Andorians and climate?

[DimesDan]

No, why? Unless everyone else posts spammy garbage like you two.

Is what I posted not factually correct? This thread until this morning was not active in nearly 8 years, or in 2010.

I know the rules are slightly different around here, but any other part of the board, a thread inactive even one eighth of that timespan would be closed.

 

[trampledamage]

Wasn't there a rule against reactivating threads that haven't had any new posts within the last year or so? I mean, you're the mod, so I probably misremembered something, so, my apologies.

a) it doesn't matter if there is, your post is still spam and b) there probably was in previous iterations of the forum software when the search function wasn't as good and also as Dimesdan points out below it's the rules elsewhere - but I hold that the books should be open to being discussed for longer than that, and the new post was adding to the conversation.

Is what I posted not factually correct? This thread until this morning was not active in nearly 8 years, or in 2010.

I know the rules are slightly different around here, but any other part of the board, a thread inactive even one eighth of that timespan would be closed.

I had forgotten the rest of the board is stricter - I'll be politer next time (also, can I claim sickness as an excuse for being grumpy?)

Here, so long as the new poster is adding something to the convo, I allow the threads to stay open.

 

[Battman]

Apologies if I broke any rule that I wasn't aware of. Star Trek Discovery has, among other things, awakened some of us in the Andorian niche of the Star Trek fan base. I was interested in talking shop with others. I can make this my last post if discussion is unwanted.

 

[trampledamage]

Discussion always welcome

 

[Hey Missy]

I remember TNG's Paths of Disharmony, written many years after ENT depicted an icy Andoria, describing green grass and warm climates. I was pretty

 

[Therin of Andor]

I remember TNG's Paths of Disharmony, written many years after ENT depicted an icy Andoria, describing green grass and warm climates. I was pretty

Because it was written based on the descriptions of Andor in Heather Jarman's "Andor: Paradigm" ("Worlds of DS9, Book 1). And... it was after The (annual) Thaw.

 

[F. King Daniel]

As I recall when I had similar questions, I was told Andorians prefer the heat to the cold and...

Spoiler: Andorians, climate, novelverse events

Did some intentional global warming thing to heat up their world between ENT and DS9? Am I remembering that correctly?

 

[DimesDan]

I had forgotten the rest of the board is stricter - I'll be politer next time (also, can I claim sickness as an excuse for being grumpy?)

Not a bother, although next time I get accused of something (say trolling, as your post kinda comes across) I'll blame it on either high or low Blood Glucose levels.

I was interested in talking shop with others. I can make this my last post if discussion is unwanted.

I was merely surprised and pointing out how old this thread was, my intention was not to say you shouldn't discuss the topic and I am unsure how you can have that take-away from it and the discussion afterwards.

I remember TNG's Paths of Disharmony, written many years after ENT depicted an icy Andoria, describing green grass and warm climates. I was pretty

Isn't there like 200 hundred years between Enterprise and the Post-Nemesis novels?

 

[Therin of Andor]

"Star Trek Star Charts" (Pocket, 2002) by Geoffrey Mandel positions the Andorian Empire on Andoria, or Procyon VIII (Alpha Canis Minoris), in the Beta Quadrant. Supposedly, Procyon's habitable zones are most likely disrupted by the gravitational influence of its white-dwarf companion. Orbits could change over time, sometimes plunging Andoria into an ice age, other times giving it a hotter climate.

Typically, the temperature in the arctic region of Andoria is 28 degrees below zero. Elsewhere, temperatures do go above freezing for several weeks at a time and heat waves have been known every few years. Shran didn't see the sun until he was fifteen years old. ["Enterprise: The Aenar."]

 

[Enterprise1701]

Because it was written based on the descriptions of Andor in Heather Jarman's "Andor: Paradigm" ("Worlds of DS9, Book 1). And... it was after The (annual) Thaw.

Hasn't another novel established that by the 24th century, terraforming technology has been utilized on Andor? And it was disastrous for the Aenar?

 

[F. King Daniel]

Hasn't another novel established that by the 24th century, terraforming technology has been utilized on Andor? And it was disastrous for the Aenar?

No wonder they almost went extinct

 

[Battman]

Does anybody know any online resource that lists strictly what is canon within the Star Trek television and movie series about Andor/Andoria? I realize many Trek novels have established their own "facts" about the planet/moon and its people. But then the books also tried to say Andorians have four sexes, and all we ever see on TV and in movies are two sexes, so I don't put much stock in non-canon Trek.

 

[David cgc]

Does anybody know any online resource that lists strictly what is canon within the Star Trek television and movie series about Andor/Andoria? I realize many Trek novels have established their own "facts" about the planet/moon and its people. But then the books also tried to say Andorians have four sexes, and all we ever see on TV and in movies are two sexes, so I don't put much stock in non-canon Trek.

Then you've probably picked the wrong forum to ask in. But to answer your question, Memory Alpha limits itself to on-screen material, as well as a very limited selection of behind-the-scenes reference material that has the same stipulation, like the Encyclopedia.

 

[Christopher]

Does anybody know any online resource that lists strictly what is canon within the Star Trek television and movie series about Andor/Andoria?

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Andoria

Don't overcomplicate it -- "canon" is not a separate concept from the shows and films themselves, it's just a nickname for the shows and films themselves, as distinct from tie-ins and fan fiction.

I realize many Trek novels have established their own "facts" about the planet/moon and its people. But then the books also tried to say Andorians have four sexes, and all we ever see on TV and in movies are two sexes, so I don't put much stock in non-canon Trek.

It's not about "putting stock" in things. All Trek is equally fictional, canon or otherwise. So it's not like anyone is lying to you -- or rather, everyone is lying to entertain you, including the creators of canon, and it's just a question of which lies you find it preferable to play along with, or which lies play along with each other.

It was the TNG episode "Data's Day" that established -- canonically -- that Andorians marry in groups of four. Other canon has not followed through on that in any way, but the books have. Arguably the books are more consistent with "Data's Day" than other episodes of other series have been.

 

[Enterprise1701]

But then the books also tried to say Andorians have four sexes, and all we ever see on TV and in movies are two sexes, so I don't put much stock in non-canon Trek.

I don't believe that televised and theatrical Trek has ever gone into a chromosomal analysis of Andorians.

 

[JD]

Does anybody know any online resource that lists strictly what is canon within the Star Trek television and movie series about Andor/Andoria? I realize many Trek novels have established their own "facts" about the planet/moon and its people. But then the books also tried to say Andorians have four sexes, and all we ever see on TV and in movies are two sexes, so I don't put much stock in non-canon Trek.

If you're only interested in the shows and movies, then why are you asking in the forum for the books and comics?
I've never understood this attitude, why does it matter if it's canon or not? None of it is any more real than anything else, and there's just as much of a chance of a show or movie retconning or ignoring something from an earlier show as there is of it contradicting a book or comic. For every Rihannsu vs TNG era Romulan, I can give you a The Host Trill vs DS9 Trill. And for every Final Reflection Klingon vs TNG era Klingon, I can give the Earth Starship Enterprise vs the Federation Starship Enterprise. If you dig deep enough there are probably almost as many contradictions between the books/comic and shows/movies as there are between the shows and movies themselves.
Shit, the books and comics are comics are probably more consistent with the movies and shows, then the movies and shows are with themselves.

 

[Christopher]

the books and comics... are probably more consistent with the movies and shows, then the movies and shows are with themselves.

Quite possibly. After all, the books and comics are required to stay consistent with prior canon as much as possible, while new canon is free to reinvent or reinterpret prior canon if it suits the current story. Just imagine if a Trek novel had portrayed a 2250s Starfleet vessel with holographic communicators and a cyborg bridge officer and a tribble in the ready room -- they would've been instructed to cut all those things out.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Does anybody know any online resource that lists strictly what is canon within the Star Trek television and movie series about Andor/Andoria?

As others have mentioned, looking up Memory Alpha for Andorians will give you onscreen info only.

But then the books also tried to say Andorians have four sexes, and all we ever see on TV and in movies are two sexes, so I don't put much stock in non-canon Trek.

Well, it was Data, in the canonical episode "Data's Day", who mentioned that "Andorians marry in groups of four, unless...", opening up the possibility for the novels to play with a more alien concept that two sexes only. Editor Marco Palmieri and the writers decided to take the route that offered the most different stories without clashing with (then-very limited) canonical Andorian facts. (Sure, they could have gone the two-gendered route and been like almost every other alien race in Trek, but why not try something different?)

Very cleverly, two of the novel Andorian sexes are said to be outwardly male and the other two are outwardly female. So, with canonical appearances, there is really no clash. The ENT episode "The Andorian incident" gives us Shran, Keval and Thon, but also the more androgynous character Tholos, who seems as interested in Trip as he is in T'Pol. (Curious body language from Tholos in that episode.) In later seasons, we meet two quite different female types are presented in Tarah (who is taller than the males and quite aggressive) and Talas, who is Shran's partner and perhaps more feminine.

It also paid homage to some popular 1970s fanfic by Leslie Fish (the infamous filksinger), whose zines suggested three sexes for Andorians.

 

[Enterprise1701]

Quite possibly. After all, the books and comics are required to stay consistent with prior canon as much as possible, while new canon is free to reinvent or reinterpret prior canon if it suits the current story. Just imagine if a Trek novel had portrayed a 2250s Starfleet vessel with holographic communicators and a cyborg bridge officer and a tribble in the ready room -- they would've been instructed to cut all those things out.

 

[Christopher]

^I should clarify that the above was not meant to say that any of those changes in Discovery were "wrong," but on the contrary, to make it clear that any fictional canon has the freedom to reinvent itself in any way that its creators wish. Tie-ins, on the other hand, are secondary works meant to support canon, so they're subject to tighter strictures.