Couldn't wheelchair Pike have had a Betazoid assistant

[BillJ]

Apparently, "Will You Take My Hand" has a reference to Mirror Tilly and Georgiou conquering Betazed. So I would figure it joined the Federation around the same time.

In the mirror universe, Emperor Philippa Georgiou and Captain Sylvia Tilly conquered the Betazoids together sometime prior to 2256. (DIS: "Will You Take My Hand?")

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Betazed

 

[IMC Headquarters]

The ironic thing about poor Captain Pike is how he avoided the cage on Talos only to be put on 24 hour display by Starfleet in a form of living death. The beautiful element of the Pike saga is how he chooses to free his mind with the mercy of a dying race which selects compassion over the exploitation they originally intended. This is what gives me goosebumps every time Vina takes him by the hand and leads them to bliss -- below the scars of their forms, and the planet's as well. And why Kirk looks on enraptured.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I don't even want to know how delta radiation is said in Tamarian language.

Pike, his face melting

 

[Jayson1]

Apparently, "Will You Take My Hand" has a reference to Mirror Tilly and Georgiou conquering Betazed. So I would figure it joined the Federation around the same time.



https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Betazed

It is? For some reason I assumed it had something to do with "The Beatles."

Jason

 

[Christopher]

It is? For some reason I assumed it had something to do with "The Beatles."

Jason

BillJ said "Will You Take My Hand" has a reference to that conquest, not that the title itself is a reference. Also, there's apparently no Beatles song with that lyric, though there are other bands that have used it, according to a Google search. You may be thinking of "I Wanna Hold Your Hand."

 

[Nyotarules]

Maybe the Betazoids had contracts like the Deltans (Lt. Ilia) at that time, and couldn't or wouldn't be allowed to use their gifts around folks not so empowered?


(EDIT: sentence didn't make sense)

That would be like a planet of sentient species who cannot talk expecting humans to never speak cos its a 'gift'. 'Do not use the power of speech ,it makes us uncomfortable'

 

[Yistaan]

That would be like a planet of sentient species who cannot talk expecting humans to never speak cos its a 'gift'. 'Do not use the power of speech ,it makes us uncomfortable'

That actually strikes me as something Discovery writers might do.

 

[Nyotarules]

Don't mean a thing if it didn't hit the screen.

Do Warp, do warp, do warp, do warp, do warp, do warp, do warp, warp factor 10

Betazed wouldn't need to be a Federation member to send one of their own to help Pike. DS9 showed tons of Bajorans, non-Federationers, working closely with Starfleet.

Klingons join Starfleet, Orions join Starfleet, everyone joins Starfleet

 

[IMC Headquarters]

Do Warp, do warp, do warp, do warp, do warp, do warp, do warp, warp factor 10

Klingons join Starfleet, Orions join Starfleet, everyone joins Starfleet

I suspect the Kazon invitation got lost in the mail.

 

[Brainsucker]

It is easier for a money oriented society to hire a Betazoid Nurse for the wheel chaired Pike. Because money can buy everything. Including a 24/7 hours nurse who will dedicated his / her time for a rich man who can pay him/her a lot of money. I'm sure a man like Bill Gates can hire a team of Betazoid to become his personal mouth 24/7

But for a moneyless super socialist country like in Federation, who willing to sacrifice their time 24/7 to nurse and help helpless Pike, and become his dedicated personal mouth? Maybe there are some betazoid in the hospital, and they can nurse the patients with their skill. But they will help the community, not only Pike.

So perhaps, there was no Betazoid expert available in the TOS episodes, are they have a lot of similar patients to handle at that time.

 

[Yistaan]

It is easier for a money oriented society to hire a Betazoid Nurse for the wheel chaired Pike. Because money can buy everything. Including a 24/7 hours nurse who will dedicated his / her time for a rich man who can pay him/her a lot of money. I'm sure a man like Bill Gates can hire a team of Betazoid to become his personal mouth 24/7

But for a moneyless super socialist country like in Federation, who willing to sacrifice their time 24/7 to nurse and help helpless Pike, and become his dedicated personal mouth? Maybe there are some betazoid in the hospital, and they can nurse the patients with their skill. But they will help the community, not only Pike.

So perhaps, there was no Betazoid expert available in the TOS episodes, are they have a lot of similar patients to handle at that time.

Well on that note, it's hard to imagine how anyone in the Federation gets things done. We're told they do it to better themselves.

If Betazoids are enlightened Federation members, tons of them would be willing to help Pike because they are doing it to better themselves in their compassion. If the Betazoids aren't Federation members yet and are greedy like the Ferengi and us 21st century humans, I guess you're right, they couldn't be bothered.

Remember Betazed had a bank in the 23rd century that Harry Mudd was able to rob.

 

[The Wormhole]

If Betazoids are enlightened Federation members, tons of them would be willing to help Pike because they are doing it to better themselves in their compassion. If the Betazoids aren't Federation members yet and are greedy like the Ferengi and us 21st century humans, I guess you're right, they couldn't be bothered.

So, a race is only enlightened if every member willingly does charity work, and if that's not the case they are greedy like the Ferengi or modern humans?

 

[Yistaan]

So, a race is only enlightened if every member willingly does charity work, and if that's not the case they are greedy like the Ferengi or modern humans?

Don't ask me, honestly the Federation economy as described by Picard in First Contact has never made sense to me (along with the fact it contradicts previous references to money in TOS).

The closest theory I made on how it works is here:

Maybe our system of money is eradicated in favor of some bizarre future version of bitcoin? I'll call it fitcoin. When Picard says, we work to better ourselves, maybe every Federation citizen has a chip installed that tracks neural connections, physical health, etc.

Working out, learning new languages and advanced science, performing tasks, etc. is loaded into a chip installed in every person. Personal improvement is the new bitcoin mining, called fitcoin mining. The more you work out and study, the more fitcoins you have.

Thus, when Picard says people work to better themselves, they are just mining more fitcoins. All other currency (dollars, renminbi, euros, even bitcoins) are eliminated in favor of fitcoins. Thus you reconcile statements saying there is no money since the late 22nd century with the obvious references to money in TOS etc.

Those money references are references to fitcoins, which people earn through bettering themselves.

Maybe doing intensely charitable work like communicating for Capt. Pike will mine you massive amounts of fitcoins.

Also, remember that Betazed had a bank (presumably with money) in the 23rd century that Harry Mudd could rob.

 

[The Wormhole]

Also, remember that Betazed had a bank (presumably with money) in the 23rd century

So does Bolius in the 24th century, and this was after the Bolians were established to be Federation members.

Regardless, money in Star Trek is one of the hot button issues which discussion is discouraged, like the other M word or the R word. The point I was trying to make is that not everyone in a supposedly enlightened race needs to be willing to do goodwill work at the drop of a hat. And likewise, just because there are people who might not want to do charity work doesn't mean they are as ethically deplorable as the Ferengi.

 

[Yistaan]

So does Bolius in the 24th century, and this was after the Bolians were established to be Federation members.

Regardless, money in Star Trek is one of the hot button issues which discussion is discouraged, like the other M word or the R word. The point I was trying to make is that not everyone in a supposedly enlightened race needs to be willing to do goodwill work at the drop of a hat. And likewise, just because there are people who might not want to do charity work doesn't mean they are as ethically deplorable as the Ferengi.

Once they were developed more in DS9, the Ferengi weren't really that bad as seen with Nog. While Quark did some pretty bad things, most of his reasoning was understandable, even if you didn't agree with him. For example, Quark's attempts to sabotage Nog's Starfleet career and discourage him make a lot of sense if he knew what happened to Captain Pike, for example.

 

[Christopher]

Don't ask me, honestly the Federation economy as described by Picard in First Contact has never made sense to me (along with the fact it contradicts previous references to money in TOS).

It's not a contradiction, it's a societal change from one century to the next. A hundred years ago, American women couldn't vote. Now they can. Our society changed a lot in a century, so why couldn't the Federation?


Besides, there's a difference between a society not needing money and a society not having money. A post-scarcity, replicator-based economy means that there's more than enough material wealth to provide a good standard of living for everyone free of charge, but people can still choose to engage in capitalistic endeavors if they want to. It's not that it doesn't exist or that it's forbidden, it's that it's optional. Making money would be like, ohh, collecting Pokemon or stamps. It's something people do for the challenge, and for the opportunity to trade with like-minded hobbyists, not something they have to do in order to avoid starving to death.

 

[Timo]

So does Bolius in the 24th century, and this was after the Bolians were established to be Federation members.

Just as an aside, Bolians were never established to be Federation members in any onscreen piece of Trek.

Sure, they were ubiquitous in Starfleet. But there are Klingons and Ferengi there, too. And Trill, even though those were never established to be members, either. And lest the Bolian envoy from "The Forsaken" cloud anybody's judgement here, we should remember the Trill envoy Curzon who also served the UFP in a diplomatic capacity. Species identity and the political affiliation of the culture native to the species are unrelated things.

Are Betazoids members? Onscreen evidence is again basically nonexistent. But at least the fight over their homeworld is an explicit Starfleet responsibility, which is more than can be said about Bolarus...

Timo Saloniemi