Star Trek 4 Hits A Snag

[gottacook]

Just because it set the precedent (which, I find frustrating in its own right) doesn't mean that it makes it a more enjoyable film.

I'm not happy about the precedent either. I'm tired of both villain stories and threat-to-Earth stories (especially when they're in the same movie). At this point, who can come up with an idea that won't seem derivative? Is there no original-crew Trek novel published in the past 40 years worthy of adaptation?

I've begun to believe that even if all cast members are willing to participate, no fourth Trek picture with the present cast will get made unless a great script is in hand first - one that (Paramount hopes) would yield a picture that has the great word-of-mouth that TWoK and TVH enjoyed, among both general audiences and fans, during their theatrical runs.

Is it a more important film than the Kelvin films? Probably. Is it a better film? No.

Fair point, but I can't dissociate the two because I was in the opening-day audience in 1982, and so for me the film's impact immediately transcended the film itself - the "THIS time they're doing it right!" feeling that began with the fanfare at the very beginning.

 

[Guy Gardener]

What if Kal Penn played Koloth in a Captain Sulu movie?

 

[JKM]

The problem is that if they cave to Pine then the other "lesser" cast might do the same. It's likely they're being asked to proportionately decrease their own salary increases as well. Some might have already agreed to it and renege themselves (as a group, probably not individually, to increase their bargaining power) if they see CBS cave. I agree in principle with your proposition but I think in the hollywood industry that it's probably more complicated than just that one deal and done.

Cave to Pine? You mean uphold his contract? What he's paid really has no leverage for other actors because he was under a contract, they weren't. Paramount only signed with Quinto and Pine for future films, from what I've read, not the entire cast. Hence the reason Urban was waffling on his decision to even be IN Beyond. They will have to bargain or not on their own merits. Apples to oranges there. They have no leverage.

 

[fireproof78]

Fair point, but I can't dissociate the two because I was in the opening-day audience in 1982, and so for me the film's impact immediately transcended the film itself - the "THIS time they're doing it right!" feeling that began with the fanfare at the very beginning.

Fair point, but I don't want to live in the past. I'm tired of it. I'm tired of Meyer receiving accoldades while Abrams is treated with much malignancy and disdain. TWOK was ground breaking, but how it was has been lost over time and assumed to be the norm.

 

[STEPhon IT]

Cave to Pine? You mean uphold his contract? What he's paid really has no leverage for other actors because he was under a contract, they weren't. Paramount only signed with Quinto and Pine for future films, from what I've read, not the entire cast. Hence the reason Urban was waffling on his decision to even be IN Beyond. They will have to bargain or not on their own merits. Apples to oranges there. They have no leverage.

Lets not forget the studio will be making profits from these movies after Pine and Hemsworth are done with their fine careers. In the long run the studios are not losing anything.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Lets not forget the studio will be making profits from these movies after Pine and Hemsworth are done with their fine careers. In the long run the studios are not losing anything.

And Pine and Hemsworth won't still be making money from them too while the studio makes money from them?

 

[STEPhon IT]

Yes. So the studio should honor what they agreed.

 

[F. King Daniel]

So right now it's an unsure time to be a Kelvin universe movie fan, but Guardians of the Galaxy made the kind of money Trek can only dream of and their third movie (perhaps fifth, including their Avengers crossovers) just got indefinitely suspended.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

So right now it's an unsure time to be a Kelvin universe movie fan, but Guardians of the Galaxy made the kind of money Trek can only dream of and their third movie (perhaps fifth, including their Avengers crossovers) just got indefinitely suspended.

Only I hated the 2nd Guardians movie for going too far in another direction from the 1st one and for that reason Thor Ragnarok also went IMHO too far in one direction the other way.

 

[seigezunt]

Only I hated the 2nd Guardians movie for going too far in another direction from the 1st one and for that reason Thor Ragnarok also went IMHO too far in one direction the other way.

That second Guardians movie felt like JJ Abrams and Gene Roddenberry had a baby, what with the mashup of "dealing with daddy issues, everybody cries" and "godlike being turns out to be --SURPRISE-- bad."

 

[F. King Daniel]

I loved Guardians of the Galaxy vol 2. But hey what do I know, I loved Star Trek Into Darkness.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

GUARDIANS 2 was a bit too off for me. The humor works much better for me when it's character based such as when Mantis does her Deanna Troi thing by pointing out Peter's feelings and Drax laughing, whereas gags like that red carpet or the Atari sound effects are just lame.

What's interesting to me is that the characterization of Peter Quill is so similar to Orci's writing of Kirk. The difference being that I actually find Peter Quill more believable as a rogue than I do of Orci's Kirk as a commander of a military starship.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

GotG2 > GotG1.
Thor3 > Thor1 > Thor2.

Whodathunkit: CC has opinions, as everyone else does.

 

[CorporalClegg]

 

[Noname Given]

It’s strange to me how the idea for this movie has been around since Beyond’s release. The whole, bring back Hemsworth for even more mopey daddy issues just doesn’t seem as great an idea as it’s been made out to be.

This was Orci's idea for JJ-Trek III that Paramount first approved (and started spending pre-production money on); and then (for whatever reason) SCRAPPED; and Pegg and Lin scrambled to come up with what they did and film it to meed the deadline. ST: B's budget is as large as it is because it had to absorb that decision Paramount management made mid-stream as it were.

 

[gerbil]

This was Orci's idea for JJ-Trek III that Paramount first approved (and started spending pre-production money on); and then (for whatever reason) SCRAPPED; and Pegg and Lin scrambled to come up with what they did and film it to meed the deadline. ST: B's budget is as large as it is because it had to absorb that decision Paramount management made mid-stream as it were.

I thought Orci’s III idea was an alien artifact Macguffin and would have had Shatner and Nimoy and the opportunity to merge the universes?

 

[MakeshiftPython]

I thought Orci’s III idea was an alien artifact Macguffin and would have had Shatner and Nimoy and the opportunity to merge the universes?

From what I understand that original concept was basically retooled for the fourth film, with George Kirk replacing Shatner's Kirk.

 

[F. King Daniel]

From what I understand that original concept was basically retooled for the fourth film, with George Kirk replacing Shatner's Kirk.

That's something I speculated on based entirely on time travel, George Kirk and the writers being Orci's co-writers for his unmade Star Trek 3. It does seem plausible that they retooled it with George Kirk in place of Jim Prime, but perhaps it's something entirely different.

I thought Orci’s III idea was an alien artifact Macguffin and would have had Shatner and Nimoy and the opportunity to merge the universes?

Rumour was, Starfleet, the Vulcans and a new alien race were competing for an artefact with the power to restore Vulcan. Orci called it "the last temptation of Kirk and Spock" on his twitter.

They got as far as concept art and location scouting before Orci dropped off the face of the entertainment world.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

What the hell did happen to Orci? It seemed so abrupt. I would assume the negative reception of THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN 2 was a factor, but Kurtzman is still working, albiet more on television than films, especially after THE MUMMY bombing. Given how Orci interacted with fans, I assume he burned a lot of bridges within the Hollywood system as well?

 

[CorporalClegg]

The Illuminati got him.