Has Season 2 made use of any of the background characters?

[Zod]

She's a terrible character and actress. Kirk, Picard, Sisko, Janeway, she ain't.

This I totally disagree with. She is a good actress. She was credible in Walking dead and credible here. The problem, when there is problems, is the writing. You can only do so much with what is written as an actor/actress.

For the other stuff its why I think they should have made her captain from the start. As the star she interjects in important moments. It sometimes feels as if she is preaching or lecturing or just being insolent. If she were captain she would not have to preach anything to anybody. She would just be giving orders.

 

[marlboro]

I've only seen one episode, but I think the wacky camera work would make it difficult to judge the quality of anyone's acting. If TNG had been filmed this way a scene involving Picard ordering a cup of tea would have a separate shot for each word he spoke: "Earl" [low angle shot] "Grey" [bird's eye view] "Hot" [extreme closeup] followed by a 360 degree pan around his head as he took his first sip.

 

[Alan Roi]

I've only seen one episode, but I think the wacky camera work would make it difficult to judge the quality of anyone's acting. If TNG had been filmed this way a scene involving Picard ordering a cup of tea would have a separate shot for each word he spoke: "Earl" [low angle shot] "Grey" [bird's eye view] "Hot" [extreme closeup] followed by a 360 degree pan around his head as he took his first sip.

Exaggerating somewhat, but that is how you make boring scenes the least bit interesting and actually demonstrated that Jean-Luc might have actually enjoyed his cup of tea instead of it just being an autonomic function as the bland 80s style daytime soap TNG camera work made it seem. And people thought the Borg chose him because he was captain? Nope. They could see his by the monotony of his daily routine, Picard was already one of them, he just didn't know it yet.

 

[marlboro]

Exaggerating somewhat, but that is how you make boring scenes the least bit interesting and actually demonstrated that Jean-Luc might have actually enjoyed his cup of tea instead of it just being an autonomic function as the bland 80s style daytime soap TNG camera work made it seem. And people thought the Borg chose him because he was captain. Nope. They could see his by his daily routine, Picard was already one of them, he just didn't know it yet.

Good filmmaking in 2019 = jingling your car keys in front of your ADD addled audience's faces for 40 minutes to keep them distracted from their phones.

 

[Alan Roi]

Good filmmaking in 2019 = jingling your car keys in front of your ADD addled audience's faces for 40 minutes to keep them distracted from their phones.

If you aren't producing a TV show that's more attractive than what's on on a persons smartphone in 2019, that's a problem in 2019. Not so much a problem in 1987, though.

I have been watching TV and Movies since the early seventies. I have no problem at all following the cinematography, plots, acting, VFX. I really don't think I'm anything special in that regard, and enjoy the cinematography of Disco. I can't really see most people under the age of 50 not being able handle what we're watching and not sure why long static frames and achingly slow panning is so desirable.

Of course, my spectator sport of choice is NHL hockey and not something laid back like baseball or soccer might have something to do with my appreciation for things occasionally moving really fast for more than a couple seconds. Could be that I am more unique a viewer of Trek than I had thought. Excuse me, I'm being distracted by a red dot moving around the wall. Must Attack!!

 

[zar]

There's no point critiquing a fact. Discovery was devised to be told from the perspective of a lower ranked crewmember. There are multiple sources proclaiming that, including many of its fans on this very forum. I used to not accept that since I was hoping it would be more ensemble like the other shows but thus far its been unequivocally The Michael Burnham Show as it was always intended to be.

Me during Season 1 : "I don't like Burnham. She takes up too much screen time and is boring".

Discovery fan : "Suck it up. It's her show. She's supposed to get most of the screen time".

Me during Season 2 : "I still hate Burnham but I accept this is her show even though the background characters are more appealing to watch".

Discovery fan : "Wrong. All the other shows were like this".

Me : "Deuces"

So it seems contradictory to you that they say Discovery is different because it focuses on Burnham, but Discovery is the same because all the other shows ignored background characters too.

It's not though. All the shows did do this, but the difference is which characters were in the background. In all the other shows, it was (more or less) the non-senior staff and non-critical bridge crew. We just aren't used to seeing people like Airiam and Detmer being the background characters. Discovery still has about the same amount of main characters, it's just a different focus. We have Burnham's roommate and her very complicated ex on the main cast already, a captain and two commanders, and a host of important recurring characters outside the ship. And then there are the background characters who are mostly ignored just like they were in other series, except this time some of them happen to be the rest of the bridge crew and senior staff. Technically Discovery doesn't even have a head physician and engineer, because Mushroom Science Guy is more important in the story (and Burnham's first assignment), and Non-CMO Doctor is in a relationship with Mushroom Science Guy.

 

[Hythlodeus]

I've only seen one episode, but I think the wacky camera work would make it difficult to judge the quality of anyone's acting. If TNG had been filmed this way a scene involving Picard ordering a cup of tea would have a separate shot for each word he spoke: "Earl" [low angle shot] "Grey" [bird's eye view] "Hot" [extreme closeup] followed by a 360 degree pan around his head as he took his first sip.

what is it with some Star Trek fans and their hatred of dynamic camera work? Do we really want 1980s cinematography in a 2019 TV show?

 

[Alan Roi]

So it seems contradictory to you that they say Discovery is different because it focuses on Burnham, but Discovery is the same because all the other shows ignored background characters too.

It's not though. All the shows did do this, but the difference is which characters were in the background. In all the other shows, it was (more or less) the non-senior staff and non-critical bridge crew. We just aren't used to seeing people like Airiam and Detmer being the background characters. Discovery still has about the same amount of main characters, it's just a different focus. We have Burnham's roommate and her very complicated ex on the main cast already, a captain and two commanders, and a host of important recurring characters outside the ship. And then there are the background characters who are mostly ignored just like they were in other series, except this time some of them happen to be the rest of the bridge crew and senior staff. Technically Discovery doesn't even have a head physician and engineer, because Mushroom Science Guy is more important in the story (and Burnham's first assignment), and Non-CMO Doctor is in a relationship with Mushroom Science Guy.

Set-in-their-way's people have a hard time adjusting to changes like this. I think they were able to adapt to DS9 because it was a space station and therefore wasn't being driven around much, so they could let go of the fact that the person driving or holding the map might not be very important.

There's also a big dynamic change when the lead isn't (metaphorically) the Dad or Mom on the show, but kind of the middle kid who has to do a lot of negotiating to get things done. That is also a huge adjustment for some people.

 

[marlboro]

what is it with some Star Trek fans and their hatred of dynamic camera work? Do we really want 1980s cinematography in a 2019 TV show?

Some scenes are more effective with a lot of camera movement. Some scenes are more effective with less movement. Good directors have more than one tool in their toolbox.

In a similar vein, every scene does not require exciting background music.

 

[Alan Roi]

what is it with some Star Trek fans and their hatred of dynamic camera work? Do we really want 1980s cinematography in a 2019 TV show?

To be fair I do remember dynamic camera work in the 80s on a number of shows. The A-Team is a good example. But many people here perhaps cut their teeth on TNG, so "that is the way its supposed to be". Or maybe they want to be able to look at their phone while they are watching, and are angry that they can't because of the dynamic camerawork and don't want to miss anything important and have to put down their phones when they watch. That isn't a problem with TNG style Trek.

 

[ITDUDE]

We're getting a little bit of a feel for Detmer as well. We know she got her pilot's license at age 12 and she was pretty awestruck by the appearance of the Enterprise ("What a beauty," or words to the effect). This tells me that she has a very Tom Paris-esque love of flying and flying machines.

All that came a single line of dialog. Bit whoop..

 

[fireproof78]

what is it with some Star Trek fans and their hatred of dynamic camera work? Do we really want 1980s cinematography in a 2019 TV show?

It's all in application.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Some scenes are more effective with a lot of camera movement. Some scenes are more effective with less movement. Good directors have more than one tool in their toolbox.

In a similar vein, every scene does not require exciting background music.

Honestly I felt the direction in TNG was at times too stolid for its own good. You can see why Ron Jones was let go as composer once the camerawork became less dynamic as the show progressed while his music would be trying to amp up some kind of excitement that’s lacking in direction.

Then there’s just frankly bizarre stuff like this:

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It’s the most extreme example, but there came a point where Berman sapped all the energy out of the show to make it more slow and methodical, down to the music, camera work, how the actors were told to perform. An emergency takes place but the cast plays so languid that it makes you wonder if the characters are still even human. J.J. Abrams directing his actors to frantically run down corridors felt like a shot in the arm after the Berman years had its actors act as if they were on Valium.

 

[Lord Garth]

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You couldn't have picked a better example of what NOT to do. This is what I mean by sterile and antiseptic.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

You couldn't have picked a better example of what NOT to do. This is what I mean by sterile and antiseptic.

Funny thing is it’s from one of my favorite episodes (“Schisms”), but it’s such a jarring moment in an episode that’s for the most part very creepy and effective.

I think we get a similar moment in “The Hunted” where security is searching for the genetically enhanced soldier.

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[marlboro]

Is it possible that there could be some happy medium between the two extremes?

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Is it possible that there could be some happy medium between the two extremes?

I call it TOS.

Though I wouldn’t call DISCO the extreme. It’s much more dialed down compared to Abrams’ shooting style.

 

[marlboro]

Honestly I felt the direction in TNG was at times too stolid for its own good. You can see why Ron Jones was let go as composer once the camerawork became less dynamic as the show progressed while his music would be trying to amp up some kind of excitement that’s lacking in direction.

Then there’s just frankly bizarre stuff like this:

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It’s the most extreme example, but there came a point where Berman sapped all the energy out of the show to make it more slow and methodical, down to the music, camera work, how the actors were told to perform. An emergency takes place but the cast plays so languid that it makes you wonder if the characters are still even human. J.J. Abrams directing his actors to frantically run down corridors felt like a shot in the arm after the Berman years had its actors act as if they were on Valium.

Maybe there's a deleted scene in Schisms where we find out that the four trapped people are Wesley, Lwaxana, Pulaski, and the Outrageous Okona?


Worf and Bev stroll up: "They dead yet?"

Geordie: " Not yet. Getting close though."

Worf: "We'll just do another lap around the ship then.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Maybe there's a deleted scene in Schisms where we find out that the four trapped people are Wesley, Lwaxana, Pulaski, and the Outrageous Okona?


Worf and Bev stroll up: "They dead yet?"

Geordie: " Not yet. Getting close though."

Worf: "We'll just do another lap around the ship then.

“They are dying.”
“Let then die.”

 

[marlboro]

“They are dying.”
“Let them die.”

"They are dying"

Dr. Crusher, already halfway down the corridor, stops, turns around, and does a dead on Han Solo impersonation: "I know"


They call her the "dancing doctor" because she dances on the graves of her enemies.