Why couldn't Vader sense Leia?

[CorporalCaptain]

I believe there is at least suggestive evidence that Vader sensed Leia in TESB in the Millennium Falcon as it was flying away from Hoth, in that Vader seemed certain that they were still alive even while his commanders were willing to believe they'd been destroyed. Pressing on to make certain is one thing, but Vader seemed to have precognitive certainty.

Why this would be something that Vader couldn't sense before, I cannot say. However, the Emperor's ESP abilities were clearly limited, so why not Vader's sometimes too? Perhaps it had to do with Anakin reawakening inside Vader. Maybe the closer Vader was to becoming Anakin again, the more clearly he could sense his children.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

On the contrary, so far as Yoda was concerned Leia was the preferred candidate. She's not inherently weaker or stronger than he, he's just the one that put the training in and force "powers" are like any skill: the more you practice, the more able you become.

But that's not in the film (the product originally sold to the target audience), nor was it suggested at all. How is it Leia never exhibited any Force potential when Luke had--evidenced by Obi-Wan noting Luke was already a good pilot--skills that were obviously enhanced by his connection to the Force. That was before Luke ever trained. For all of her assumed duties, on-screen Leia never seemed to be as naturally gifted by / connected to the Force as Luke.

 

[Ithekro]

Maybe she is, but its in the diplomatic arts and her negotiation skills. Perhaps she can do subtle mind tricks and doesn't even realize it.

 

[Reverend]

But that's not in the film (the product originally sold to the target audience), nor was it suggested at all. How is it Leia never exhibited any Force potential when Luke had--evidenced by Obi-Wan noting Luke was already a good pilot--skills that were obviously enhanced by his connection to the Force. That was before Luke ever trained. For all of her assumed duties, on-screen Leia never seemed to be as naturally gifted by / connected to the Force as Luke.

Luke never exhibited explicit force abilities either until *after* he was instructed. So the movies aren't a terribly conclusive source of information on this particular subject.
For all we know, five minutes of instruction from Luke after RotJ and Leia may have had Wicket floating upside down by his ankles. What we do know is that she chose not to pursue the life of a Jedi (which contrary to how the EU depicted it is not a weekend hobby, but a life long commitment) and instead chose to focus he skills on what she knew best.
She's still clearly much stronger in the force and open to it by the time of TFA as we see her sense Han's death from halfway across the galaxy.

ETA: Just occurred to me, but Leia did hear Luke's call over Bespin. One might argue that was more Luke than Leia, but have we *ever* seen a force user communicate remotely with a non-force user? I don't think so.

Maybe she is, but its in the diplomatic arts and her negotiation skills. Perhaps she can do subtle mind tricks and doesn't even realize it.

IIRC the recent Leia novel did imply it at least gives her insight when talking with people, which she just assumes is intuition. I think there was also a bit where she seems to unknowingly draw from the dark side.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Why does everyone forget that Leia was handy with a blaster, really handy?

 

[Jedman67]

Why does everyone forget that Leia was handy with a blaster, really handy?

So was Han and Chewie

 

[Reverend]

So was Han and Chewie

They had *way* more practice. But still, I agree that this is a dubious point at best.

 

[Tuskin38]

Leia has been helping the rebels since a young age, I also wouldn't be surprised if her father had her taught how to use one.

 

[LJones41]

So was Han and Chewie

So was her mother.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

My point was, why focus on her diplomatic skills as if that was all she did?

 

[Reverend]

My point was, why focus on her diplomatic skills as if that was all she did?

Because that was always her focus and first recourse. Taking after her birth mother, "aggressive negotiations" were always a last resort. She's a peacemaker first, warrior second. Which is just another reason why she'd probably make a much better Jedi than Luke in some ways.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Because that was always her focus and first recourse. Taking after her birth mother, "aggressive negotiations" were always a last resort. She's a peacemaker first, warrior second. Which is just another reason why she'd probably make a much better Jedi than Luke in some ways.

That doesn't answer the question. The fact was, Leia was every bit as good as Luke, Chewie, and Han in a firefight, even rescuing them from Detention Block AA-23. If Luke's force abilities gave him an edge, why couldn't Leia's do the same for her?

 

[Reverend]

That doesn't answer the question. The fact was, Leia was every bit as good as Luke, Chewie, and Han in a firefight, even rescuing them from Detention Block AA-23. If Luke's force abilities gave him an edge, why couldn't Leia's do the same for her?

I don't recall anyone saying that wasn't the case and yes, I did answer the question. People tend emphasise Leia's diplomatic skills over her martial skills because that's what she's best at. That doesn't implicitly negate the rest of her skills.

 

[Ithekro]

Jedi were keeps of the peace, not soldiers. They use to go to planets and settle disputes. Most Jedi wouldn't need to draw their lightsabers. Leia's skill set fits what a Jedi use to be during the centuries before the Clone Wars. Luke's skills fit those Jedi involved in the Clone Wars. Now Luke's skills may have changed in the last 30 years for TLJ, and we don't know what, if any, skills Leia has as a Force user. She's no Jedi, but she is a Skywalker.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I don't recall anyone saying that wasn't the case

I do, and it's on this page.

 

[Ithekro]

Luke's abilities with a blaster had nothing to do with the Force. His piloting abilities possibly did though. We didn't see Leia doing much in terms of fancy flying until I think the speeder bike chase in Endor. Maybe when she took Han's seat in the Falcon while escaping Cloud City, but at that point its seems more likely Chewbacca is flying since Leia is giving orders to both him and Lando in those scenes.

 

[LJones41]

I don't recall anyone saying that wasn't the case and yes, I did answer the question. People tend emphasise Leia's diplomatic skills over her martial skills because that's what she's best at. That doesn't implicitly negate the rest of her skills.

I would also like to add is why should Leia's martial skills be considered more important than her diplomatic skills? This comes back to a problem I have in regard to female characters in the late 20th and early 21st centuries. I've noticed that a lot of people seemed to regard female characters as "strong" only when they are labeled as "badass". In order to be a strong woman, the latter has to be a man with breasts. Come to think of it, a male character is viewed as strong as long as he is some Action Jackson. It doesn't say much about our society.

Anakin never sensed that Leia and Luke were his children, let alone strong with the Force, when he first laid eyes upon them both. He never sensed it when Leia was being tortured. He never sensed it when he spotted Luke in the Death Star's hangar bay. And that's because they were not using the Force during those times.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I would also like to add is why should Leia's martial skills be considered more important than her diplomatic skills?

Who said they were? I never made any such claim, ever.

Anakin never sensed that Leia and Luke were his children, let alone strong with the Force, when he first laid eyes upon them both. He never sensed it when Leia was being tortured. He never sensed it when he spotted Luke in the Death Star's hangar bay. And that's because they were not using the Force during those times.

Was Ben using the Force when Vader sensed a presence in the Hanger Bay when he first inspected the Falcon, or for that matter was Luke? IIRC, both were simply hiding in Han's smuggling compartments. So, why should people strong with the Force have to be using the Force for Vader to sense their presence? The 1977 film establishes that they don't. That is, unless in fact they are more or less always using the Force.

 

[Reverend]

Was Ben using the Force when Vader sensed a presence in the Hanger Bay when he first inspected the Falcon, or for that matter was Luke? IIRC, both were simply hiding in Han's smuggling compartments. So, why should people strong with the Force have to be using the Force for Vader to sense their presence? The 1977 film establishes that they don't. That is, unless in fact they are more or less always using the Force.

Apples and oranges. Vader senses Obi-Wan because he's his former master. It's a very familiar presence to him, one that'd he'd recognise anywhere. Masters and Padawans develop a very close bond that can allow them to sense each other halfway across the galaxy, given the right circumstances. When he's that close to him, he could hardly miss it if he tried.
With Luke & Leia, there's no such point of reference. They may be his and Padme's children, but they're still unique individuals.

 

[Ithekro]

That masters and padawans share a close bond is restated in the Ahsoka novel when she tries to find Anakin in the Force and can't, thus she assumes he died.

Years later she does encounters someone familiar, but tries her best to not believe it, cause what she's found goes against everything she knew about Anakin Skywalker. And in some respects she was correct. As far as Darth Vader is concerned, Anakin Skywalker is dead. But he's not....not completely. He is just buried under layers of anger, pain, self-hatred, and despair.

Vader doesn't recognizes his children in the Force because he never really felt them in the Force before. He was away for much of the war, and only found out Padme was pregnant late. He didn't know she was having twins. He might have brushed one of them in the Force, but honestly, by that point, Anakin was having nightmares and it was becoming difficult for him to focus from all appearances. At least when it came to simple things. He was getting twisted around by both Palpatine and the actions of the Jedi Council. He really wanted to run, but because of his visions of Padme's death, he just couldn't think.

Darth Vader did feel the Force from Luke over the Death Star and commented on it. That plus the destruction of the Death Star made him very curious about who took out the Death Star. He did encounter Luke later on and realized he was the boy that had been with Obi-wan on the Death Star...but Luke was fairly weak in terms of training and no worth the effort to Vader....but his lightsaber, though...that sparked some interest. Followed by Boba Fett tracking down this rebel pilot's name as Skywalker. That set Vader off. Palpatine had lied to him. Not only that, but now, for the first time since Padme died.....Vader had a potential future.....Anakin Skywalker had a potential future. That changed things.

Poking around Luke's head for a weakness to exploit over Endor was how he found out about Luke having a twin sister. I don't know if he figured out that was Leia on the spot, or if that was something he picked up after becoming a Force Ghost. It is possible that Leia is naturally very good at hiding her Force potential. Or just that because she almost never used it means no one important noticed.