Alternative to Discovery

[GornCaptain]

What you're doing here is called gatekeeping and it's really dumb and arbitrary. These "standards" are completely meaningless to anyone but yourself. All this does is discourage newcomers and make Trekkies look like jerks.

Here's an actual rule of thumb to be a Trekkie: Do you like Star Trek? If the answer is yes, you're a Trekkie. If someone has seen a single episode or movie and they say they're a Trekkie, hey, welcome to the club. Glad to have that person. If someone has only seen STID and calls themselves a Star Trek fan, they are just as legitimately a Trekkie as someone who's seen every episode of every series six times.

TLDR: Don't be a gatekeeper. It's not a good look.

Well I'm sorry you feel that way but I look at it differently. I think there are different levels of fandom and made up a simple and quick 3 step process to decide if you're a hardcore fan or not. I'm not trying to exclude anyone and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with a person if they aren't a hardcore fan but I can't consider someone a true hardcore fan of a franchise without meeting my 3 requirements. I don't think anyone who bashes the original incarnation of something or doesn't like half of a franchise is a true fan but that's me. And it wasn't a test for Trekkies but any franchise which I clearly stated. I didn't say this was a scientifi, end all be all list. People always ask what's a "true fan" well I actually put some substance to it and decided to share it on MY thread. You could take some of your own advice and be a little less hostile when responding to someone.

 

[Balok's Decoy]

Well I'm sorry you feel that way but I look at it differently. I think there are different levels of fandom and made up a simple and quick 3 step process to decide if you're a hardcore fan or not. I'm not trying to exclude anyone and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with a person if they aren't a hardcore fan but I can't consider someone a true hardcore fan of a franchise without meeting my 3 requirements. I don't think anyone who bashes the original incarnation of something or doesn't like half of a franchise is a true fan but that's me. And it wasn't a test for Trekkies but any franchise which I clearly stated. I didn't say this was a scientifi, end all be all list. People always ask what's a "true fan" well I actually put some substance to it and decided to share it on MY thread. You could take some of your own advice and be a little less hostile when responding to someone.

Gatekeeping hurts the fandom, so a terse tone is justified. I'm not saying anything disparaging about you as a person, only about your...methods.

You can have your Official GornCaptain Certified Trek Fan 3-Step Process if you like but don't expect anyone to take it seriously and know that nobody here will, and I only hope that no newcomers do.

 

[GornCaptain]

To be fair, if somebody declares that "Spock's Brain" or "The Way to Eden" are their favorite eps, I'm going to quietly raise an eyebrow (and possibly question their sanity), but I'm not going to demand that they turn in their fan card or accuse them of not being a "real" Trekkie. Because that just reeks of fannish snobbery, and sends a message that Trekkies are cliquish and unwelcoming to newcomers.

"Gatekeeping" is part of a larger syndrome. As genre fiction becomes more mainstream, you invariably see some fans getting all territorial and trying to mark their territory. "I was a fan of that obscure indie band before they got popular," etc.

But you know what? We need to get over that. The attitude that Trek is only for the "real" Trekkies, and that only our opinions matter, is not doing anyone any favors. .

I assume you're being facetious because questioning someone's sanity over their pick for favorite episode is beyond anything I said. Also I never stated I would ever tell someone to turn in their fan card. My criteria isn't about what's your fave episode or series or movie, etc. it's solely on do you respect the original and how much have you seen and do you like of the franchise. That's all.

 

[GornCaptain]

Gatekeeping hurts the fandom, so a terse tone is justified. I'm not saying anything disparaging about you as a person, only about your...methods.

You can have your Official GornCaptain Certified Trek Fan 3-Step Process if you like but don't expect anyone to take it seriously and know that nobody here will, and I only hope that no newcomers do.

I disagree what I'm doing is gatekeeping at all. Also you can make any excuse you want to be terse or disparaging towards another but the real problem is you got upset with my post and couldn't control your anger so you lashed out at me. All I'm saying is try taking some of your own advice and be more diplomatic with those you disagree with. You're not the arbitrator on what is and isn't acceptable in fandom anymore than I am.

 

[Balok's Decoy]

I disagree what I'm doing is gatekeeping at all. Also you can make any excuse you want to be terse or disparaging towards another but the real problem is you got upset with my post and couldn't control your anger so you lashed out at me. All I'm saying is try taking some of your own advice and be more diplomatic with those you disagree with. You're not the arbitrator on what is and isn't acceptable in fandom anymore than I am.

I'm not angry, I just think your 3 step True Fan system is snobby and unnecessary and exclusionary. It's just a rotten way to treat other fans.

 

[fireproof78]

To be fair, if somebody declares that "Spock's Brain" or "The Way to Eden" are their favorite eps, I'm going to quietly raise an eyebrow (and possibly question their sanity), but I'm not going to demand that they turn in their fan card or accuse them of not being a "real" Trekkie. Because that just reeks of fannish snobbery, and sends a message that Trekkies are cliquish and unwelcoming to newcomers.

"Gatekeeping" is part of a larger syndrome. As genre fiction becomes more mainstream, you invariably see some fans getting all territorial and trying to mark their territory. "I was a fan of that obscure indie band before they got popular," etc.

But you know what? We need to get over that. The attitude that Trek is only for the "real" Trekkies, and that only our opinions matter, is not doing anyone any favors. .

Unfortunately, it will also lead to a property's decline.

I'm not angry, I just think your 3 step True Fan system is snobby and unnecessary and exclusionary. It's just a rotten way to treat other fans.

But, how will I know I'm enjoying a fandom if I don't pass the test?

But, yes, in a fandom that espouses IDIC and then condemns personally enjoyment as "not true fans" is completely unnecessary because it adds nothing to the discussion.

 

[Greg Cox]

I assume you're being facetious because questioning someone's sanity over their pick for favorite episode is beyond anything I said. Also I never stated I would ever tell someone to turn in their fan card. My criteria isn't about what's your fave episode or series or movie, etc. it's solely on do you respect the original and how much have you seen and do you like of the franchise. That's all.

Oh, yeah, the sanity gag was me trying to be funny. But, more seriously, why do we even need to determine who is a "true fan" or not? Yeah, people use that term, but I'm not a big fan of it. In practice, the whole "Trekkier than thou" thing never ends well and, yes, lends itself to gatekeeping:

"Who cares what those people think? They're not true fans."

True story: I was once accused of not being a "true" SUPERMAN fan by somebody who probably wasn't even born when I was watching George Reeves on our old black-and-white TV set and buying Action Comics at the drug store for twelve cents apiece. Still makes me shake my head a little.

The whole "true fan" business needs to have a stake driven through its heart.

 

[fireproof78]

^^
That's not how vampires work!!! Didn't you read "Twilight?" you're not a true fan.

In seriousness, it always amazes me how the lines of fandom are drawn. Honestly, it makes very little sense, and your story reinforces that even more.

 

[1001001]

The whole "true fan" business needs to have a stake driven through its heart.

Amen.

 

[Greg Cox]

And "gatekeeping" is a pernicious force in many fandoms these days.. At worst, it leads to people accused of being "fake fans," as well the dismissal of any opinions outside those of the self-appointed "true fans," which can lead to tunnel vision, insularity, fannish elitism, etc.

Call me a populist, but STAR TREK is for everyone, not just the "true fans."

 

[Balok's Decoy]

Oh, yeah, the sanity gag was me trying to be funny. But, more seriously, why do we even need to determine who is a "true fan" or not? Yeah, people use that term, but I'm not a big fan of it. In practice, the whole "Trekkier than thou" thing never ends well and, yes, lends itself to "gatekeeping":

"Who cares what those people think? They're not true fans."

True story: I was once accused of not being a "true" SUPERMAN fan by somebody who probably wasn't even born when I was watching George Reeves on our old black-and-white TV and buying comic books at the drug store for twelve cents apiece. Still makes me shake my head a little.

The whole "true fan" business needs to have a stake driven through its heart.

All of this. When I hear someone say they like [insert anything Star Trek related], I immediately get excited because it means we have something in common -- that this person also likes this cool thing that I care about. I'm just happy they like it at all, to any extent.

Sure, maybe there's such a thing as "hardcore" fans. People who, y'know, sign up for a message board dedicated to the thing (see: all of us). People who go out of their way to watch every single episode or buy overpriced models of starships or read novelizations or obsessively play an MMORPG based on it or dress up and go to special events all about the thing so they can hang out with other people who love it, etc and so forth.

You can take your interest in this fandom and run with it and we can call that "hardcore." But a hardcore fan isn't any more legitimate or "better" than a fan who is more casual about it. It doesn't mean you can lord it over them like they have something to prove. There is no such thing as a "true" fan. We're all just fans.

Call me a populist, but STAR TREK is for everyone,

This is the heart of the matter. It's for everyone, at every level and every variation.

 

[Kor]

And somebody can be a hardcore fan of one particular iteration of a media franchise without being a fan of other iterations of it. There's nothing wrong with that.

Kor

 

[Balok's Decoy]

And somebody can be a hardcore fan of one particular iteration of a media franchise without being a fan of other iterations of it. There's nothing wrong with that.

Kor

Absolutely. There's tons of people just on this forum who are hardcore TOS fans but don't give a damn about anything else in the franchise. There are hardcore DS9 fans who live and breathe that series but only casually dip into the other series. And all of that is okay! All of these differences are just interesting and inspire discussion. None of it can or should be used as a way to rank or categorize fans in any way.

 

[Paul Weaver]

That's not how vampires work!!! Didn't you read "Twilight?" you're not a true fan.

Buffy was the original vampire works.


Although I wonder if I'm a true fan if I don't rate the original Buffy Film, after all

"You have to like, respect, and be able to consume (read, watch, play, etc.) the original incarnation of the franchise"

 

[Greg Cox]

Buffy was the original vampire works.

I tried reading Varney the Vampyre (1845) once. Never again.

Does that mean I'm not a true vampire fan?

 

[Nerys Myk]

I tried reading Varney the Vampyre (1845) once. Never again.

Does that mean I'm not a true vampire fan?

Barney the Vampyre is better.
Friendly, purple Dinosaur Vampires are totally canon!

 

[Balok's Decoy]

You're not a true fan of horror movies unless you've seen The Cabinet of Dr Caligari precisely six times and written at least two critical essays about its influence on the genre.

 

[fireproof78]

I tried reading Varney the Vampyre (1845) once. Never again.

Does that mean I'm not a true vampire fan?

Nah, as long as you have watched Van Helsing, Blade, and Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter you should be find the enter the secret clubhouse at your local mortuary/crypt.

You're not a true fan of horror movies unless you've seen The Cabinet of Dr Caligari precisely six times and written at least two critical essays about its influence on the genre.

Indeed.

Also, you are not a true Phantom of the Opera unless you have only read the original novel, and seen the Lon Cheney version. If you know one song from the Andrew Lloyd Weber abomination, you are automatically disqualified, as well as three generations after you.

 

[Greg Cox]

Nah, as long as you have watched Van Helsing, Blade, and Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter you should be find the enter the secret clubhouse at your local mortuary/crypt.

Indeed.

Also, you are not a true Phantom of the Opera unless you have only read the original novel, and seen the Lon Cheney version. If you know one song from the Andrew Lloyd Weber abomination, you are automatically disqualified, as well as three generations after you.

But what about the Claude Rains and Herbert Lom versions?

And, honestly, I'll take the musical over the Hammer Films version any day.

 

[GornCaptain]

See my criteria is something to aspire to and a goal to attain. You guys are taken it entirely the wrong way but that's fine it's my list. I apply my criteria to myself to so i guess I'm being exclusionary towards myself lol. I didn't consider myself a Trekkie or true fan after watching TOS. I didn't even consider it. I've read more Superman comics than 75-85% of Superman fans out there but because he has so many comics in his canon I don't meet criteria #2 let alone #3 on my list so as much as it pains me to say it I don't consider myself a true Superman fan. Like I said I think there can definitely be different levels if fandom. It's the equivalent of having a rank of captain on the bridge rather commander or lieutenant. We're all on the same ship (fandom) and striving towards the same goals but also differently accomplished in our fandom. You can call it snobbish or whatever but I've put in the hours and money to prove my fandom and it irks me to see immature condescending new comers sprout up and act like know-it-alls. Unfortunately I've learned from the Internet that veteran Trekkies can be just as insufferable and perplexing as the new fans but atleast they've proven their fandom so I have a little more respect for their opinion. It's no different than taking the opinion of a learned man over a non learned man. I respect both men but will probably defer to the learned man a tad bit more especially in his area of expertise.