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Star Wars Books Thread

If anyone ever wonders when I gave up on the Legends EU it was the Vong. So, I can identify with several points, but the primary one is the fact that it gives Palpatine a sort of legitimacy to his New Order. Which, I'll grant, is an interesting twist and has several facets that could be used to good effect, but it continues the theme that Palptine was not as evil as presented in the OT and moves toward a "doing bad for the right reason piece."

All in all, I agree.
 
Having Palaptine being a misunderstood benevolent dictator is an unbelievably bad idea.
Not only is such an explanation redundant, it undermines the very foundation of his character.
The Sith are fundamentally selfish. They care only for themselves. The rest of the galaxy could burn so long as they achieve their ambitions.
 
I don't think it was trying to portray him as Benevolent, he was trying to protect himself.


One of the base ideas about the Vong is that they're null in the force right? That goes against what George Lucas saw as the force. That is why Dave Filoni is against brining in the Ysalamir in Rebels.

Although he also wanted to bring the Vong into Clone Wars, so I'd would have assumed they would have ignored the cut off from the force part of the species.
 
I never thought the Vong were bad, per say, but I think that keeping them out of canon is a good call; I'm not sure they add that much to the franchise or were that memorable. (I got the idea that the Vong were supposed to be to the Star Wars novels what the Borg were to Star Trek or the Daleks were to Doctor Who, but something got lost along the way.)
 
The problem with the Vong is that they're indicative of a fundamental misunderstanding most of the EU authors and publishers laboured under almost right from the get-go. That being the notion that Star Wars is science fiction.
Star Wars is space fantasy, so many of the standard sci-fi tropes aren't entirely compatible, at least not without some adjustments. Star Wars is an entirely different animal than the likes of Star Trek.

First-off: yes I know: space orks = space fantasy. At least in theory. In practice that was purely superficial and not at all how they were used. They were just straight-up alien invaders with a very thin veneer covering the real word religious allegory. They were closer to torture-porn obsessed Klingons than anything.
Secondly: the idea of a horde of rampaging aliens is absolutely doable in Star Wars, but the execution was all wrong and the resolution and aftermath was pathetically weak.

I don't think it was trying to portray him as Benevolent, he was trying to protect himself.
Intended or no, that was the logical implication. Whether or not they thought through the implications, it fundamentally re-contextualises *everything* he ever did because it's altering his base motivations. For example: Death Stars are suddenly not tools of oppression and dominance but sentinels to protect the peoples of the galaxy from extra-galactic marauders. Which in turn means the heroes have been actively hurting the galaxy's defences and undermining it's unity in a misguided attempt at imposing freedom.
It presupposes that an authoritarian rule is justified in any excess provided it's purported that it's the only thing that can protect the people from the barbarians at the gate. That's very dangerous ethical ground indeed.

Also, there are much easier ways to deal with that situation in a selfish way. I mean the galaxy is a *huge* place. Running and hiding somewhere in the deep core is perfectly viable. Also, as the article points out, if Palaptine really had known about them and did what he did specifically to counter them then his propaganda machine would be shouting it from every rooftop. Totalitarian regimes don't just love a perpetual external enemy, they *need* them to stay in power over the long run. The Vong are the perfect bogeyman with which to terrorise the citizens of the Empire to give up all their personal freedoms and rights in exchange for protection from extreme-bondage vampires.

In short: the concept just doesn't hold water.
 
I just finished reading the 3 OT novelizations. I read them MANY years ago and I hadn't really planned on it but my brother got me this nice Darth Vader black leather bound collection of the novels from Barnes And Noble and I decided to read them again just because. Not really great reading, it's one thing to read a novel that a movie was based on but film novelizations are usually pointless. The only points of interest in the Star Wars novelizations are usually noticing the things they got wrong or didn't understand, as the writers hadn't seen the movie and only read a script and seen some pictures. And then there are the things that didn't make the films, like deleted scenes or some things which may have changed during production.

Anyway I picked up a couple of books the other day I'm going to get started on, one is not Star Wars (Stephen King's "The Running Man") and the other is "Tarkin", which I've been meaning to read since it came out but never got around to. Then of course when "Thrawn" comes out I'll snatch one up quickly.
 
I just finished reading the 3 OT novelizations. I read them MANY years ago and I hadn't really planned on it but my brother got me this nice Darth Vader black leather bound collection of the novels from Barnes And Noble and I decided to read them again just because. Not really great reading, it's one thing to read a novel that a movie was based on but film novelizations are usually pointless. The only points of interest in the Star Wars novelizations are usually noticing the things they got wrong or didn't understand, as the writers hadn't seen the movie and only read a script and seen some pictures. And then there are the things that didn't make the films, like deleted scenes or some things which may have changed during production.

Yeah, the original trilogy novelizations were the worse. The prequels got better.

Novelizations for movies from Force Awakens on are canon, so they are worth reading for that. Personally, the I'd say the Rogue One novelization is very much worth reading. It adds a lot of insight to the movie and reads like a good original Star Wars novel instead of a novelization.[/QUOTE]
 
Huh, I grew up reading the novels, and found the ESB one, in particular, to be quite an enjoyable read, even more so that the film, for the most part. The ANH novel was a little less enjoyable, and ROTJ was just ok. I loved the PT novels, far more than the films themselves in terms of characterization, but the ESB novel still holds a special place for me.
 
I've been going through Battlefront: Twilight Company, and it is really dull. Boring original characters, boring story and boring flashbacks about the main character's backstory that just feel like a waste of time. I don't know if I'm going to get through this one.
 
Having Palaptine being a misunderstood benevolent dictator is an unbelievably bad idea.
Not only is such an explanation redundant, it undermines the very foundation of his character.
The Sith are fundamentally selfish. They care only for themselves. The rest of the galaxy could burn so long as they achieve their ambitions.

Stalin wasn't a good dictator--he just turned out to be necessary.
As long as the Vong aren't space orks--but something perhaps more wraith-like--I think it could work.

Palpatine as he is now is very two dimensional. A cackling farce. Ugh

Him being the chosen one would not only be shades of Three Versions of Judas--but I can see him as a version of Borges Iago-like character: Otto Dietrich zur Linde

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsches_Requiem_(short_story)

Having Palaptine being a misunderstood benevolent dictator is an unbelievably bad idea.

Exactly.

This would be a secret truth of such magnitude that it must be hidden from the world.


Rather than cheapening the Star Wars universe--this layer of understanding enriches it.

I can see The Bendu having this knowledge--understanding just why both sides of the force are needed. Kirk found that out the hard way when he was split into two halves.

It took the whole of the Star Wars universe to come to the same conclusion that Trek did in a single episode.
 
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No, this is all novelizations according to Pablo.
He also said that if it contradicts the final edit of the movie: ignore it. So any additional material in the novelisations--particularly deleted scenes--are probably best taken with a grain of salt.
 
The Vong aren't space orks and there not a god-forsaken hive mind.

The NJO was fucking better than the OT. Anyone who disagrees either has an axe to grind, is stupid, evil or all three.
 
What the holy fuckity fuck?

I actually think the idea of the Vong is pretty interesting, and found them intriguing in the first four NJO novels, which is all I read years ago. As much as I enjoyed those books, I do think the NJO series was kind of a strange direction to take the franchise. I tend to seperate them off from the movies as their own alternate take on the Star Wars universe. I would definitely prefer it if the new canon books stuck to something closer to the movies.
While I enjoyed them, they are in no way shape or form better than the OT or even the prequels.
I do agree that the reveal that Palpatine knew about them and everything he did was to prepare for them was a strange idea. In general I don't think there's anything wrong with adding shades of grey to a villain, but I think doing for a character like Palpatine was a bad idea. He was meant to be the ultimate evil in the galaxy, and I really don't think he needed anymore motivation that just wanting power.
In general SW or at least the conflict between the Jedi and Sith is a good vs evil story, and I really think it's a mistake to try to add to much grey to the black and white.
 
What the holy fuckity fuck?

I'm going to like this post just for that!

As for the Vong and the NJO, I did like it and them for the most part, I haven't read any of them, bar the yearly event novels in nearly ten years though and for whatever reason, I've not gotten beyond the first of the LOTJ novels.

On a side note, I picked up the new editions (well covers anyway) of the Thrawn trilogy and it's the first time I've read them since my late teens and they hold up very well.
 
What the holy fuckity fuck?

I actually think the idea of the Vong is pretty interesting, and found them intriguing in the first four NJO novels, which is all I read years ago. As much as I enjoyed those books, I do think the NJO series was kind of a strange direction to take the franchise. I tend to seperate them off from the movies as their own alternate take on the Star Wars universe. I would definitely prefer it if the new canon books stuck to something closer to the movies.
While I enjoyed them, they are in no way shape or form better than the OT or even the prequels.
I do agree that the reveal that Palpatine knew about them and everything he did was to prepare for them was a strange idea. In general I don't think there's anything wrong with adding shades of grey to a villain, but I think doing for a character like Palpatine was a bad idea. He was meant to be the ultimate evil in the galaxy, and I really don't think he needed anymore motivation that just wanting power.
In general SW or at least the conflict between the Jedi and Sith is a good vs evil story, and I really think it's a mistake to try to add to much grey to the black and white.
Palpatine saw the Vong as just another threat he wanted to live forever. Seriously if Hitler knew an alien invasion was coming and tried to prepare does that make him any less evil?
 
The Vong aren't space orks and there not a god-forsaken hive mind.

True no hive mind, but I'm sure I liked that much.

The NJO was fucking better than the OT. Anyone who disagrees either has an axe to grind, is stupid, evil or all three.

I don't hold NJO is that high of esteem, since for me, it was the beginning of the end of the novel series for me; I really didn't like the stuff that came after it. I also found the books harder to get though. The movies were better, in my opinion, although I've always liked the movies more than the books.
 
The Vong aren't space orks and there not a god-forsaken hive mind.

The NJO was fucking better than the OT. Anyone who disagrees either has an axe to grind, is stupid, evil or all three.
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Honestly, I can at least enjoy the OT because it feels like a self-contained story rather than constantly increasing the overpowered reason to keep the story going.
 
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