Jake and Nog

[Thanos007]

I stopped watching DS9 early in season two during it's initial run. I'm now re-watching it and one of the things I found annoying about DS9 were Jake and Nog. Now their little B, sometimes C, stories are utterly charming. I don't know who was responsible for them (the stories) but they are just so....normal. Just stuff kids their age would do. Well so far at any rate. I watch two Star Trek episodes a night. It was two TNG until Chain of Command and now it's one TNG on DS9. It's obvious that TNG has run out of juice at this point (mid season 6 and beyond) and I can't wait to double up on DS9. Do Jake and Nog ever get an A story?

 

[Kilana2]

Well there was that insufferable

Spoiler: Jake-Nog-episode

Valiant episode

with Jake and Nog being central. I like both Nog and Jake, but this episode is one of the worst DS9 episodes. The Jake and Nog B plots are usually stronger.

 

[kkt]

"In the Cards" was pretty good.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

"In the Cards" was pretty good.

Wrong! In thr Cards is pretty awesome! Only a Soulless Minion of Orthodoxy would say otherwise.

 

[Kate Nichols]

In the cards, as they said, and the one where they run into a bunch of intellectual young folks running their own ship after the Captain was killed.

 

[Kate Nichols]

Great idea, by the way, to make Nog the one who entered Starfleet and not Jake.

 

[Kate Nichols]

Great their differences, too, Nog being neat and orderly and Jake being messy, and, also, Nog realizing from Jake that some Ferengi ideas are totally absurd, such as treatment of women.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

In defense of Valliant, it's really only the guest characters who fall flat. Eisenberg is pretty awesome in what is a callback to Paradise Lost, wanting acceptance from peers. Lofton is still good as the young man out of his element . The final scene in sick bay is rather well done.

 

[kkt]

The situation is on the edge of believability. Nog was a permanent Ensign, the surviving Valiant crew should have had only acting rank. Nog should have been in command as soon as they beamed him aboard. And I have a hard time with the Valiant's orders not covering the situation in which all the grownups were killed, and those orders should have been to re-establish contact with Starfleet for new orders and new permanent officers. The Valiant, especially in wartime, was too valuable an asset to turn over to unsupervised cadets who would probably lose the ship given half a chance.

 

[DonIago]

I rather think the situation, as with "The First Duty" highlights a problem with Starfleet Academy inappropriately promoting "exceptionalism".

 

[somebuddyX]

I love Jake/Nog stories and I wish they'd had more of them in the later seasons. I really enjoyed Valiant except for the fact that the

Spoiler

mission doesn't go as planned without explanation, other than it didn't work

It's really interesting to me as a parallel/deconstruction to the story arc of Star Trek 09.

 

[Nakita Akita]

Well there was that insufferable

Spoiler: Jake-Nog-episode

Valiant episode

with Jake and Nog being central. I like both Nog and Jake, but this episode is one of the worst DS9 episodes. The Jake and Nog B plots are usually stronger.

Yep. I don't like Valient episode at all.
I was in the Army.
Whoever wrote the episode obviously was never in the military, attended a boarding school and I suspect was homeschooled.

 

[Kor]

The situation is on the edge of believability. Nog was a permanent Ensign, the surviving Valiant crew should have had only acting rank. Nog should have been in command as soon as they beamed him aboard. And I have a hard time with the Valiant's orders not covering the situation in which all the grownups were killed, and those orders should have been to re-establish contact with Starfleet for new orders and new permanent officers. The Valiant, especially in wartime, was too valuable an asset to turn over to unsupervised cadets who would probably lose the ship given half a chance.

It's been a while since I saw the episode, but I get the sense that even if such orders were explicit, "Captain" Watters would have found some excuse to disregard them.

Kor

 

[kkt]

I love Jake/Nog stories and I wish they'd had more of them in the later seasons. I really enjoyed Valiant except for the fact that the

Spoiler

mission doesn't go as planned without explanation, other than it didn't work

It's really interesting to me as a parallel/deconstruction to the story arc of Star Trek 09.

Spoiler

I can understand them giving no explanation for why it didn't work. None of the characters there knew why, so there was nobody on the screen who could explain it. It's probably something a Starfleet Academy trainined science officer would know.

 

[DonIago]

They didn't exactly have time to do a debrief afterward.

 

[mlbach]

I disliked the Valiant episode, just because I dislike hubristic teenagers doing stupid stuff and manipulating their saner peers to fall in line. But I thought the concept was very believable.

 

[somebuddyX]

Spoiler

I can understand them giving no explanation for why it didn't work. None of the characters there knew why, so there was nobody on the screen who could explain it. It's probably something a Starfleet Academy trainined science officer would know.

That's a good point! I like this.