Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 1x05 - "Choose Your Pain"

[Guy Gardener]

Which is a good clue about how or why it's all a trick.

You know that that room is a cell.

There are listening devices in the walls, floors and ceiling.

They didn't need Mudd to report in.

It was psychological manipulation to break Mudd, to make him grateful to be of use to his new masters, and convince Mudd that he is already far too traitorous to ever think about redemption, so there is no reason to not continue to be even more traitorous in the coming weeks.

 

[cooleddie74]

Remember, Harry Mudd would one day be willing to subjugate himself to loneliess on a planet populated by nearly a quarter of a million bland, sterile androids just to avoid prosecution. The man is willing to endure crazy solutions to get himself out of trouble with the authorities, so sucking up to the Klingon Empire is just another patented way to avoid hard time or physical pain at the hands of people who can take your life.

 

[Gonzo]

Kirk had a shit-ton of integrity in both those instances. In bot cases, he tried to right a horrible wrong. In "Armageddon" he was to save his own crew, and the planet(s) with them. Hell, he was using cold-war tactics (mutually assured destruction), but in order so save people. And in "private war" his goal was to "correct" the klingon incursion, to bring the people back to their original ways, and away from the opression of the klingon-backed warmongers.

But the most important difference is: Both of these instances were HEAVLY debated.
There was much discussion going on. Testing out limits. And different opinions being voiced about the way how to proceed and if it was justified. You might disagree with the conclusions Kirk came to (as I disagree with many of Sisko's conclusions), but the reason you remember it so well was because of how many thoughts went into it.

Compare that do Lorca leaving Mudd behind just 'cause. There was no reason, no debate, no moral conflict, no anything. Lorca was just being a dick. Leaving another being back for certain torture and death. Not because it would improve ehir own chances, or because he could only save two people. No. Just because he might have cooperated with the klingons (to, again, evade torture and death). That's just immoral, however you want to spin it.

He is lucky I wasnt there, I would have shot Mudd dead as a traitor, then I would have destroyed the prison ship while screaming "That's not a D7".

I would have also destroyed the peacocks to spare the Klingons any further embarrassment, but not before taking pictures to use as blackmail material later as no true Klingon would be seen dead in them.

 

[cooleddie74]

The Klingon raider ship actually had a cameo right before the beginning of each episode of TOS. Did you know that?

Check it out!

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[Rahul]

There's no "might" to it. Mudd WAS cooperating with the Klingons and would have betrayed both just to save his own neck. You don't put yourself and your crew in jeopardy just to appease a higher sense of morality.

So what? Here is a universal truth: Torture breaks everyone. That's why it's not a reliable information gathering technique (even if entertainment regularly tries to sell it you as that): Under torture people do everything and say anything to make it stop. A "confession" under torture is worthless, the same as the "information" gathered - just ask like half of the inmates of Guantanamo Bay. If you really want to dig further into this subject, might I recommend you this John Oliver video, which presents the fact very informative and in an actually watchable way:

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That being said: Tuggin Mudd along wouldn't have put Lorca or his crew in any more jeopardy than they originally were. In fact, even less, six eyes see more than four eyes. And Mudds "information" would have been worthless anyway: What did he do? Hid a listening device? In a torture cell? As if there aren't buttloads of them in the walls anyway.

That Mudd was a criminal worth putting before a judge doesn't change this or takes away his humanity.

But apparently this is what people want. Most people seem to love Lorca, and they had a poll on leaving Mudd behind on After Trek. Something like 75% of people voted that it was a right call and then the host joked about it. People want to see tough guy arseholes.

No I don't get it and I don't want that sort of Star Trek, but the truth is people like us are in the minority.

Sadly, this succesfully appeals t our lower instincts: Somebody wronged us, now we can pay them back tenfold. Just ask how many people would like to have some sort of come-uppance to their schoolyard-bully. Humans do seem to have a knack fo pure vengeance, and the usual Hollywod entertainment surely cultivates and helps to grow it.

This is one of the things where Star Trek in the past was special. TOS and TNG especially, but even during VOY or ENT the characters worked toward an agreement and reconciliation (see the Xindi-arc) instead of the usual "defeating" of the "other" guys.

We will see how DIS develops. I think it might surprise us in the future, and the war with the klingons doesn't look like one to be "won", but one to be "settled" in some sort of way. And since my personal pet theory is that Lorca will turn out to be the Big-name-actor-British-surprise-villain (see "Wonder Woman" for latest example) of the first season, I give them more leeway to act in "bad faith" when he's "alone in the dark" and nobody there to watch him.

But yeah, the kind of following his obvious immoral ways and choices have is kind of frightening, although not exactly surprising, given the current political climate all over the world.

 

[Noname Given]

One more curious bit. Mudd throws T'Kuvma's rationale for the war back in Lorca's face. Perhaps Mudd is in on this on a much deeper level. If so, there is no excuse for him being free during TOS.

Mudd has spent time in Federation custody (Prior to his first TOS appearance in TOS - Mudd's Women:

COMPUTER: Offense record. Smuggling. Sentence suspended. Transport of stolen goods. Purchase of space vessel with counterfeit currency. Sentences, psychiatric treatment, effectiveness disputed.

KIRK: Mister Mudd, you're charged with galaxy travel without a flight plan, without an identification beam, and failure to answer a starship's signal, thus effecting a menace to navigation.

MUDD: What? My tiny ship in this immense galaxy a menace to navigation?

KIRK: You're also charged with operation of a vessel without a master's license.

MUDD: Untrue! I have a master's ticket.

COMPUTER: Incorrect. Master's license revoked Stardate 1116.4.

Perhaps he was telling the truth (but was colluding with the Klingons to get better treatment) - and he may do something to somewhat redeem himself later in the story.

Spoiler

I believe they've stated the 'Harry Mudd' character is in three episodes.

 

[Big Data]

Why is the tardigrade unable to directly travel the mycelial network until it is off of the ship?

 

[Mudd]

Why is the tardigrade unable to directly travel the mycelial network until it is off of the ship?

Because Reasons.

Welcome to Discovery.

 

[137th Gebirg]

Oh give me a break! back at ya. It was being blocked by the force fields that was holding it there since it arrived.

 

[Big Data]

It at least walked the other ship unshielded before arriving on Disco. And there are several instances where we can assume that it was unshielded on Disco, like in that field of mushrooms or when Burnham let it out in the lab.

 

[Gonzo]

Why is the tardigrade unable to directly travel the mycelial network until it is off of the ship?

Perhaps because it couldn't see where it was going until it was outside.

We actually saw it turn itself towards it destination.

I think it has fart jets it can use to orient itself in space.

 

[Longinus]

It at least walked the other ship unshielded before arriving on Disco. And there are several instances where we can assume that it was unshielded on Disco, like in that field of mushrooms or when Burnham let it out in the lab.

Yep. It makes absolutely no sense.

 

[137th Gebirg]

It at least walked the other ship unshielded before arriving on Disco. And there are several instances where we can assume that it was unshielded on Disco, like in that field of mushrooms or when Burnham let it out in the lab.

Yep. It makes absolutely no sense.

Yes it does. Navigational shields are always on to protect the ship from asteroid/meteor impacts, while under impulse or standard warp. That could have contributed as well, and are an established treknology.

 

[cooleddie74]

I think it has fart jets it can use to orient itself in space.

Those could come in handy when you're looking for the restrooms at a Mexican restaurant. At that point you'd be dealing with a completely different microscopic spore network.

 

[Longinus]

Yes it does. Navigational shields are always on to protect the ship from asteroid/meteor impacts, while under impulse or standard warp. That could have contributed as well, and are an established treknology.

Glenn was just floating in space. I doubt it had any shields on.

 

[SpocksOddSocks]

Oh give me a break! back at ya. It was being blocked by the force fields that was holding it there since it arrived.

This is I how I'm seeing it too. There is a reason the area it was kept on the Glenn was shielded after all... (and they didn't know why, but it was the reason they couldn't just beam the equipment out).

But to be fair to Ed... (even though I'm a lover rather than a hater of Discovery)

Because Reasons.

This was actually the first thing that crossed my mind when I saw the question.

 

[Noname Given]

It at least walked the other ship unshielded before arriving on Disco. And there are several instances where we can assume that it was unshielded on Disco, like in that field of mushrooms or when Burnham let it out in the lab.

On the other ship - it no longer had access to the Spores. Also, when Burnham was 'feeding' it - she didn't give it the same amount of spores as she did before shooting it into space. And with the way the engineering device clamped and poked into the creature, it's probably that anything it's firmly attached to comes along for the ride; and all the other aspects (the ship spinning, etc. Is so the ship itself can withstand whatever forces act on it as it traverses the network.

 

[137th Gebirg]

Glenn was just floating in space. I doubt it had any shields on.

This is I how I'm seeing it too. There is a reason the area it was kept on the Glenn was shielded after all...

But on the Glenn it didn't have any access to the spores. They were likely all locked up in their canisters, just like they are on Disco.

Damn, ninja'd by Noname.

And yes, spores + unshielded access to open space is clearly the only way for the tardigrade to travel on its own.

 

[Big Data]

The spores thing makes sense.

 

[Kemaiku]

Glenn was just floating in space. I doubt it had any shields on.

Plus it means the Tardigrade was able to board the ship while it's warp field, deflector and maybe low levels shields were up creating a barrier to getting in. Yet could *not* leave when all those fields failed and went away?

Uhh....