for introducing the Federation to the Borg, but if the Feds had run into them more naturally, things might have gone much worse. But we don't know when that might have happened in general...
Of course, later Trek episodes make it feel like it was much more predestined to occur, but those are retcons.
Also, Q got into alot of trouble for the Borg incident. He lost his Qmanity because of it.
Eh, he was already on the outs with the Continuum before that. Remember, he originally approached Picard about joining the Enterprise crew for that very reason, and it was only after Picard spurned him that he arranged an introduction between the Enterprise and the Borg.
Then again, as Q later yelled at his son, the Continuum does have a standing policy against provoking the Borg, so maybe that incident did indeed play a part in Q being stripped of his powers.
I always assumed that the "Don't provoke the Borg" line from Q in Q2 was a direct reference to his own provocation in Q Who, that led to his own loss of power (admittedly, as a "final straw" of sorts), and the near-destruction of his favorite race and object of affection.
Also, Q and Guinan have a history. Guinan, who comes from a culture of refugees nearly-assimilated by the Borg 100 years prior. Probably not a coincidence. The Borg probably weren't created by Q, but seem to have benefitted from Q's generosity on multiple occasions.
Also, Q and Guinan have a history. Guinan, who comes from a culture of refugees nearly-assimilated by the Borg 100 years prior. Probably not a coincidence. The Borg probably weren't created by Q, but seem to have benefitted from Q's generosity on multiple occasions.
Yeah, we can sometimes bend over backwards to come up with convoluted explanations for every single discrepancy in the franchise when a lot of times it's best to chalk things up as mistakes or inconsistencies and move on.
Yeah. There I'm sure they were just following what "Space Seed" said when Kirk says that they estimate that the Botany Bay was drifting for two centuries. The timeline wasn't rigidly nailed down in the first season of TOS and even in TWOK the most they'd really established was that it was "In the 23rd Century..."
Very true. It just annoys me that we readily discount Data's "Class of '78" line from "Encounter at Farpoint" because it doesn't jibe with TNG's later-established chronology, but McCoy's age of 137 from the same episode is somehow written in stone, even though it makes McCoy under 40 at the beginning of TOS.
I like this explanation. It's simple, logical, and it doesn't require some convoluted-but-never-again-mentioned encounter between Khan and the Klingons before he meets Kirk.
Yeah, I really wish they could've crossed that T. The Kelvinverse films could use another movie to tie off their story threads.
Oh, that's beautiful.But look, it's 2019 and thirty years have passed and it's great to see she's not at all bitter
Wow.That's really hilariousBut look, it's 2019 and thirty years have passed and it's great to see she's not at all bitter
...but I regret scrolling down. It appears that hundreds and hundreds of people believe that a satanic villain named @berman_rick spontaneously fired Denise Crosby without cause because he hates strong women, then publicly humiliated her either out of pure malice or to express his male dominance.
hmm, this train of thought just made me have an idea. The borg hit the neutral zone outposts and learn about the federation, including the range of their farthest exploration. So then when Q sends the Ent into the delta quadrant it becomes n even larger mystery for the borg since they wouldn't have expected a federation ship for decadesAh, OK. Interesting! An issue remains, though - why did Q have to shove the Enterprise thousands of light years away to encounter the Borg, when they were already in Federation space, destroying outposts? Doesn't really track. Or maybe I'm missing something.
agreed, I overlook it due to it being he pilot.
Now Riker claiming to have reviewed Data's record, but then asks if he rank is honorary can't be overlooked as easily
I think a novel does speculate that the Borg were aware of the Feds after the Neutral Zone excursion but considered them non-remarkable. But when the E-D suddenly pops up in the DQ, they become very interesting to the Borg because it's entirely unexpected and makes the Borg (erroneously) reassess them.
If Q did bring the Federation to the Borg's attention in that sense, then he really does have a bit to answer for.
Everything that is in canon is in canon. If one canon statement appears to contradict 100 canon statements it is better to explain why there actually is no contradiction than to simply say it its a writer's mistake and move on.
Admiral Bennett's line cannot be ignored. The proper thing to do is to decide Kirk and Khan said that Khan was from Earth's past between 100 and 300 (presumably Earth years) years (interpreting two centuries as broadly as possible) in their past, and then, about 100 years later, Admiral Bennett said that Khan was from between 100 and 300 years (interpreting 200 years as broadly as possible) of an unspecified type in Admiral Bennett's past.
If one assumes that Khan was in suspended animation for exactly 200 Earth years, and that Admiral Bennett was speaking exactly 100 Earth years later, or exactly 300 years since Khan left Earth, then there could be as wide a range as 100 to 300 years of an unspecified type in those 300 Earth years. Thus those unspecified years that Admiral Bennett used could be between 1.00 and 3.00 Earth years long.
I'm pretty sure that a planet naturally habitable for humans could not have a year hundreds or thousands of Earth years long. But I am almost as certain that it would be possible for a Human settled planet to have years two or three Earth years long. If Khan actually left Earth 314.5 years before Bennett spoke, and if Bennett meant that event was 264.3 years of his colony planet in the past, the years of his colony planet would be about 1.1899 Earth years long, and Admiral Bennett slipped up and thought about the time span in years of his colony planet instead of in Earth Standard years.
Admiral Morrow may have made a similar mistake in Star trek III: The Search for Spock , forgetting to translate the years he was used to using mentally into the standard (Earth?) years most Starfleet member used.
What you fail to realize is that the timeline has not yet been established. As for Khan's statement, in "Space Seed" they believed Khan left in the early 1990s of the calendar they were using, and said that was 200 years earlier. If that 200 years was between 100 and 300 years, the date of "Space seed" would be between 2090 and 2293.333 in the calendar used in "Space Seed". Later they discovered that Khan ruled a large part of Earth between 1992 and 1996 in that calendar.
In Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan both Khan and Kirk claim it is 15 years since "Space Seed", thus putting the movie sometime in the period between about 2105 and 2308.333. Khan says:
So Khan says the Botany Bay left Earth in year 1996 of the Space Seed" calendar. Then he says that:
If that refers to the period from 1992 to 1996 when Khan ruled over millions of people, then the possible date range of Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan would be between 2092 and 2296.
Note that Khan said his people swore to obey him 200 years before Captain Terrell was born. Since Terrell should have been somewhere between 30 and 60 years old, if Khan's people swore allegiance to him 100 to 300 years earlier, that would have been between 130 and 360 years before the movie. If the augments swore allegiance to Khan between 1992 and 1996, Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan 130 to 360 years later would sometime between 2122 and 2356.
Thus the three possible date ranges for Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan are: 2105 to 2308.333, 2092 to 2296, and 2122 to 2356. The date range where all three overlap is between 2122 and 2296. In the calendar used in "Space Seed", of course.
I don't discount Data's "Class of '78" line but consider it to be canon and proof that a new Earth calendar was introduced in early seasons of TNG. As for McCoy's age:
So Starfleet records list McCoy's age as 137 years. But Data didn't say whether they had to allow for any science fictional types of events which might have made McCoy live more or fewer years than the number of years since he was born. It should be obvious that in Star Trek a character can be older or younger than the number of yeas since their birth, and so being 137 years old does not necessarily mean being born 137 years earlier.
And it is possible that McCoy was born 137 years before "Encounter at Farpoint" and was, for example, 45 years old in the first season of TOS. That would make the first season of TOS happen 92 years before "Encounter at Farpoint", which might be possible. It doesn't matter what the official Star Trek chronology says, since it is merely official, and not canon and not necessarily correct.
Yes, I agree that Marla probably was interested in Klingons, considering her taste in men, and would know a lot about them. And Khan probably had Marla bring along some books, etc., about the Eugenics Wars, etc., so he could read what historians said about him. And I feel pretty certain that Khan learned the current date and thus how long he was in cold sleep aboard the Botany Bay from Marla.
Yeah, he really saved their asses.
Then again. Wouldn't they have had years and years to advance their technology?
There's something to be said about a dangerous threat coming that prompts leaps in technology.
As Picard said in the end, the Federation needed a kick in their complancency.
As Picard said in the end, the Federation needed a kick in their complancency.