Old-fashioned black powder is still occasionally used today, but how many people know how to make the stuff?
Last edited:
50th Anniversary Rewatch Thread
- Thread starter dahj
- Start date
I was thinking just yesterday how great and interesting it is that, at least twice, in Devil in the Dark and Arena, Kirk started out as the tough guy, keeping everybody practical, shooting down humanitarian ideas... with Spock trying to go the more peaceful route... only for the two of them to reverse roles by the end. Both of them are more complicated than those roles they're playing. They're BOTH very peace-minded people who are very aware that at some points, you have to take on a very different role, because of harsh reality.
In DitD, the moment they find out some real information on the Horta, which gets her motives across, Kirk unhesitatingly becomes peacemaker and determined advocate for the Horta. I love how Kirk throws himself into this.
In fact, the role reversal happens as soon as Kirk finds out the Horta isn't attacking. Spock, concerned for Kirk, gets tough and wants him to take no chances and shoot.
None of this violates character at ALL. It's character development. They both are obligated to get aggressive to save lives. They hate it but know the necessity.
------------------------
Command mode, I think, is a role you have to get into, as if you're a Method actor. You have to switch into it psychologically. While in that mode, Kirk isn't really going to be entertaining suggestions not to destroy the Gorn ship, if that will prevent a war. He's testy with Spock because in command mode, you have to steel yourself for it, and stay in that mode, or you won't get the tough stuff accomplished, because Kirk really IS a good guy. He has to switch off the good guy inside him, temporarily.
In DitD, the moment they find out some real information on the Horta, which gets her motives across, Kirk unhesitatingly becomes peacemaker and determined advocate for the Horta. I love how Kirk throws himself into this.
In fact, the role reversal happens as soon as Kirk finds out the Horta isn't attacking. Spock, concerned for Kirk, gets tough and wants him to take no chances and shoot.
None of this violates character at ALL. It's character development. They both are obligated to get aggressive to save lives. They hate it but know the necessity.
------------------------
Command mode, I think, is a role you have to get into, as if you're a Method actor. You have to switch into it psychologically. While in that mode, Kirk isn't really going to be entertaining suggestions not to destroy the Gorn ship, if that will prevent a war. He's testy with Spock because in command mode, you have to steel yourself for it, and stay in that mode, or you won't get the tough stuff accomplished, because Kirk really IS a good guy. He has to switch off the good guy inside him, temporarily.
One also has to bear in mind that this was more than a simple misunderstanding, however much the episode tried to hit us over the head with the "we might be in the wrong" hammer. The Gorn didn't just attack the outpost...they orchestrated a very deliberate trap for the Enterprise...one that involved sending fake messages that were convincing enough to fool the Enterprise crew. Clearly this was premeditated, and the Gorn went into it with plenty of knowledge about who they were attacking.
_______
50 years ago this week:
New on the U.S. charts:
"So You Want to Be a Rock 'n' Roll Star," The Byrds
(#29 US)
"I've Been Lonely Too Long," The Young Rascals
(#16 US; #33 R&B)
"For What It's Worth," Buffalo Springfield
(#7 US; #63 on Rolling Stone's 500 Greatest Songs of All Time)
"Love Is Here and Now You're Gone," The Supremes
(#1 US the week of Mar. 11; #1 R&B; #17 UK)
And airing Thursday night:
Star Trek
"Tomorrow Is Yesterday"
Stardate 3113.2
_______
_______
50 years ago this week:
(They still had newsreels in the late '60s?)
New on the U.S. charts:
"So You Want to Be a Rock 'n' Roll Star," The Byrds
(#29 US)
"I've Been Lonely Too Long," The Young Rascals
(#16 US; #33 R&B)
"For What It's Worth," Buffalo Springfield
(#7 US; #63 on Rolling Stone's 500 Greatest Songs of All Time)
"Love Is Here and Now You're Gone," The Supremes
(#1 US the week of Mar. 11; #1 R&B; #17 UK)
And airing Thursday night:
Star Trek
"Tomorrow Is Yesterday"
Stardate 3113.2
_______
Last edited:
McCoy, of course, says "We might have been in the wrong", but it was a quick simple impulsive remark. It sounds like we are meant to let the Gorn off the hook, but they can't have expected us to, given what they showed us at the beginning. I think McCoy's remark only goes this far: "Maybe they had more right to be there than we did, though the attack itself was unforgiveable."
Exactly, when Spock argued for the pursuit and destruction of the Romulan ship in Balance he argued it form knowledge of Romulans and their ways. His advice to attack was meant to prevent war, as previous encounters with Romulans showed they respect strength and if weakness is shown they wouldn't hesitate to go to war.
In the case of Gorn, they had no such point of reference.
While the Gorn obviously knew some things, it's hard to tell how much, they could have just randomly run into people on Cestus III, and then found out from the computers there that the Enterprise, perhaps a warship intended to attack their territory is in the area. From their point, that spelled Invasion! of their territory, and their reaction to immediately destroy the threat is basically the same as Kirk's initial reaction.
They did set a trap for the Enterprise to see how powerful they are, but the Gorn could easily have had the opposite reaction to a display of power than the Romulans would.
Maybe if they perceived the Federation as weak they would have retreated, not taking them as a threat. But if Kirk destroyed the Gorn ship, they would see them as a threat which would lead to an all out war.
The Gorn knew enough about the humans on Cestus III to successfully impersonate them...and they had the means to communicate at any time, but only used it to lure more humans there to kill.
"Could it be true? Was Cestus III an invasion on their space?"
"It may well be possible, Doctor. We know very little about that section of the galaxy."
"Then we could be in the wrong."
"Perhaps. That is something best decided by diplomats."
"The Gorns simply might have been trying to protect themselves."
"We get it, Doctor, put the hammer down."
I was referring generally to the overall message of Spock's peacenicking and McCoy and Kirk's comments on the matter, but the exchange with McCoy went something like:
"Could it be true? Was Cestus III an invasion on their space?"
"It may well be possible, Doctor. We know very little about that section of the galaxy."
"Then we could be in the wrong."
"Perhaps. That is something best decided by diplomats."
"The Gorns simply might have been trying to protect themselves."
"We get it, Doctor, put the hammer down."
Well, the MythBusters tried it a few years back...
(EDIT: Link removed by me, see post 492 for a better video)
Last edited:
Shows only the first half, then a completely unrelated stunt and then five minutes of commercials. Never saw if their black powder could fire anything.
It is impressive how the Gorn replicated the human voice to trick the Enterprise crew into beaming down onto the planet. I also found the way the crewmen was killed by the Gorn weapon to be fascinating. it reminded me of how the invaders from the television show The Invaders would disintegrate after David Vincent would kill them. Good episode. Star Trek always did these episode really well. The debate between Kirk and Spock about what to do with the Gorn is well done. This is going on at the same time as the Vietnam War is raging. Heavy stuff.
Universal finally closed down its newsreel division at the end of 1967, long after movie newsreels had been superseded by TV news programs. Their newsreel guys must have had a strong tradition -- or a strong union.
Well they certainly aren't the nicest of lizard people one could meet, but the point of the episode is that they overreacted, and that "we" should be better than that.
Heck, in the 24th century Klingons might have done the same thing, and they're allies of the Federation...
Spock did it a few episodes back in The Menagerie as well, maybe they downloaded the same app?
That's the one! Thanks! Bamboo black powder cannon 0, Gorn 2. Another childhood hero story shot to hell.
"Tomorrow is Yesterday", Episode 19, January 26th
Tonight's Episode: Who said there's no continuity on this show? Remember that time everybody got drunk and accidentally invented time travel? That's sure gonna come in handy tonight as Enterprise travels back in time to the glorious near future of 1969!
Tonight's Episode: Who said there's no continuity on this show? Remember that time everybody got drunk and accidentally invented time travel? That's sure gonna come in handy tonight as Enterprise travels back in time to the glorious near future of 1969!
It starts with...the most low-budget control room ever...two guys in an office, one of them monitoring the radar, the other one sitting at a desk right behind him giving orders. Not exactly a Ken Adam set there. That airbase must be suffering from budget shortage, given that Christopher doesn't have a wingman, either.
Top it off with the embarrassingly fake-looking Earth in the original effects...well, that wasn't unusual at the time, even this close to getting to the moon. And speaking of...the famous Wednesday moonshot prediction. The episode didn't specify the year, but it becomes 1969 by historical coincidence.
Full warp in reverse...doesn't sound like a slingshot effect, though they identify it as such later in the episode. The former description...why would the space/time continuum care if you flew your ship backwards?
We learn that deflectors serve as a cloak against radar. And correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that this is the first time we see a proper demonstration of Kirk Fu. (He should gave gone for the flying butt slam.)
Christopher in a Starfleet Lt.'s uniform is an authentic military touch, as a naval lieutenant is the same grade as an Air Force captain. OTOH, would they identify the airbase by number on every door sign?
The show gains a little verisimilitude with the passage of time...the mid-20th century computers, film equipment, etc. look about as archaic today as they would have to the Enterprise crew.
Kirk closing his eyes as the phaser is thrown got a nice laugh out of me...good comic touch on Shatner's part.
Note another 00:07 reading on the chronometer.
I won't attempt to get into the wonky time travel mechanics in the climax...that way lies madness.
Top it off with the embarrassingly fake-looking Earth in the original effects...well, that wasn't unusual at the time, even this close to getting to the moon. And speaking of...the famous Wednesday moonshot prediction. The episode didn't specify the year, but it becomes 1969 by historical coincidence.
Full warp in reverse...doesn't sound like a slingshot effect, though they identify it as such later in the episode. The former description...why would the space/time continuum care if you flew your ship backwards?
We learn that deflectors serve as a cloak against radar. And correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that this is the first time we see a proper demonstration of Kirk Fu. (He should gave gone for the flying butt slam.)
Christopher in a Starfleet Lt.'s uniform is an authentic military touch, as a naval lieutenant is the same grade as an Air Force captain. OTOH, would they identify the airbase by number on every door sign?
The show gains a little verisimilitude with the passage of time...the mid-20th century computers, film equipment, etc. look about as archaic today as they would have to the Enterprise crew.
Kirk closing his eyes as the phaser is thrown got a nice laugh out of me...good comic touch on Shatner's part.
Note another 00:07 reading on the chronometer.
I won't attempt to get into the wonky time travel mechanics in the climax...that way lies madness.
My write-up for "Tomorrow is Yesterday" in which I don't mind so much the mechanics of the path back to the 23rd century (dare I even say Back to the Future?, no?)
Next week, could it be the Trial of the 23rd Century?
Next week, could it be the Trial of the 23rd Century?
"We've gotta go back, Scotty!"
"Back where, Spock?"
"Back, to the future!"
Trek does time travel for the first time, and other than explaining how it actually works it's a solid outing and a fun episode.
The phenomenon that flings them back in time is described as a black star, because the term black hole hadn't been invented yet. On a somewhat related note I recently watched a movie that has a multinational crew on spaceship encounter a black star(no time travel though, it has a different effect). It's a 1963 Czechoslovakian film called Ikarie XB-1, and it's definitely worth a watch if you're into old sci-fi.
I can never take seriously the implication that contemporary humans would instantly recognize Spock as an alien from another world. Vulcans look too much like humans, I doubt anyone would ever even ask him out of curtesy, but if someone did he could always explain his ears away as a natural defect, an accident or just taking his Lord of the Rings fandom a bit too seriously.
Even though Kirk has a line implying women on starships are a normal thing, we're also back to "funny" sexism this episode... a computer built on a planet dominated by females, perish the thought! Spock even refuses to use it and does time warp calculations in his head
They apparently use a sonic screwdriver to unlock the computer room, but Kirk gets captured. He sucks at fibbing, which is funny, because he can talk a computer into killing itself, but somehow can't pretend he's from the IT department and confuse a human security guard with his computer lingo?
As Kirk is captured, Spock's being in command streak continues.
"Back where, Spock?"
"Back, to the future!"
Trek does time travel for the first time, and other than explaining how it actually works it's a solid outing and a fun episode.
The phenomenon that flings them back in time is described as a black star, because the term black hole hadn't been invented yet. On a somewhat related note I recently watched a movie that has a multinational crew on spaceship encounter a black star(no time travel though, it has a different effect). It's a 1963 Czechoslovakian film called Ikarie XB-1, and it's definitely worth a watch if you're into old sci-fi.
I can never take seriously the implication that contemporary humans would instantly recognize Spock as an alien from another world. Vulcans look too much like humans, I doubt anyone would ever even ask him out of curtesy, but if someone did he could always explain his ears away as a natural defect, an accident or just taking his Lord of the Rings fandom a bit too seriously.
Even though Kirk has a line implying women on starships are a normal thing, we're also back to "funny" sexism this episode... a computer built on a planet dominated by females, perish the thought! Spock even refuses to use it and does time warp calculations in his head
They apparently use a sonic screwdriver to unlock the computer room, but Kirk gets captured. He sucks at fibbing, which is funny, because he can talk a computer into killing itself, but somehow can't pretend he's from the IT department and confuse a human security guard with his computer lingo?
As Kirk is captured, Spock's being in command streak continues.
50 years ago this week:
New on the U.S. charts:
"California Nights," Lesley Gore
(#16 US; Clip from Batman, "That Darn Catwoman," which aired Jan. 19, 1967)
"Sock It to Me, Baby!," Mitch Ryder & The Detroit Wheels
(#6 US)
"Baby I Need Your Lovin'," Johnny Rivers
(#3 US)
I'm sorry, I like some of his stuff, but I just can't get behind that whitebread cover of a Motown classic. I am, however, more than happy to use it as an excuse to dig a bit further back for the original:
"Baby I Need Your Loving," Four Tops
(Charted Aug. 15, 1964; #11 US; #4 R&B; #390 on Rolling Stone's 500 Greatest Songs of All Time)
And airing Thursday night:
Star Trek
"Court Martial"
Stardate 2947.3
New on the U.S. charts:
"California Nights," Lesley Gore
(#16 US; Clip from Batman, "That Darn Catwoman," which aired Jan. 19, 1967)
"Sock It to Me, Baby!," Mitch Ryder & The Detroit Wheels
(#6 US)
"Baby I Need Your Lovin'," Johnny Rivers
(#3 US)
I'm sorry, I like some of his stuff, but I just can't get behind that whitebread cover of a Motown classic. I am, however, more than happy to use it as an excuse to dig a bit further back for the original:
"Baby I Need Your Loving," Four Tops
(Charted Aug. 15, 1964; #11 US; #4 R&B; #390 on Rolling Stone's 500 Greatest Songs of All Time)
And airing Thursday night:
Star Trek
"Court Martial"
Stardate 2947.3
_______MeTV said:
Last edited:
Similar threads
