Diabetes & Chronic Issues Support Group

[Kor]

Are you implying that all people with T2 diabetes who happen to be overweighted/obese are at fault for having diabetes ? Like they "just" had to make lifestyle changes ?...

I have no idea how that could possibly be inferred from what I said. I was not placing any blame at all on anyone. I apologize if it was somehow perceived in that manner. This is based on close personal friends and family members who were diagnosed, but then subsequently made no substantial efforts to actually manage the condition, just expecting things to be OK by adding pharmaceuticals to their normal routine. And then the condition keeps getting worse.

Kor

 

[Twilight Phoenix]

I have no idea how that could possibly be inferred from what I said. I was not placing any blame at all on anyone. I apologize if it was somehow perceived in that manner. This is based on close personal friends and family members who were diagnosed, but then subsequently made no substantial efforts to actually manage the condition, just expecting things to be OK by adding pharmaceuticals to their normal routine. And then the condition keeps getting worse.

Kor

That's okay, I just misunderstood what you wrote, sorry

 

[rhubarbodendron]

Thanks for the congrats, TauCygna

Making changes to one's lifestyle and habits is hard and not everyone is willing to do that. My uncle refuses his chemo therapy (he has bone cancer). My dad refuses cathegorically to get a hearing aid (which he needs really really urgently! But if there's something he's not supposed to hear, you can bet on him getting it instantly).
I had to quit soft drinks, fruit juice and pizza, and had to cut down on cookies and chocolate. The juice was (and still is) the biggest challenge for me. I love lychee juice *sigh*

Marynator, I hope your dad will be fine with medication. Can he be treated with tablets or must he inject Insulin?

Type 2 diabetics often are very plump but that's not necessarily because they eat unreasonably. In my own case it was an Insulin resistance. There is sugar galore in my blood but the cells can't take it in. After a while the liver gives a shrug and says "ok, if you don't want it I'll store it for emergencies". This way people with an Insulin resistance get obese while at the same time their muscles and nerves starve to death.
I was diagnosed in September and must take tablets that enable the cells to take up the glucosis. Within these 9 months I lost 13 kg (approx. 28.5 lbs) =) My calory intake has not changed - it was and still is at an average of about 1800 kcal per day.
In medical journals one reads all the time that obese people have a higher risk of getting Diabetes. I rather think it's the other way round: an Insulin resistance usually gets overlooked for a very long time. It leads to obesity and only when the patient gets a full Diabetes (when the pancreas starts to fail) he or she finally gets diagnosed. Indubitably, obesity is an alarm sign but it's imo rather a symptom, not a cause.
And to avoid misunderstandings: In this context I mean only that sort of obesity that is definitely not caused by too high a calory uptake / overeating. I'm refering exclusively to those people who are obese and keep gaining weight in spite of having a perfectly normal diet.

 

[DimesDan]

Around 80% or so of type two's can try and prevent it as the triggers are very well known by now and it can be reversed.

Whereas zero percent of type one's can do anything about it once it starts and with all the will in the world, it's an ongoing battle and just damage limitation from day one and cannot at this point in time be reversed.

Diabetes (of both kinds) on the NHS are the second biggest medical expenditure (after Cancers) and the majority of that is on complications from badly controlled blood glucose levels of type two diabetics.

 

[Twilight Phoenix]

Around 80% or so of type two's can try and prevent it as the triggers are very well known by now and it can be reversed.

Yes they can try, but it doesn't mean everyone will succeed at it. When you know T2 diabetes is often linked to overweight/obesity, and when you see how difficult it is for many people to lose weight without gaining it back, it gives some hints about how difficult it can be even if the triggers are very well know...And there are also people with eating disorders, who have the outmost difficulty with changing their eating behaviours...

 

[Marynator]

Sounds like a massive lifestyle change is required and maybe more than just tablets to control it, maybe even daily injections.

I spoke with my father today, he says his doctor told him he needs to lose weight, so he's going to work on lifestyle change. He's going to go mostly vegan, and he's going to give up all beverages except water and some coffee. I do hope he's not just telling me this, I'll sound awful but my father has spent most of my life lying to me. I suggested to him he needs to speak to a doctor specializing in diet, I'm afraid he's just going to wing it and will end up hurting himself. Right now he says he weighs 250 pounds, but his weight isn't distributed all over his body, it's like all in his belly if you can picture what I mean?

 

[DimesDan]

Yes they can try, but it doesn't mean everyone will succeed at it

I am aware and to be blunt, I don't care about the excuses people with T2 make if they don't change their lifestyle. It's a massive "drain" on health services due to the complications that can arise and because their are so many bone idle type twos, diabetes is a punch line of many a joke and tars the type ones, the ones who with all the will in the world can't reverse it and just continue damage limitation for the rest of their lives with the same brush.

I spoke with my father today, he says his doctor told him he needs to lose weight, so he's going to work on lifestyle change. He's going to go mostly vegan, and he's going to give up all beverages except water and some coffee. I do hope he's not just telling me this, I'll sound awful but my father has spent most of my life lying to me. I suggested to him he needs to speak to a doctor specializing in diet, I'm afraid he's just going to wing it and will end up hurting himself. Right now he says he weighs 250 pounds, but his weight isn't distributed all over his body, it's like all in his belly if you can picture what I mean?

I can imagine, my dad had that same physic when he was diagnosed with T2, unluckily (or luckily depending on how you look at these things) he only had it a few years as he died of Cancer.

There is plenty of literature online and support groups if you feel he needs it, or you could show him what happens when glucose levels go unchecked in type twos.

 

[Twilight Phoenix]

I am aware and to be blunt, I don't care about the excuses people with T2 make if they don't change their lifestyle. It's a massive "drain" on health services

Okay, so let's slaughter all fat and obese people so they won't drain health services ! Oh and let's slaughter smokers too. And hyperfertile women who happen to abort too often. And people with drug addictions so we don't have to pay for their rehab anymore.
#hooray-team-fatshaming

 

[DimesDan]

Okay, so let's slaughter all fat and obese people so they won't drain health services ! Oh and let's slaughter smokers too. And hyperfertile women who happen to abort too often. And people with drug addictions so we don't have to pay for their rehab anymore.
#hooray-team-fatshaming

Ignoring you from now on, so I don't post aggressive things anymore and don't make mods lose their time.

I never said anything about slaughtering anyone, nor did I say that care should be removed. I suspect you didn't get past what you quoted when it comes to why I have this opinion. You'll also see that I placed drain in inverted commas, I don't think treating people for T2 diabetes is a drain, but more often then not, it is a needlessly large amount of money that is used on something that can be changed and the onus should be on that person, not the health care system. - and I also include badly controlled type ones in that too.

 

[Nakita Akita]

I never said anything about slaughtering anyone, nor did I say that care should be removed. I suspect you didn't get past what you quoted when it comes to why I have this opinion. You'll also see that I placed drain in inverted commas, I don't think treating people for T2 diabetes is a drain, but more often then not, it is a needlessly large amount of money that is used on something that can be changed and the onus should be on that person, not the health care system. - and I also include badly controlled type ones in that too.

I think a larger, no pun intended,
Would be the question as to why there are so many more overweight/ obese people now than even just 25 years ago.

 

[Twilight Phoenix]

Would be the question as to why there are so many more overweight/ obese people now than even just 25 years ago.

There are many reasons that can explain why people get overweighted, like poverty, eating disorders (which often are linked to stress), genetic factors, the prevalence of jobs in which people are sitting instead of moving, stress induced metabolic issues...

 

[Nakita Akita]

There are many reasons that can explain why people get overweighted, like poverty, eating disorders (which often are linked to stress), genetic factors, the prevalence of jobs in which people are sitting instead of moving, stress induced metabolic issues...

True, but all if that existed 30 years ago.
When I was a little kid,there was a lady that lived down the road from us.
She probably was about 5ft 3(1.6M) and probably weighed about 250 lbs.
( 113.40kg)
And us kids used to stare at here when she came outside, and sadly, back then even the adults stared at her.
Back then you just really never saw people that large.
It's odd that things have changed so much in such a short period of time, I think.

 

[DimesDan]

Would be the question as to why there are so many more overweight/ obese people now than even just 25 years ago.

Good question and I'm not sure, poor diets, more readily access to fast food and processed foods could be contributing factors, plus the fact their are more people now than a quarter of a century ago, plus less exercise or just plain being active full stop too.

I know the amount of people with diabetes (both type ones and twos) in the UK has pretty much doubled since I was diagnosed with type one twenty years ago with the proportions still being roughly 90% being type twos and 10% being type ones like myself hence my dislike of the jokes about diabetes and often lots of reporting just saying "diabetes" and not distinguishing between the two.

 

[Twilight Phoenix]

True, but all if that existed 30 years ago.
When I was a little kid,there was a lady that lived down the road from us.
She probably was about 5ft 3(1.6M) and probably weighed about 250 lbs.
( 113.40kg)
And us kids used to stare at here when she came outside, and sadly, back then even the adults stared at her.
Back then you just really never saw people that large.
It's odd that things have changed so much in such a short period of time, I think.

If you are interested in the subject, why not try to find research papers on the subject ? There are probably interesting things out there that can give some explanations
The availability of highly processed foods and meat certainly played a major role in the situation.

 

[Nakita Akita]

I wrote a paper about it in a college class.
But I think even the experts don't have much of an explaination.
In the USA we had tons of processed foods.
We had gross sugery cereals
And I Loooooooved twinkles and hostess cupcakes and ding-dongs. We had a huge freezer and my dad would buy all sorts of stuff in huge quantities.
But they didn't have warehouse stores then.
I fell bad for overweight people. It would be horribly daunting to need to lose such a large amount of weight. For most it would seem insurmountable I'm sure.

 

[Twilight Phoenix]

I fell bad for overweight people.

You don't need to feel bad for me, thank you. Neither for my husband. Or my friends. Or now deceased father. Or my mother in law. Or my husband's brother. We're living (or lived, in my father's situation) full and enriching lives. Our weight doesn't prevent us from being happy, finding mates, having friends and having a sex life (one common myth about overweighted/obese people). We live normal lives.

 

[Nakita Akita]

You don't need to feel bad for me, thank you. Neither for my husband. Or my friends. Or now deceased father. Or my mother in law. Or my husband's brother. We're living (or lived, in my father's situation) full and enriching lives. Our weight doesn't prevent us from being happy, finding mates, having friends and having a sex life (one common myth about overweighted/obese people). We live normal lives.

I feel bad that people try to make them feel bad.
I feel sad that they are expected to lose a lot of weight.
I have a friend at work who keeps trying to stay with this program at work. I feel bad for her because she wants to be thin and tries so hard and doesn't lose weight very much and she wants to lose like 80 pounds or so.

I have a friend and she says that if she was thinner she could get some xxxxx.
I feel bad for her, that she feels that way and that society makes her think that.

One time at work a heavy lady was eating an ice cream that the boss was handing out to everyone and she looked at me and said something to the effect of," oh yea, I know you're thinking that I don't need to eat this..."

I wasn't thinking anything of the sort. And I told her that too.
People think because I'm not overweight that I am judging them, and I'm not.
I eat light a total pig, I don't know why I'm not over wright, but I don't begrudge anyone eating anything.

Well, I tried to say what I'm thinking but sometimes it sounds wrong when I type it .

 

[Twilight Phoenix]

Well, I tried to say what I'm thinking but sometimes it sounds wrong when I type it

Oh no, not at all ! I completely understand
As you say, the problem in such situations is fatshaming more than overweight/obesity itself. People tend to be so mean at overweighted people, especially women since body shaming is vastly centered around women's bodies...
My last post was meant to be empowering for that reason. I hope any person with self confidence issues who will read it will feel better

 

[T'Bonz]

People should mind their own business. If someone is morbidly obese, their life is hard enough. They KNOW they're fat and don't need some douche to remind them. The same goes if someone is super thin.

Sometimes, people are just plain mean.

 

[DimesDan]

So, having a crappy morning this morning so far, woke up around 3am, confused and my pump beeping at me as my glucose levels had dropped to below 2.2mml (it doesn't register under 2.2 and merely said low!) had some sweets and didn't get back to sleep for about an hour and then when I woke up properly, my sugars were around the 13mml mark. This heat is not good for optimal glucose management. And of course, Mrs-Dimesdan slept through my night hypo.