Hell, even the klingons have a PD (or a something differently called equivalent). That's why they needed to make it a secret when they were violating it in "a private little war".
Spoilers STAR TREK BEYOND
- Thread starter Khan 2.0
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Hell, even the klingons have a PD (or a something differently called equivalent). That's why they needed to make it a secret when they were violating it in "a private little war".
The prime directive is basically the main difference between the Star Trek and the Star Wars universe: In Star Trek, all species pretty much have their own territories, which they expand through colonisation and (sometimes) war. But besides that, they pretty much leave other species alone. We never see klingons or Romulans invade pre-warp civilisations, and even flat-out invasions are pretty rare between civilised species. Star Wars on the other hand is full-blown colonialism, where the white guys' Empire has pretty much annexed every planet and their original lifeforms, and now have them as little exotic window-dressing running around in the backgrounds of each location managing stuff
In Star Trek even the klingons and Romulans respect at least SOME form of non-interference clause with pre-warp civilisations. In Star Wars, the Empire builds their factories on the Ewok-planet and other civilised worlds (Gungans on Naboo).
In Star Trek even the klingons and Romulans respect at least SOME form of non-interference clause with pre-warp civilisations. In Star Wars, the Empire builds their factories on the Ewok-planet and other civilised worlds (Gungans on Naboo).
It's more like that they want to make it secret because they want culpable deniability or simply haven't the resources to spare to go full on. Unless their signatory to some multilateral interstellar treaty I highly doubt they have a PD of their own.
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That was to avoid breaking the Organian peace treaty, though, rather than their own internal policy.
KIRK: So, they've broken the treaty.
SCOTT: Not necessarily, Captain. They have as much right to scientific missions here as we have.
KIRK: Research is not the Klingon way.
SCOTT: True, but since this is a hands-off planet, how are you going to prove they're doing otherwise?
http://www.chakoteya.net/StarTrek/45.htm
Um...
The Klingons needed to keep it quiet because their actions were in violation of the Organian Peace Treaty.
Post proof.
There are some days that I wonder if you have actually watched Star Trek...
The Day of the Dove said:
The Klingons invaded Organia, they were bartering weapons at Capella for Topoline, the were arming the villagers on Neural.
Yes, not to jump on the disagreement train here, but the Klingons were usually portrayed as the aggressors, especially in TOS, were almost every encounter involved them doing some thing underhanded to further their ends and expand their empire. It wasn't a non-involvment policy but one of deniability, as mentioned by others.
We don't see them conquering, but we also rarely see the internal politics of the Klingon Empire, beyond whatever game of thrones the High Council is up to. Secondly, I'd be suspicious of a Klingon PD style policy because the Klingons regard most Federation behaviors as weak or cowardly. If a world is in the best interest of the Empire, then they will expand to take it.
It seems that Klingons would expand more if their internal politics and resource supply were not constant issues.
We don't see them conquering, but we also rarely see the internal politics of the Klingon Empire, beyond whatever game of thrones the High Council is up to. Secondly, I'd be suspicious of a Klingon PD style policy because the Klingons regard most Federation behaviors as weak or cowardly. If a world is in the best interest of the Empire, then they will expand to take it.
It seems that Klingons would expand more if their internal politics and resource supply were not constant issues.
And while we are discussing this kind of stuff I just finished watching TNG Symbiosis and like the episode Pen Pals this episode made me feel rather moody and flat.
Oh no we can't intervene to save these people who are being exploited by these other people. Oh no we dare not do that..... This episode made me so mad the first time I saw back in 1988
Oh no we can't intervene to save these people who are being exploited by these other people. Oh no we dare not do that..... This episode made me so mad the first time I saw back in 1988
Okay, here we go:
I don't fucking care wether the klingons call it "the prime directive" or something else, wether they chose to implement it because of moral obligation (probably not) or because they had a treaty with other species, or if they even like it. The fact remains: The klingons have their own version of a non-interference clause regarding pre-warp civilisations. Period. How they got it is completely irrelevant to the matter.
Also: Enterprise. I know some people here don't like it. It's still canon. And there It is stated very clearly that Vulcans have a non-interference clause with pre-warp civilisations. As was in the movie "First Contact". Remember that one? You might have seen it.
Romulans have them as well. As was proven by the TNG two-parter "Redemption". They probably don't call it the "prime directive" either. But they have it. Otherwise they wouldn't feel the need to disguise the act they are violating it during the klingon civil war.
So now you have all major powers in the Alpha quadrant - the Federation, Vulcans, Klingons and Romulans - adhere to at least some variation of the PD. Also it's established most of those species had Warp-travel way before the humans had it, but they didn't interfere here either, because we were, again, pre-warp at that time.
So yeah, it's not spelled out with crayons. But it's pretty obvious that it's part of a larger understanding between warp-capable civilisations.
Ah, back trying to settle arguments with personal insults again?
You almost managed two posts talking to me without them. Almost.
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You haven't demonstrated either the Romulans or the Klingons have a PD. It's a very strange idea that you've come up with there. It would be extraordinarily out of character for them to have one. There's countless other more plausible reasons they engage in clandestine activities. They don't want to excite their rival into total war being one of them.
Um... most Klingons hate Romulans. The Romulans openly helping the Duras family would not have played well in his bid to take control of the Empire.
Obviously, they don't. Or else they wouldn't have invaded Organia, or armed the native population of Neural, nor attempted to deal weapons to the natives of Capella.
You're relying more on your "head canon" that they have rules like the Prime Directive than anything in the actual shows have demonstrated.
Again, I highly doubt they have they came to their "no-interference-clause" on their own, rather than through a number of treatys and understandings with other civilisations. How they got to them is of no importance though. They have them.
I guess not all Nations on Earth are fans of human rights or international lsw. But they still at least officially have them and honour them because of treaties with other Nations. And try to disguise violations against them before other nations, Same as Klingons and Romulans regarding the Prime Directive and interstellar law.
I have to say that Picard's use of the Prime Directive in "Symbiosis" was the only time I enjoyed a 24th century PD story.
They might not had them before, but at least after the treaty of Organia they had one.
Let's turn the shoe around: Show me any proof where the klingons (or Romulans - or literally any other species) acts in clear violation of the Prime directive? (And, obviously, where it isn't illegal that they are doing it) Literally. Any example.
Well, the canon says it's illegal for the Federation to interfere with pre-warp civilisations or internal stuff of other species because of the prime directive, and that it's illegal for other species (Klingons, Romulans) to do so because of treaties.
I don't see where there is head-canon involved.
Your posts on the other hand are rather spare with examples, and mostly rely on somy arguments like "they don't have one because I don't think they have one, even though the examples say otherwise". Seems like head-canon to me...
You do realize the treaty in question was a peace treaty between the Klingons and the Federation? In other words, there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to assume that the terms of that treaty apply in any way to any world that isn't in some way a part of the Klingon/ Federation confilct. It's not a PD if the Klingons can invade whoever they want, as long as its outside the view of the Federation.
The invasion of Organia.
Is there any example where the klingons invaded a planet outside the Federation because they could? No. They don't invade other planets, especially pre-warp ones, as long as they have treaties with the Federation. And I doubt they do it because they are nice people...
After which they had it. Which is the central evidence that the treaty of Organia was definitely a point where it was established. Do you read the previous few posts?
Because the shows aren't about the Klingons or Romulans. All we have to do is look at their actions and we can tell that they have no Prime Directive. Do you honestly believe that the Klingons quit their actions outside the purview of the Organian Peace Treaty? They couldn't even respect it. Poisoning grain going to Sherman's Planet and arming the villagers of Neural.
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