Discovery and "The Orville" Comparisons

[Prax]

You think handing out zero or one star ratings because they don't agree with having to get another subscription while the rest of the world gets Netflix is a fair way to rate a series? Do not underestimate how many people did this.


You're right, but the 'general public' do not hand out ratings en masse on sites like RT, IMDB etc. Most people I know have never, ever rated a film or series on the internet. The Axanar camp were/are determined to bury DSC (don't underestimate this as well): I believe they were rallied up to give as much zero star ratings they could. Of course it's a relatively small group, but looking at the total of people who actually rated the show on RT, I wouldn't surprised if the 'Axanar-camp' represents a significant percentage.



GOT is not 'the show with the black female as a lead', DSC is. Believe me, for a large number of Americans, this is an issue. Remember the shit The Force Awakens had to take because of the Finn character? It's horrible. It IS a thing in the US...

About 60 pages ago, someone was making similar claims. I did a little research, and posted this:

promoting the show. You can find them by clicking on Disc. season 1, then scrolling down to user reviews. You can't see the percentage, but there they are: 168 pages. I sampled 13. (The first 13) Out of the 1 star, and 1/2 star reviews, about half wrote something down. Its was probably a similar ratio for 5 star reviews. I came across the letters "sjw" twice, and "politics" once. Most of the complaints were similar to complaints on this site, like acting, dialogue, looking/feeling different, and All-Access/airing half an episode-pay to see the rest, etc. And most of the compliments were similar to compliments here.

Even though I didn't read the other 155 pages, it doesn't seem to be "just trolls." I have no way of knowing if those 1 star(and 2-5 star) ratings without any comments were users just trying to effect a poll, or not

And then this:

I still had the tab open on my phone from last night. I went back through the first 13 pages of comments, and then went 10 more, to the 23rd page, just to be safe, and your quotes are not there, so they must be even older. (Or perhaps you didn't get those from RT? It was Rotten Tomatoes that I was looking at in my earlier post)

Something else that I noticed this time: Of those first 23 pages, a vast majority of the 5 star reviews had nothing written down, and in general, the negative comments were longer and more explanatory, which I suppose makes sense. If you want to complain, and you're feeling that "joy" that comes in whining, you might want to pile it on, or if you feel bad about complaining, you might want to give a long explanation why.

Now, I haven't gone back since then, but that day, I wasn't seeing these voters that you are. There weren't that many 0-1 star ratings to begin with, and they almost always had at least some kind of explanation, and it was almost never about the contentions you mention (aside from some about paying for the service)

This thread has officially jumped the shark

*Tardishark.

 

[Tesophius]

So your rankings are "objective," but other people's reviews are "clearly biased and possibly corrupted."

Got it.

Precisely

 

[fireproof78]

We could also compare the IMDb ratings. More people have voted there than on Rotten Tomatoes and they use a weighted average. That makes an individual negative vote less influential.


TOS: 8.4 - 58,626 votes
TAS: 7.6 - 4,515 votes
TNG: 8.6 - 74,641 votes
DS9: 7.9 - 38,473 votes
VOY: 7.7 - 44,215 votes
ENT: 7.5 - 34,253 votes
DIS: 7.3 - 25,275 votes
Orv: 7.8 - 17,313 votes

You can also find here a big list of scifi series. Most series range between 6.0 and 9.0. So to simplify it an 8 rating is really good, 7 average and 6 bad. Decimals matter of course. Getting a 7.9 is much harder than getting a 7.0.

This feels more scientific.

Precisely

 

[Bgt]

I think we should wait for season 2 to judge STD.
Imho, its first season is a mess, caused by the shallow or/and confused approach from its creators.
It 's like if they gathered all the things they believe make a show cool and popular these days, added some Star Trek elements and ended up with an uneven patchwork.
Star Trek is a 50 years old franchise, it is supposed to be "cool", trying to improve it doesnt mean you have to make it be like the other popular shows of peak-tv era.

What I (unexpectedly) like so much in Orville is that it doesnt try so hard to be cool and trendy. Of course it has old Star Trek as its compass, but it looks like the honest work of a fanboy and not as an ambitious effort to make something like GOT in space. I find it sincere and more confident than STD and it is so much effortless to enjoy it. On the contrary, with STD, I am trying to like it, without the "Star Trek" on its title I would have abandoned it already.

Since Discovery wants to be so serious and dark and "cool", it should take a peek towards shows like the "Expanse". Not to copy, but to realize how to make an interesting new show by creating your own footprint in the genre.

 

[BillJ]

On the contrary, with STD, I am trying to like it, without the "Star Trek on its title" I would have abandoned it already.

I guess that proves the power those two words have over many of us.

 

[fireproof78]

I guess i'm the odd one out. I would watch DISCO with or without "Star Trek" in it.

 

[BillJ]

I guess i'm the odd one out. I would watch DISCO with or without "Star Trek" in it.

I'm not sure I would have made it through "The Vulcan Hello".

 

[fireproof78]

I'm not sure I would have made it through "The Vulcan Hello".

Then I am truly baffled as to why the need to continue...

 

[BillJ]

Then I am truly baffled as to why the need to continue...

"Star Trek". Simply been following it since 1975, through good times and bad. I'm an oddly loyal sort.

 

[Tesophius]

I too would have abandoned it after the first couple of episodes if it wasn't branded as Star Trek. IMHO, the only way to save the show is by introducing more self contained episodes, which they've already done with episode #7 and achieved their best results to date, and by abandoning the whole "let's be like the all the other gritty-shitty shows" and go back to having that Star Trek feel that even the Kevin timeline movies had. It is, however, trending in the right direction and I'm forecasting the 8th episode to be a soft 7/10

 

[Roald]

"Star Trek". Simply been following it since 1975, through good times and bad. I'm an oddly loyal sort.

Bashing is not being loyal in my book. My favorite football team goes through an awful phase right now, but I would never bash the club.. certainly not by praising another team in an attempt to piss on my own team.

 

[Cake]

The Orville will also air in Germany. The Pro7/Sat.1 group bought the rights. It is not clear though yet when it will air and on which channel.

 

[BillJ]

Bashing is not being loyal in my book.

You belong in Trump's America. He would love you. Being critical of something is not being disloyal, not even a little bit. I've been critical of every Star Trek, including my personal favorite, the original.

My favorite football team goes through an aweful phase right now, but I would never bash the club.. certainly not by praising another team in an attempt to piss on my own team.

Why would I not praise another team when they are doing the things my team isn't?

 

[Roald]

You belong in Trump's America. He would love you.

What an amazingly nasty thing to say. Disgraceful. Bashing is not the same as 'being critical'.

 

[fireproof78]

"Star Trek". Simply been following it since 1975, through good times and bad. I'm an oddly loyal sort.

Loyalty is admirable, to a certain point, but if something is causing distress or frustration, at least as far as entertainment, I struggle to understand the need to continue.

 

[BillJ]

Loyalty is admirable, to a certain point, but if something is causing distress or frustration, at least as far as entertainment, I struggle to understand the need to continue.

There is no distress or frustration, at least from me. It is a TV show, and fun to talk about. It seems the folks who are the most vexed are the Discovery fans because some folks have the audacity to criticize their show.

 

[fireproof78]

There is no distress or frustration, at least from me. It is a TV show, and fun to talk about. It seems the folks who are the most vexed are the Discovery fans because some folks have the audacity to criticize their show.

It's fun to talk about things its doing wrong?

 

[BillJ]

It's fun to talk about things its doing wrong?

Yeah, it is also fun to talk about what it is doing right. Which I've done on more than one occasion. It is all part of the "Star Trek" tapestry.

 

[marsh8472]

Precisely

Hey I was recently promoted to captain too. I'm okay with this logic

 

[fireproof78]

Yeah, it is also fun to talk about what it is doing right. Which I've done on more than one occasion. It is all part of the "Star Trek" tapestry.

It must be a rare creature then, as it slipped my memory