Can you explain that again, please. I didn't quite understand it. What do you mean by 'appearance of the Sliurians' ?
Starfleet is a Space Navy (military fleet)
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Can you explain that again, please. I didn't quite understand it. What do you mean by 'appearance of the Sliurians' ?
The Silurians are a reptilian species native to Earth that were highly advanced and went into hibernation deep under the Earth at various times in various ages of the Dinosaurs. They have had I think three different physical appearances since they were first introduced during the run of the Third Doctor in the 1970, and again a few times for the Third and later the Fifth Doctor in the 1980s. There were not seen again until the Eleventh and Twelfth Doctor era from 2010 onwards, and they looked a lot different in the 2010s than they did in the 1970s and 1980s.
They have had more exposure since 2010 than they did in earlier versions, so the more humanoid looking Silurians is more common today. The kind that can be done with makeup rather than large masks.
They have had more exposure since 2010 than they did in earlier versions, so the more humanoid looking Silurians is more common today. The kind that can be done with makeup rather than large masks.
I've been reading the paperbacks since age seven and watched all the episodes.
Then they should not make them act like one. When war breaks out Kirk et al should be calling someone else. All this 'Enterprise is the only ship in the sector nonsense, so go fight the bad guys' is a contradiction. And there are no 'trace elements' of a military in Starfleet? You call The Dominion war a 'trace element', War with the Romulans a 'trace element', War with the Klingons a 'trace element'? Having the legal authority to protect your borders and fight the enemy in combat, you consider this 'superficial'? LOL
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Those who go for the legal argument. Many years ago I would be considered 3/5ths human based on some weird, stupid law. Perhaps those under such a law should have accepted their fate. 'Stop looking and doing things that fully human people do, you're only 3/5ths human'! 
Sometimes the law is a friggin ass.
Sometimes the law is a friggin ass.
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Like the love instructors concept????
"The Trouble with Tribbles"
Canon was based on the whim of GR , TAS was not considered canon for a while, now it is. Plus ST canon is not the divine Ten commandments. it contradicts itself all the time.
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ST TOS The trouble with Tribbles
The very human looking Tribble trader was selling them on a Federation starbase to Federation citizens. Uhura wanted to buy one, but got one free. Try again.
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And Spock would know, down to the last penny.
Neither is true based what we've seen on screen. In order to make it work, we have to start playing pedantic word games, not taking what is said and seen by the audience at face value.
I don't think they meant "can" because Starfleet cannot enter the DMZ. If they could, Picard would have gotten his Maquis at the end of Preemptive strike.
Splendid, then not only do you know precisely what we are talking about, but even know about missing episodes. Tell me, what's your view on Gallifreyan genetic engineering, the nature of regeneration as a result of the engineering advances of Rassilon and Omega, and how to tie the conflicting narratives of say Loom born gallifreyans from the naturally aging versions we now have on television? Did you think the Klein bottle approach worked well, or prefer the death and rebirth approach expanded from the concepts presented in Terminus and expanded upon by the events of things like Ancestor Cell and those works, and how that ties into current continuity via things like the universe reset in Pandorica? I think it in part explains the move from a singular circulatory system and cardiac system to the dual in post initial-regeneration gallifreyan physiology, and in part allows for the infusion of artron energy across multidimensional space to both explain regeneration and provide the symbolic Buddhist themes that have underpinned the show for forty years.
In terms of canon in long running SF , Trek has an excellent one, and it should not be discarded.
Stupid tribbles causing all these stupid troubles.
Don't we have a Doctor Who subforum? Did I go to the wrong place?
Who was being used as an example of something working with is continuity and canon containing or reconciling differing ideas that are key to the works identity. Like..starfleet...military or not? Who has a reputation for retconning itself heavily to deal with contradictions...aka...ignoring canon...but it does something very different to that. Trek as a fictional history, has to take a different approach, which is at the root of the discussion really....if Starfleet isn't a military how do the bits where it seems to be make sense within the the narrative of Star Trek, and vice versa.
That was an awful lot of Who factoids to be used for illustrative purposes.
All relevant to the points we are discussing in terms of Trek, in a slightly abstract way, I promise. But mostly it was a side discussion that had....evolved.
Considering how noobish I am with the Doctor Who novels, I almost understood that.
I believe it was given as an example of how canon can work and still be changed to still work with the older versions of the canon. Something Star Trek sort of does from time to time (See Star Trek: Enterprise).
The mentions of the Federation and money to me have always suggested that the Federation (or at the very least Earth's) economy changed sometime after the Five Year Mission, or had changed prior to it, but the creep of the credit lingered for several years before fading into the dark corners of the Federation. By the movie era it was more or less gone, and by the 24th century it was a thing long gone, as some officers that didn't get out on the fringes of society often had little concept of money or even barter.
As for the topic of military, because we are given the concept that Starfleet is not a military as a fact, more than once across several centuries, we the audience are meant to accept that as a fact. There is the provision that during extreme crisis that Starfleet might be basically drafted into being the military for the Federation, which would stand to reason during the prolonged periods of the conflict with the Klingons and probably the Dominion War, but outside of those times, Starfleet is not a military by its own definition.
It would make some sense of the times when Kirk was a soldier and then he wasn't a soldier. The before time being before the Organian Peace Treaty was enacted. After that time Starfleet got itself undrafted and returned to its non-military self. Until the Organians left and the Maroon uniforms came with the Klingons becoming aggressive again. This could also be why Admiral Kirk retired the first time, due to Starfleet being drafted again. But changed his mind later, but seemed perpetually depressed. The loss of his son by a Klingon blade didn't help matters at all. This lasts until after Praxis explodes and the hostiles end due to the Klingons not being able to afford it. Starfleet gets undrafted again after over a decade (with some harsh supporters of the notion that Starfleet should crush the Klingons to make sure they never try something against the Federation again), and eventually get back to their old Deep Space Exploration business.
The Excelsiors get refit for exploration more extensive exploration duties, the Constellations, underpowered as they are, start long term explorer missions. The Ambassador-class gets constructed to better handle longer than five year missions. The Cardassians show up, and a low key war begins, but it never seems like it or the other wars are really all that major, being very local affairs. Starfleet does not get drafted again, but sometimes enables defense missions near the Cardassian border.
The Klingons recover after 50 years and start to make waves, but before things heat up again, the Romulans start attacking Klingon outposts. USS Enterpise is lost defending one such outpost and secures the Klingons as allies of the Federation due to their honorable sacrifice and courage in battle (worthy of a Klingon I suppose)....that it was an Enterprise, a ships with a long history with the Klingons, makes it even better for the Federation. The peace holds and decades more pass with Starfleet being Starfleet.
Only the Borg appearing shakes Starfleet to promote defensive and tactical improvements in the face of a terrifying threat. The Dominion comes and the Federation eventually settles that war may be the only way they can remain free, and the peace is slowly choking the Federation and its usually methods of diplomacy, science, and engineering are failing to counter the Dominion....All they had left was war or serving the Dominion. Starfleet choice war as their only hope.
I believe it was given as an example of how canon can work and still be changed to still work with the older versions of the canon. Something Star Trek sort of does from time to time (See Star Trek: Enterprise).
The mentions of the Federation and money to me have always suggested that the Federation (or at the very least Earth's) economy changed sometime after the Five Year Mission, or had changed prior to it, but the creep of the credit lingered for several years before fading into the dark corners of the Federation. By the movie era it was more or less gone, and by the 24th century it was a thing long gone, as some officers that didn't get out on the fringes of society often had little concept of money or even barter.
As for the topic of military, because we are given the concept that Starfleet is not a military as a fact, more than once across several centuries, we the audience are meant to accept that as a fact. There is the provision that during extreme crisis that Starfleet might be basically drafted into being the military for the Federation, which would stand to reason during the prolonged periods of the conflict with the Klingons and probably the Dominion War, but outside of those times, Starfleet is not a military by its own definition.
It would make some sense of the times when Kirk was a soldier and then he wasn't a soldier. The before time being before the Organian Peace Treaty was enacted. After that time Starfleet got itself undrafted and returned to its non-military self. Until the Organians left and the Maroon uniforms came with the Klingons becoming aggressive again. This could also be why Admiral Kirk retired the first time, due to Starfleet being drafted again. But changed his mind later, but seemed perpetually depressed. The loss of his son by a Klingon blade didn't help matters at all. This lasts until after Praxis explodes and the hostiles end due to the Klingons not being able to afford it. Starfleet gets undrafted again after over a decade (with some harsh supporters of the notion that Starfleet should crush the Klingons to make sure they never try something against the Federation again), and eventually get back to their old Deep Space Exploration business.
The Excelsiors get refit for exploration more extensive exploration duties, the Constellations, underpowered as they are, start long term explorer missions. The Ambassador-class gets constructed to better handle longer than five year missions. The Cardassians show up, and a low key war begins, but it never seems like it or the other wars are really all that major, being very local affairs. Starfleet does not get drafted again, but sometimes enables defense missions near the Cardassian border.
The Klingons recover after 50 years and start to make waves, but before things heat up again, the Romulans start attacking Klingon outposts. USS Enterpise is lost defending one such outpost and secures the Klingons as allies of the Federation due to their honorable sacrifice and courage in battle (worthy of a Klingon I suppose)....that it was an Enterprise, a ships with a long history with the Klingons, makes it even better for the Federation. The peace holds and decades more pass with Starfleet being Starfleet.
Only the Borg appearing shakes Starfleet to promote defensive and tactical improvements in the face of a terrifying threat. The Dominion comes and the Federation eventually settles that war may be the only way they can remain free, and the peace is slowly choking the Federation and its usually methods of diplomacy, science, and engineering are failing to counter the Dominion....All they had left was war or serving the Dominion. Starfleet choice war as their only hope.
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