There is roughly a 9 year gap between the events of TMP and WOK. What were the crew up to in the decade between the two films? Why did Kirk leave his command again after having lobbied hard to get it back during TMP?
What happens between TMP and WOK?
- Thread starter Commander Kielbasa
- Start date
Fool me one, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
What?
I like to think there was another 5-year mission, many adventures of which were told in many 80's Trek novels. Then everyone moved on, Enterprise becomes a training ship etc.
What 80s trek novels covering this period would you recommend?
My Enemy, My Ally, Spock's World, The Romulan Way, The Kobayashi Maru, Pawns and Symbols and probably loads more I can't remember off the top of my head.
KiIrk gave up the Enterprise twice. Second time is totally on him.
Which is why he so fervently tells Picard in Generations not to ever let them take him off the bridge of that ship. He learned that lesson the hard way.
An intense design competition to make Starfleet Uniforms that didn't suck.
So, there was no winner?
lol, well for me, I actually really dig the red uniforms between 2 and 6, the only other uniform I ever liked was DS9/TNG movie grey shoulder.
But as much as I love Star Trek, the uniforms just kill me besides the aforementioned.
I'll take the Enterprise jumpsuits and the TOS pullovers over those any day.
Outside of the beige outfits I for one loved the TMP uniforms the best. They looked futuristic and struck me as a more mature version of the TOS uniforms. The outfits from II-IV make the crew look like lobsters, or some futuristic version of the British Redcoats.
And to make it quicker to return to duty in an emergency, they double as pajamas.
See this thread also... http://www.trekbbs.com/threads/uniforms-are-anything-but.282579/page-3
Maybe he commanded on a different bridge...
See this thread also... http://www.trekbbs.com/threads/uniforms-are-anything-but.282579/page-3
Maybe he commanded on a different bridge...
Among at least the older novels, "Deep Domain" I think explains why Kirk gave up command again and the ship became a training ship, with Checov being transferred to the Reliant. It deals a bit with a "Save the whales" plot ala Star Trek IV (although this time it's alien whales), and was written by one of the TOS comic writers.
This is just my own personal take on what happened between STTMP and STTWOK. It's not based on filmed material, books, or comics. If there happens to be some evidence found in those, it's a happy coincidence.
Kirk's life was commanding the Enterprise but he was so successful in doing that that he foolishly accepted promotion to admiral at the end of the 5-year mission. Being the bold and adventurous type, he consider the position as a new challenge for him. Unfortunately, he later realized that he was a hands-on type of guy who would rather be out in the action rather than behind a desk. He became obsessed with regaining what he had lost by the time of STTMP. He obviously wouldn't give it up again easily at the end of the movie. I believe he commanded another (5-year?) mission.
Spock found the value of his human half in STTMP. He was in a position of discovering new aspects of his life and was redefining who he is. He was at home on neither Vulcan or earth so he decides to stay aboard the Enterprise with Kirk and crew who had been the best "family" he has ever known. The logic vs. emotion sparring that he had with McCoy would take on a new meaning as Spock becomes more willing to explore such ideas rather than reject them outright. But just because Spock has accepted his emotional side doesn't mean that he would accept everything else--like spiritually and religion. Those could become new topics for debate with the good doctor. I know it has been said that McCoy is a humanist but he always struck me as more spiritual than others believe him to be.
Just as Kirk, Spock and McCoy can be used to represent ambition/will, logic and emotion, an article from one of the "Best of Trek" books suggested once that Chekov, Sulu and Uhura represent hope, faith and love. As Spock explores his newfound humanity, he could find guidance and ideas from these previously secondary characters and strengthen his friendships with them. This would help to explain when everybody decides to risk all for Spock when they go back to Genesis for him in the 3rd movie. They not only have loyalty towards Kirk, but have developed stronger feelings of friendship with the more emotionally accessible Spock.
Towards the end of the novel "Vulcan!" Spock asked Dr. Tremain to help him develop his imagination--something he didn't feel he had a use for. Although, I despised Dr. Tremain and the novel overall, this point would be a gem of an idea for a story arc after STTMP for Spock. I also see Chapel as a symbol for hope, and maybe she could help fill that responsibility in teaching Spock about utilizing his imagination. As she becomes more familiar with the inner workings of Spock, she would overcome her infatuation with obtaining the "unobtainable man ," and prefer the value of his friendship instead of constantly hoping against hope and pursuing him as a suitor. For those who feel TOS has tapped out and exhausted new ideas for these characters to go through in order to advance and grow beyond the cliché-riddled cardboard characters in modern literature, they definitely need to exercise their imaginations a little more. Maybe someday Paramount/CBS, Pocket Books and others will lift the restrictions on the main characters that keep them forever static and somewhat boring. I also think it would have been interesting to resurrect the Xon character that was abandoned in the Phase Two series of the 1970's and but him aboard the Enterprise in some capacity as a secondary character. He could be used as a mirror when he's around Spock and allow us to visually see how much Spock is changing while he explores his new acceptance of his emotions.
At the end of this second mission, Starfleet tries once again to get Kirk back into the Admiralty where they can keep their role model safe. They regulate the Enterprise to training duty status. Kirk is furious about Starfleet finding another way to take his ship away from him. Being captain of a cadet vessel is not being a "starship captain." Kirk doesn't see training cadets as being out there and making decisions which make a difference. So, he quits. Kirk was always a man of action that beamed down in landing parties during TOS and be in the thick of things making the decisions. Outside of Kirk's seeking advice from Spock and McCoy, he still hasn't learned (or see the value of) making a difference by training the next generation. Commanding people and training people are two different things in his eyes. Once again, Kirk discovers the emptiness of his life without the Enterprise and eventually returns and accepts the rank of Admiral (and the training duties involved) shortly before STTWOK..
Kirk's life was commanding the Enterprise but he was so successful in doing that that he foolishly accepted promotion to admiral at the end of the 5-year mission. Being the bold and adventurous type, he consider the position as a new challenge for him. Unfortunately, he later realized that he was a hands-on type of guy who would rather be out in the action rather than behind a desk. He became obsessed with regaining what he had lost by the time of STTMP. He obviously wouldn't give it up again easily at the end of the movie. I believe he commanded another (5-year?) mission.
Spock found the value of his human half in STTMP. He was in a position of discovering new aspects of his life and was redefining who he is. He was at home on neither Vulcan or earth so he decides to stay aboard the Enterprise with Kirk and crew who had been the best "family" he has ever known. The logic vs. emotion sparring that he had with McCoy would take on a new meaning as Spock becomes more willing to explore such ideas rather than reject them outright. But just because Spock has accepted his emotional side doesn't mean that he would accept everything else--like spiritually and religion. Those could become new topics for debate with the good doctor. I know it has been said that McCoy is a humanist but he always struck me as more spiritual than others believe him to be.
Just as Kirk, Spock and McCoy can be used to represent ambition/will, logic and emotion, an article from one of the "Best of Trek" books suggested once that Chekov, Sulu and Uhura represent hope, faith and love. As Spock explores his newfound humanity, he could find guidance and ideas from these previously secondary characters and strengthen his friendships with them. This would help to explain when everybody decides to risk all for Spock when they go back to Genesis for him in the 3rd movie. They not only have loyalty towards Kirk, but have developed stronger feelings of friendship with the more emotionally accessible Spock.
Towards the end of the novel "Vulcan!" Spock asked Dr. Tremain to help him develop his imagination--something he didn't feel he had a use for. Although, I despised Dr. Tremain and the novel overall, this point would be a gem of an idea for a story arc after STTMP for Spock. I also see Chapel as a symbol for hope, and maybe she could help fill that responsibility in teaching Spock about utilizing his imagination. As she becomes more familiar with the inner workings of Spock, she would overcome her infatuation with obtaining the "unobtainable man ," and prefer the value of his friendship instead of constantly hoping against hope and pursuing him as a suitor. For those who feel TOS has tapped out and exhausted new ideas for these characters to go through in order to advance and grow beyond the cliché-riddled cardboard characters in modern literature, they definitely need to exercise their imaginations a little more. Maybe someday Paramount/CBS, Pocket Books and others will lift the restrictions on the main characters that keep them forever static and somewhat boring. I also think it would have been interesting to resurrect the Xon character that was abandoned in the Phase Two series of the 1970's and but him aboard the Enterprise in some capacity as a secondary character. He could be used as a mirror when he's around Spock and allow us to visually see how much Spock is changing while he explores his new acceptance of his emotions.
At the end of this second mission, Starfleet tries once again to get Kirk back into the Admiralty where they can keep their role model safe. They regulate the Enterprise to training duty status. Kirk is furious about Starfleet finding another way to take his ship away from him. Being captain of a cadet vessel is not being a "starship captain." Kirk doesn't see training cadets as being out there and making decisions which make a difference. So, he quits. Kirk was always a man of action that beamed down in landing parties during TOS and be in the thick of things making the decisions. Outside of Kirk's seeking advice from Spock and McCoy, he still hasn't learned (or see the value of) making a difference by training the next generation. Commanding people and training people are two different things in his eyes. Once again, Kirk discovers the emptiness of his life without the Enterprise and eventually returns and accepts the rank of Admiral (and the training duties involved) shortly before STTWOK..
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