Up close photos of the Picard Museum props

[Lance]

My take has been, based on details from Measure Of A Man, although I don't recall if they're from the broadcast version or the extended one, that Picard spent some considerable time in the 'wilderness' while the loss of Stargazer was investigated and Starfleet decided whether there were any charges to press. Perhaps he served aboard Reliant during this period, even if he wasn't her skipper.

 

[Boris Skrbic]

Picard didn’t mind serving 22 years on an obsolete ship like the Stargazer, so what would be more natural than returning for a while to an even older vessel he served on as an ensign?

 

[Timo]

Then again, the 22 years on the Stargazer are noncanon, too. What canon has is this being his first ship (so him coming aboard 22 yrs before her loss is plausible), plus his command in the mid-2350s. What he did in the intervening years is not stated - and the cut (thus noncanon) line from "Measure on a Man" would mean he left Stargazer early on to serve on Reliant...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Boris Skrbic]

Then again, the 22 years on the Stargazer are noncanon, too. What canon has is this being his first ship (so him coming aboard 22 yrs before her loss is plausible), plus his command in the mid-2350s. What he did in the intervening years is not stated - and the cut (thus noncanon) line from "Measure on a Man" would mean he left Stargazer early on to serve on Reliant...

Timo Saloniemi

In “Relics”, Picard says “The first ship I ever served aboard as Captain was called the Stargazer”, which does fit the 22-year span if we assume he didn’t spend a lot of time becoming one, or confuse the audience by pointing out his Meyerverse rank (like Captain Scott) and not his first command, which would come later.

 

[Kor]

I think there needs to be a word besides "humanitarian". So I turned to the thesaurus.

The words that come up are:

• altruistic
• charitable
• humane
• philanthropic
• good
• beneficent
• benevolent
• eleemosynary
• generous
• idealistic
• kindly
• public-spirited

Of these, I'd choose "philanthropist" to replace "humanitarian". Or if a word ending in "-ist" might be misconstrued negatively, I'd go with "altruistic".

So the "Klingon Planetary Altruism Award". Or maybe "Klingon Planetary Benevolence Award" but a warrior race would probably shy away from the word "benevolent". So Altruism gets my vote.

A more species-neutral term would make sense. "Humane" is still related to "human," though. Perhaps the "Klingane Society of Qo'noS" looks after abandoned and abused targs that need new homes.

I'm picturing Klingons from different charities getting into angry drunken brawls with each other over who is more benevolent and charitable.

Kor

 

[Tuskin38]

(USS Leondegrance is rather obviously Eavesian

...Heavily refined for this appearance. Basically, we see an Excelsior saucer coupled to an angular secondary hull that has warp nacelles and humungous impulse engines. FASA is rife with those, for its late 23rd or early 24th century; we have no competing information from onscreen sources, other than Excelsior saucers being a big thing during both the "NCC-2000-something era" and the early 24th century.

It's a refined version of this ship, made for a cancelled version of Star Trek Online.
https://johneaves.wordpress.com/2010/04/15/new-starships/

I don't see anything here that looks FASA, or early 24th Century. It's very late 24th century. The nacelles, bridge area and saucer shuttlebay come almost straight from the Sovereign class.

I coloured in the nacelle to show the similarity

 

[Dukhat]

1) There's nothing in the episode to suggest Picard was in command of "his" ship, any more than Tasha was of "hers".
2) There's no reason to think this was the Reliant anyway.
3) There's no reason to think Picard ever commanded a Reliant. The text on the knickknack only speaks of a "distinguished record of service" on that ship, for a man who in 2364 would have been formally known as Captain Picard.

All true. It’s just that the other awards seem very specific as to their dates. I just find it odd that if this was indeed the Reliant Picard served on as an ensign, that it took over 40 years for him to get this award. That’s like my 45 year old self suddenly getting an award for some artwork that I made when I was 5 years old.

...Heavily refined for this appearance. Basically, we see an Excelsior saucer coupled to an angular secondary hull that has warp nacelles and humungous impulse engines. FASA is rife with those, for its late 23rd or early 24th century; we have no competing information from onscreen sources, other than Excelsior saucers being a big thing during both the "NCC-2000-something era" and the early 24th century.

While it’s true that we’ve never seen the era of the 2320’s, we can extrapolate based on what we see later. It seems that between TUC (2293) and the Enterprise-C being destroyed (2344), there really wasn’t much change in the TMP-era starship lineage. It appears that between that 50 year span of time the fleet was made up mostly of Excelsiors, Mirandas, Constellations, and Oberths, with perhaps a sprinkling of Excelsior-component kitbashes that we saw in DS9, and the start of the more TNG-modern Ambassador class. This Sovereign-esque ship seems ridiculously out of place. Not to mention that the registry of NCC-2176 would place the construction date of the ship not long after the original Excelsior in 2286.

 

[Iamnotspock]

What he did in the intervening years is not stated - and the cut (thus noncanon) line from "Measure on a Man" would mean he left Stargazer early on to serve on Reliant...

Where does its reinsertion for the extended Blu-ray cut leave it, canonically?

 

[Dukhat]

Where does its reinsertion for the extended Blu-ray cut leave it, canonically?

If the scene was reinserted into the episode, and the episode was seen on screen, that makes it canon. Just like how the Jabba scene was reinserted into ANH (CGI Jabba effect notwithstanding).

 

[Timo]

Good question. I tend to think of TOS-R as the way TOS "really" happened, the new effects taking precedence over the old ones (even when the old ones perhaps were a better match of the dialogue or plot logic). But that's systematic. These "extensions" of movies or individual eps... I don't know. Often this material was originally cut for a reason.

All true. It’s just that the other awards seem very specific as to their dates. I just find it odd that if this was indeed the Reliant Picard served on as an ensign, that it took over 40 years for him to get this award. That’s like my 45 year old self suddenly getting an award for some artwork that I made when I was 5 years old.

As said, this could be because Picard has finally become famous. I doubt many of his shipmates got similar artwork on their shelves!

While it’s true that we’ve never seen the era of the 2320’s, we can extrapolate based on what we see later. It seems that between TUC (2293) and the Enterprise-C being destroyed (2344), there really wasn’t much change in the TMP-era starship lineage.

Well, an ungodly menagerie of Excelsior kitbashes appears at some point. It seems a bit unlikely that they would be separated from Excelsior proper by a gap as long as that suggested by the registry numbers. Rather, the registries would indicate the tail ends of the production runs, the survivors that soldier on in the 2360s.

This Sovereign-esque ship seems ridiculously out of place.

Only due to her nacelles, though - the saucer with the characteristic rim angle is just a saucer, the superstructure is very Excelsior-like, the big impulse engines are an Excelsior thing. (Essentially we're looking at the FASA Ambassador class, only with the saucer rather than the nacelles being copy-pasted from Excelsior.)

Is there a strip phaser there, or just a further bevel, to give the saucertop more complex contours, with a couple of phaser turrets where we can't see them? Squinting just right isn't difficult. The Eavesian notches in turn seem to be a Starfleet thing in the 2150s and 2250s in addition to the 2370s, so why not in the 2280s, too?

Not to mention that the registry of NCC-2176 would place the construction date of the ship not long after the original Excelsior in 2286.

Which I find a plus: Styles' ship needs a nacelles-down companion, and none of the DS9 kitbashes is unambiguously it.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[The Old Mixer]

I think there needs to be a word besides "humanitarian". So I turned to the thesaurus.

The words that come up are:

• altruistic
• charitable
• humane
• philanthropic
• good
• beneficent
• benevolent
• eleemosynary
• generous
• idealistic
• kindly
• public-spirited

Of these, I'd choose "philanthropist" to replace "humanitarian". Or if a word ending in "-ist" might be misconstrued negatively, I'd go with "altruistic".

So the "Klingon Planetary Altruism Award". Or maybe "Klingon Planetary Benevolence Award" but a warrior race would probably shy away from the word "benevolent". So Altruism gets my vote.

I think the only one of those that might be considered virtuous by Klingons would be “generous,” and I could be wrong about that.

 

[NewHeavensNewEarth]

I think the only one of those that might be considered virtuous by Klingons would be “generous,” and I could be wrong about that.

They'd probably be ok with "good," too.

 

[Timo]

The bit where the Betazoids think Picard is simply a good senior citizen still cracks me up.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Kor]

I think the only one of those that might be considered virtuous by Klingons would be “generous,” and I could be wrong about that.

In a feudal system, a Lord could ensure the loyalty of his underlings by being generous. It's probably similar with the Klingon Great Houses.

Kor

 

[The Old Mixer]

They'd probably be ok with "good," too.

Perhaps as it translates from Klingonese, in which it likely carries some culture-specific context quite dissimilar from that which Judeo-Christians would associate with the word.

 

[137th Gebirg]

“Good” in Klingon probably translates roughly to “well, at least it isn’t Targ shit”.

 

[Christopher]

Of these, I'd choose "philanthropist" to replace "humanitarian".

Except the "-anthrop-" part is from Greek anthropos, meaning "human being."

If the scene was reinserted into the episode, and the episode was seen on screen, that makes it canon. Just like how the Jabba scene was reinserted into ANH (CGI Jabba effect notwithstanding).

No, that's not right. The Star Wars special editions were meant to supersede the original cut, but the extended cut of "The Measure of a Man" is merely a special feature; the default version of the episode is still the broadcast cut. The extended cut is no more canonical than a deleted scene.

 

[F. King Daniel]

It's a refined version of this ship, made for a cancelled version of Star Trek Online.
https://johneaves.wordpress.com/2010/04/15/new-starships/

I don't see anything here that looks FASA, or early 24th Century. It's very late 24th century. The nacelles, bridge area and saucer shuttlebay come almost straight from the Sovereign class.

I coloured in the nacelle to show the similarity

It looks like it could be a contemporary or evolution of the USS Shenzhou to me. There's no way a ship kitbashed from a Sovereign-class would have such a low registry.

Then again, I think Eaves just designs generic ships and puts them into whatever era needed. See: His Discovery Enterprise being so similar to his NX-01 concept, his ENT Klingon design being re-submitted for ST'09 etc. This ship would fit into Discovery and First Contact, the only difference being in Disco her nacelles would be Shenzhou-like and in FC they'd light up.

 

[matthunter]

Also there was a Worf trial or something?

The trial referred to is from the TNG ep Sins of the Fathers - the one where Worf accepts discommendation. Picard served as his second so had to carry a dk'tahg.

 

[Timo]

Picard's trophy shelf certainly looks different from Kirk's. Both skippers no doubt made a deep impression on a number of alien species, but nobody came and gave Kirk any vases or plaques or letters of gratitude! Instead, he's got a collection of weapons... And I doubt those were willingly donated by their previous owners, either.

Timo Saloniemi