Star Trek Discovery: The Future is Definitely Female

[Jayson1]

Officially no word yet. But I can't imagine the amazing Michelle Yeoh ending her movie career to become a television regular...
But a few guest appereances should totally be in there. Not sure how I feel about that though - I would love more Cpt. Georgiou flashbacks. But I'm not really a fan of Empress Georgiou and er story.

I could see her doing it if she liked working on the show and the fact that she is willing to come back I think sort of makes that seem like that might be the case. I don't see her lasting past a year and will be gone at the end of year but that is fine. To me she fills sort of the star gap with him gone.

Jason

 

[Awesome Possum]

What does an anti-racism protest consisting both men and women have to do with anything you said? Are you trying to argue that being against racism is wrong? Or did the woman with the "America was never great" sign scare you?

What does any of that have to do with Star Trek? Other than the characters in Star Trek would hold these people as an early example of their own philosophies and opinions on race?

 

[Mudd]

America Was Great For Some People would be reasonably accurate as a sign - the subtext of "Make America Great Again" has always included that.

 

[Marynator]

I read Discovery's not on regular television because there's so much more they can do with a show on prestige tv they can't do on network television. I feel they're trying to compete with like all those other hottest tv shows that are only on subscriptions?

I've not seen Discovery yet but I feel maybe I'll subscribe to CBS to watch it all at a time. I don't like the whole mirror universe and I really wish it was in the future, but I'm liking so much I read about its progressivism.

Oh I just so ignore anyone clinging to his dying patriarchy, lol. It's a last gasp in its death throes. Evolution is happening, you can deny it all you want.

 

[Spot261]

What does an anti-racism protest consisting both men and women have to do with anything you said? Are you trying to argue that being against racism is wrong? Or did the woman with the "America was never great" sign scare you?

What does any of that have to do with Star Trek? Other than the characters in Star Trek would hold these people as an early example of their own philosophies and opinions on race?

You aren't suggesting there are trek fans who don't fully adhere or accept the ideals inherent in the show, surely? Then again, you can often tell a lot about someone by their choice of avatar I find.

I could see her doing it if she liked working on the show and the fact that she is willing to come back I think sort of makes that seem like that might be the case. I don't see her lasting past a year and will be gone at the end of year but that is fine. To me she fills sort of the star gap with him gone.

Jason

My take would be she might appear as a recurring character, possibly an anti hero, but not part of the crew as such.....

 

[MakeshiftPython]

I read Discovery's not on regular television because there's so much more they can do with a show on prestige tv they can't do on network television. I feel they're trying to compete with like all those other hottest tv shows that are only on subscriptions?

I've not seen Discovery yet but I feel maybe I'll subscribe to CBS to watch it all at a time. I don't like the whole mirror universe and I really wish it was in the future, but I'm liking so much I read about its progressivism.

Oh I just so ignore anyone clinging to his dying patriarchy, lol. It's a last gasp in its death throes. Evolution is happening, you can deny it all you want.

I can imagine if Trek merely returned on the old CBS network that it may have looked as cheap as something like AGENTS OF SHIELD.

You aren't suggesting there are trek fans who don't fully adhere or accept the ideals inherent in the show, surely? Then again, you can often tell a lot about someone by their choice of avatar I find.

He once suggested that with Pike's return to DISCO that they should retain his sexist attitude from "The Cage".

Yeah, no thanks.

 

[Jayson1]

I can imagine if Trek merely returned on the old CBS network that it may have looked as cheap as something like AGENTS OF SHIELD.



He once suggested that with Pike's return to DISCO that they should retain his sexist attitude from "The Cage".

Yeah, no thanks.

While they don't need to retain it anymore than they need to retain a smiling Spock that actually could be used for effective drama. He doesn't trust her because of the war she doesn't like him because he sometimes says sexist things. They are force to work together and naturally bump heads but then come to learn from each other and respect each other.

Jason

 

[Spot261]

While they don't need to retain it anymore than they need to retain a smiling Spock that actually could be used for effective drama. He doesn't trust her because of the war she doesn't like him because he sometimes says sexist things. They are force to work together and naturally bump heads but then come to learn from each other and respect each other.

Jason

Problem for me there is anyone who retains those attitudes in the 23rd century despite being immersed in the the progressive culture of the federation is unlikely to be open to new ideas. You would have to introduce some aspect of his backstory that would explain him seeming anachronistic next to the other characters.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

I can be open to a story of Pike overcoming his own flaws, much like how Archer overcame his bigoted outlook of Vulcans via his experience working with T'Pol.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Problem for me there is anyone who retains those attitudes in the 23rd century despite being immersed in the the progressive culture of the federation is unlikely to be open to new ideas. You would have to introduce some aspect of his backstory that would explain him seeming anachronistic next to the other characters.

Yup. Normally I just ignore this and chalk it to early installment weirdness and Roddenberry trying to humor male audiences of the 60s "isn't it crazy to have all these women here???"

Much like I ignore Spock teasing Rand about enjoying being assaulted.

 

[Jayson1]

Problem for me there is anyone who retains those attitudes in the 23rd century despite being immersed in the the progressive culture of the federation is unlikely to be open to new ideas. You would have to introduce some aspect of his backstory that would explain him seeming anachronistic next to the other characters.

Just say he was raised on a distant colony. Not even sure why he even contemplated a life as a Orion Slaver. I wonder if maybe his family where criminals which in a fun way would kind of give him a background like Nog. Starfleet has also had it's share of racist like the one that KIrk scolds on the bridge or the one who didn't think Data should be a captain and Kirk could be sexist as well and one of the benefits of the time period is it's before humans evolved to where they become in the 24th century. PLus the idea of the human race being evolved has not always been equal to what we see. I think you got alot of propaganda in the culture where maybe they aren't as perfect as they think they are. I mean they are using Section 31 so the idea of looking a little deeper at "evolved humanity" could be fun abit a little similar to what DS9 did. Still maybe they can find new angles to that idea.

Jason

 

[Marynator]

I feel I'd prefer if they kept characters' bigotries more distant to use as metaphors instead of really so applicable to today's problems. Like how you say Archer was bigoted to Vulcans, well they're not a real group but he can show how silly it can be and make us think about ourselves, which Star Trek always does so well. Like Lokai and Bele was such a wonderful metaphor about how ridiculous racism is, I don't feel they could've done it better less symbolically. They can be over the top that way, right? But if someone is sexist, then they can risk if the person he doesn't like actually has flaws, viewers who're sexist themselves can cling to that and say he's right and so entirely miss the point?

 

[Locutus of Bored]

Ugh, I'm so tired of dealing with this crap. I'm not sure how you disprove the point that you are yourself playing white cis male "identity politics" (you know, the thing you constantly rail on about being opposed to?) by posting a picture that essentially says you think protesting against white pride and racism is ridiculous. I'm sure I'll get crap from the usual suspects over this because of the Nazi rally photo that was also posted in the thread to counter your point, but here's the thing: THEY'RE NOT THE SAME THING. Both sides of an issue aren't always balanced and equally wrong. And your post had absolutely nothing to do with the post you were replying to or with the subject matter of this thread, a common problem with you.

I suspect the point of posting this —like many of your other posts in threads of this nature— was to distract and derail from the subject matter of the thread and to provoke reactions that will eventually get the thread shut down, which then gives you what you want, since you apparently can't handle this kind of discussion being open. So, since you've been friendlied and infracted multiple times and told to drop the racist, transphobic, homophobic, and misogynistic posts and just talk about Star Trek, since you seem completely incapable of doing the latter consistently and should probably find a political forum that better conforms to your proclivities, and since I'm not shutting this thread down and appeasing you, you receive an INFRACTION FOR TROLLING. COMMENTS TO PM.

 

[Jayson1]

I feel I'd prefer if they kept characters' bigotries more distant to use as metaphors instead of really so applicable to today's problems. Like how you say Archer was bigoted to Vulcans, well they're not a real group but he can show how silly it can be and make us think about ourselves, which Star Trek always does so well. Like Lokai and Bele was such a wonderful metaphor about how ridiculous racism is, I don't feel they could've done it better less symbolically. They can be over the top that way, right? But if someone is sexist, then they can risk if the person he doesn't like actually has flaws, viewers who're sexist themselves can cling to that and say he's right and so entirely miss the point?

Maybe but "Discovery" at least at first seemed to have ambitions of being a little more gritty or real than previous Treks. I've always wonder how well metaphors work on a modern audience. It's kind of hard to tell some stories like you use to could do it since tv doesn't have to hide it's messages anymore. Compare the Klingons to being a metaphor to the alt right and then you look at what "American Horror Story" where you have stories that are literally connected to the 2016 election. Of course the counter argument is "Black Mirror" but those stories also kind of work on a horror level and as cautionary tales. Also Pike is a loved character so that influences how people would perceive the sexism but people don't always like bad people because they share the views. I think people just like characters who are edgy and bold and aren't restricted. That was one of the main selling points of Lorca and when they turned him into a cartoon it kind of ruined the character and lots of what we thought was drama of a damaged man dealing with PSD and basically just tossed it aside for a gimmick.


Jason

 

[Refuge]

If you're watching on cable channels, then you've been paying to watch Star Trek. Unless, that is, you're stealing cable from your neighbor.

No cable for me! I do get to share my neighbours stereo though... free through the walls.

 

[Refuge]

I've not seen Discovery yet but I feel maybe I'll subscribe to CBS to watch it all at a time. I don't like the whole mirror universe and I really wish it was in the future, but I'm liking so much I read about its progressivism.

I must own up to not being its greatest fan HOWEVER do watch it and binge watching would be a way to get a better grip of its continuity. I like the natural ease of how Stamets and Culber are portrayed but I won't spoil anything more. There are female roles both good and not so good. There are compelling male roles.

No beagle though but you might like Ripper

 

[SolarisOne]

Star Trek Discovery: The Future is Definitely Female

So what? Seriously. Some people are acting like that (whether it's true or not) is a mortal threat or something. History isn't a zero sum game. Just 'cause someone else is gettin' some shine, doesn't mean you're getting shade.

 

[Jayson1]

So what? Seriously. Some people are acting like that (whether it's true or not) is a mortal threat or something. History isn't a zero sum game. Just 'cause someone else is gettin' some shine, doesn't mean you're getting shade.

I agree. The term is kind in inacurate but then it's a slogan. Slogans are what they are. I think the general idea is people will all get a equal chance at following their dreams. Maybe that's not what it means for everyone but then again it's why i'm never been a big fans of slogans or some descriptions that become political. The best idea IMO is always to find away to say what you believe without following trap to the cliche terms that just trigger the other side. Their has been a whopping amount of them and I don't think I know what half of them mean and the ones I do know seem to have replaced better descriptions. Yet we keep getting new ones. I have no idea what virtual signaling is and I keep hearing it a great deal lately and I guess it's another to add to a pile of words that as soon as spoken create instant internet fights.

Jason

 

[cooleddie74]

A woman getting the same career options, pay and advancement up the socioeconomic ladder as myself isn't a threat to me nor to any man who has a semblance of confidence and self-esteem. She can achieve her goals and dreams and so can we.

If having women in positions of authority in a fictional universe set in outer space damages your self-worth you were a person with low self-esteem to begin with or an outright misogynist.

 

[Awesome Possum]

So what? Seriously. Some people are acting like that (whether it's true or not) is a mortal threat or something. History isn't a zero sum game. Just 'cause someone else is gettin' some shine, doesn't mean you're getting shade.

Some men fear equality because it means an end to male supremacy. They need to feel they are inherently superior to women otherwise they feel like they have nothing. They need to be praised and worshipped constantly because their egos are extremely fragile. It's the same motivation behind racism, and bigotry against LGBTQ people. Other groups being treated like them is a threat to them, so they try to fight it constantly.