Lorca: Fans Will Have To Adjust

[Jedi_Master]

I don't think I've seen this in any other fandom. At least not to the degree you see it in Trek fandom. It is indeed super confusing. The best thing CBS can do is really expand the Trek fanbase and keep expanding it and providing new and different experiences. We've seen what happens when they stick to the same formula over and over again.

I agree. In the Star Wars fandom, there was a tiny faction of JJ Abrams haters who declared they would rather see Star Wars fail, but it was nothing like Star Trek. It's depressing sometimes, and it's a big part of why Star Trek will always be a second-tier franchise as a far-too-large percentage of its fans prefer to be high priests guarding their sacred interpretation of canon rather than part of a influential pop-culture phenomenon.

 

[fireproof78]

Trek fans really relish the idea of the thing they love failing. It's super weird.

I really haven't seen this elsewhere. It's one thing, at least to me, to express frustration, disappointment or criticism of a new iteration, but that isn't what I have seen. From Abrams Trek, to DSC I've seen a wish that Star Trek no longer continue, that it cease producing new content, rather than produce DSC or Kelvin universe.

I find it truly baffling, on a level makes no sense. I don't see the harm in adding new ideas and content to a property, and letting the audience choose what they like and don't like.

It's funny to me that Star Trek, which champions humanity's ability to change and become more, is being expected to remain the same, while Star Wars is getting criticized for not changing enough.

 

[Krandor]

I don't think I've seen this in any other fandom. At least not to the degree you see it in Trek fandom. It is indeed super confusing. The best thing CBS can do is really expand the Trek fanbase and keep expanding it and providing new and different experiences. We've seen what happens when they stick to the same formula over and over again.

It really is weird. I don't get it.

 

[Roald]

Absolutely agree.

Lowest point I have ever experienced on the forum was when Brett said: "Personally, I hope it dies and stays dead this time".
It is unimaginable for me that people who have that kind of hope are part of a Star Trek message board...

 

[fireproof78]

Absolutely agree.

Lowest point I have ever experienced on the forum was when Brett said: "Personally, I hope it dies and stays dead this time".
It is unimaginable for me that people who have that kind of hope are part of a Star Trek message board...

I recall that post, but, hey, we're here to discuss Star Trek, right?

I'm more curious as to the "Why?" of that thought, rather than "Why are they here on this board?"

 

[Roald]

I recall that post, but, hey, we're here to discuss Star Trek, right?

I'm more curious as to the "Why?" of that thought, rather than "Why are they here on this board?"

Guess so. Still, if I went to a Coldplay fans message board, and someone would say: 'I wish the band would just dissolve and never record anything ever again', I imagine most there would find it highly odd... I'm always open for discussion, but the basis in here has to be the love for Trek, right? Why else are we here? If someone wants the thing I (we) love DEAD.... geez, that's just bizarre to me...

 

[Captain of the USS Averof]

Like in any other fandom (which comes from the word fanatic) you have those that immediately hate any new installment, without even watching it and even if it turns out to be a masterpiece and you have those that immediately love any new installment, even without watching it and even if it turns out to be utter shit. I don't see how Star Trek fandom can be any different.

 

[JasonJ]

Isaacs' comments are fairly accurate and factual, whether they were appropriate to say publicly or not, I am unsure.

What I am sure of is that a whole lot of people need to get some thicker skin. I'm saying this as a guy who offends easily and found Isaacs' statement to in fact be, not offensive (to me).

 

[Myko]

I'm not defending the behaviour, but it is a matter of opportunity cost. If you're waiting for a new Star Trek that you like, and it comes out and you didn't like it, that means you must wait for that to disappear before you can get the Star Trek you wanted.

 

[Vger23]

I'm not defending the behaviour, but it is a matter of opportunity cost. If you're waiting for a new Star Trek that you like, and it comes out and you didn't like it, that means you must wait for that to disappear before you can get the Star Trek you wanted.

I think in some cases this is very true...but it would be so in more than this fandom, wouldn't it?

Most of what's being discussed above is that this seems uniquely intense in Star Trek fandom.

I've noted the same thing. There's such an intense negativity amongst Trek fans that people would rather be vindicated by the failure of the franchise than see something they don't resonate with continue. It's absolutely bizarre. Even worse, as I've mentioned previously, many will actively look to bring about the failure by spreading bad word of mouth, "boycotting" etc.

I think it's a control thing. Someone mentioned earlier that the letter writing campaigns associated with Trek's early beginnings give the fans a misguided sense of "ownership" in the franchise and considerable feelings of entitlement. So, I believe there's a strong element of "the battle for control" in Star Trek between the fans and the creative powers. The fans like to prove to the creators that they can influence, control and own the franchise. They want to prove that they give it life, and they can kill it as well. It's a power thing. Pure and simple.

It's also why you see such an overreaction to Jason Isaacs' commentary. The typical fan who feels as I've described above will be enraged that someone would DARE to challenge their supreme ownership and investment in the franchise.

 

[Cake]

Trek fans really relish the idea of the thing they love failing. It's super weird.

No one is doing this. People who wish something would fail, aren't a fan of it.

People can be fans of TOS and dislike the rest. Or they like DS9 and VOY, but can't bother with the other series. Or they only like the new movies and can't deal with the "old outdated stuff". Just to name a few examples. I guess they can be all called Trek fans, because they like at least one incarnation of the franchise, but the differences between them are obvious.

Trek fans are not a monolithic group who all love everything with the name Star Trek on it. They often don't like this or that and if they rather see something gone, they are not a fan of this specific series or movie. They are not wishing something they love would fail, they are actually wishing something they dislike or even hate will fail. I don't see what is weird about it.

 

[Jedi_Master]

The "ownership" entitlement myth was fostered by GR as a way to boost the future popularity of a three season show that a lot of people never saw... and for a time Star Trek was so niche that it could conceivably be owned by the fans.
It's not niche anymore, and that seems to piss people off.

 

[Vger23]

No one is doing this. People who wish something would fail, aren't a fan of it.

People can be fans of TOS and dislike the rest. Or they like DS9 and VOY, but can't bother with the other series. Or they only like the new movies and can't deal with the "old outdated stuff". Just to name a few examples. I guess they can be all called Trek fans, because they like at least one incarnation of the franchise, but the differences between them are obvious.

Trek fans are not a monolithic group who all love everything with the name Star Trek on it. They often don't like this or that and if they rather see something gone, they are not a fan of this specific series or movie. They are not wishing something they love would fail, they are actually wishing something they dislike or even hate will fail. I don't see what is weird about it.

Why does it have to fail? Why can't it be allowed to continue to the enjoyment of others?

I can't stand (I mean...I think they are the ebola of Hollywood productions) superhero movies. But, I don't wish that they'd fail. They entertain and bring joy to millions and millions of people. The fact that I don't like them is my problem. And the solution is simple- I don't go to see them.

It's sick that there are Trek fans who would actively be engaged with bringing about the failure of a piece of the franchise.

Yes, it's weird.

Sorry.

 

[Jedi_Master]

No one is doing this. People who wish something would fail, aren't a fan of it.

People can be fans of TOS and dislike the rest. Or they like DS9 and VOY, but can't bother with the other series. Or they only like the new movies and can't deal with the "old outdated stuff". Just to name a few examples. I guess they can be all called Trek fans, because they like at least one incarnation of the franchise, but the differences between them are obvious.

Trek fans are not a monolithic group who all love everything with the name Star Trek on it. They often don't like this or that and if they rather see something gone, they are not a fan of this specific series or movie. They are not wishing something they love would fail, they are actually wishing something they dislike or even hate will fail. I don't see what is weird about it.

When the EXISTENCE of new material depends on the commercial success of the current iteration, and "fans" want the current iteration that contains bits and pieces they subjectively dislike to FAIL, then they are endangering a franchise I love, and I am sick of that crap.
So a "fan" only likes re-watching the old stuff? Fine.
But if a "fan" wants the NEW stuff to fail, and potentially mean that NOTHING NEW is ever produced again?
Screw that noise. Don't endanger MY enjoyment because your knickers are in a twist over some stupid alien forehead.

 

[Vger23]

Screw that noise. Don't endanger MY enjoyment because your knickers are in a twist over some stupid alien forehead.

But again...it's CONTROL and showing who has the POWER.

"Oh...how DARE you mess with <insert meaningless bull-scoot thing to get mad about here>. I'll not abide by that, you bastids!!! After all the time and money and emotional energy I've put into being a "FAN???" You will feel my wrath!!! I will burn this house to the GROUND!!!!"

 

[BillJ]

Seems like there would be more constructive things people could do with their time than bitch, moan and hope for failure of something. But what do I know?

 

[Jedi_Master]

Seems like there would be more constructive things people could do with their time than bitch, moan and hope for failure of something. But what do I know?

Nothing, Bill Snow. Nothing.

 

[Shaka Zulu]

When the EXISTENCE of new material depends on the commercial success of the current iteration, and "fans" want the current iteration that contains bits and pieces they subjectively dislike to FAIL, then they are endangering a franchise I love, and I am sick of that crap.
So a "fan" only likes re-watching the old stuff? Fine.
But if a "fan" wants the NEW stuff to fail, and potentially mean that NOTHING NEW is ever produced again?
Screw that noise. Don't endanger MY enjoyment because your knickers are in a twist over some stupid alien forehead.

All of this could be equally said about the Snyderverse DC Comics movies too (Man of Steel, BvS: Dawn Of Justice, and Justice League), except people don't see the similarities.

 

[Jedi_Master]

All of this could be equally said about the Snyderverse DC Comics movies too (Man of Steel, BvS: Dawn Of Justice, and Justice League), except people don't see the similarities.

Fanbois like to cross-polinate.

 

[Mudd]

No one is doing this.

Lots of people are doing this.