The Return of Doctor Mysterio (Grade & Discussion Thread

[The Nth Doctor]

Eh, two half-baked stories in a half-baked episode that forms a decent episode for an okay show, but rubbish for Doctor Who. I enjoyed the opening scenes with Grant as a kid because it had some good dialogue and a few clever quips. Matt Lucas was somewhat decent but doesn't really have much of a character. Otherwise....meh.

Also, what the fuck was with that squeezing doll?

 

[intrinsical]

There are now many Osgoods. One in each country.

 

[Nightowl1701]

Also, what the fuck was with that squeezing doll?

Psychological torture. "You lie to me, I make the doll squeal in agony." A way to put her interview subjects off their guard and hopefully make them give up info they wouldn't otherwise. Though how much longer she'd have gotten away with it before someone chucked it out a window probably wouldn't have been much.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Probably there is some uncredited script polisher, but I stand correct.

Considering Moffat is usually that script polisher, I doubt it.

If nothing else, the door has now been opened (just a, ahem, crack) for The Amy Pond Adventures if/when Karen Gillan's movie career slows down.

Eh, no need for that. I loved Amy and Rory, but they're done. I much rather have Karen Gillian have great success as a film actress.

Psychological torture. "You lie to me, I make the doll squeal in agony." A way to put her interview subjects off their guard and hopefully make them give up info they wouldn't otherwise. Though how much longer she'd have gotten away with it before someone chucked it out a window probably wouldn't have been much.

Yeah, I get that, but it was obnoxious and stupid and completely unnecessary. Bleah.

 

[Lonemagpie]

Ok, I know that the writers wanted to convince us that Grant was cute and whatever, but didn't he come off a little creepy? I mean, becoming a nanny for the woman whom he was secretly in love for 24 years?

And it was clear that was just an excuse to be near her. I'm quite sure that no psychoanalyst would say it is a healthy behavior. This is borderline stalking.

Which is also a valid fit for the superhero comics the show was riffing on, of course...

 

[Christopher]

Wouldn't it make more sense to contact Kate Stewart? She actually runs the UK branch, and therefore likely has more pull when making requests of other UNIT branches than a science advisor would.

Even so, Osgood answers to Kate (there's an actual "answers to"!), so it, err, answers the question of why Osgood would be the scientific advisor consulting on the operation.

 

[kirk55555]

This was a pretty good special. Not amazing, but solid. As a huge superhero fan, I liked all the references to superheroes. I was a bit distracted by Justin Chatwik as The Ghost, since I only really know him from the terrible Dragonball Evolution film, but he did a good job here.

Nardole was entertaining. I thought he was ok but a bit too one note in the last special, but as he's written here I'd like to see him show up again. The Doctor got some great moments in this special (I especially liked his introduction to the reporter). Overall this didn't blow my mind or anything, but it was an entertaining adventure. The Series 10 trailer didn't wow me either, but I'm still excited for the nest series to start.

 

[1001001]

It was pretty good, although it had nothing to do with Christmas.



Best line: "There are some situations which are too stupid to be allowed to continue."

 

[Christopher]

It was pretty good, although it had nothing to do with Christmas.

Well, the opening scene with young Grant was on Christmas. I'm actually glad the rest of it wasn't. I think it's contrived that the Doctor is constantly having adventures that happen to fall on Christmas -- indeed, that they make up one out of every 12-14 adventures we see him have, which is a startlingly high ratio. I mean, couldn't he at least have the odd Hanukkah adventure or something?

 

[Allyn Gibson]

The sequel comic, Ghost Stories, isn't bad. Not quite what I was expecting; I thought it would be more along the lines of the Ghost having adventures, not unlike a Superman comic, albeit one with Grant and Lucy instead of Clark and Lois. Instead, the Doctor recruits Grant and Lucy for a cosmic-spanning adventure several years (from Grant and Lucy's perspective) after "The Return of Doctor Mysterio." So this is more like "What if Clark, Lois, and their son Jon were the Doctor's companions?" rather than "What do a super-hero's adventures in the Doctor Who universe look like?" That said, it does end with a dilemma and a cliffhanger typical of a super-hero comic book.

I wouldn't mind if this developed into a "Doctor Who super-hero universe," but I can also see how there might not be a lot of demand for that.

Some quick thoughts on the art. The Doctor doesn't always look much like Capaldi, which is a typical problem for Titan's Doctor Who comics; Capaldi seems to be difficult to capture. And Lucy looks nothing like Charity Wakefield; possibly they don't have likeness rights?

Overall, it's intriguing enough to be worth the ninety-nine cents. I'll probably continue with it in the digital form, and as I understand it Titan will be collecting this in floppies in the summer. (Similar to how DC handles Batman '66, Injustice, and Bombshells.)

 

[Skipper]

Which is also a valid fit for the superhero comics the show was riffing on, of course...

The problem is that the secret identity thing is at least questionable (according to today's sensitivity). Indeed, this point is also addressed in the modern superhero genre shows/movies (for example, virtually no one has a traditionally "secret identity" in the MCU films). But the episode played it totally straight.

It would have been nice if someone had pointed out how absurd the whole thing is...

 

[Saul]

OK, not great. Although not as bad as I was fearing. There should be something better than this after a year though.

 

[The Wormhole]

There should be something better than this after a year though.

People keep talking about the show taking a year off as though Moffat had a whole year to prepare things, but he didn't. He was persuaded to stay while in the thick of pre-production work on Sherlock, just as it was about to transition to filming. It wasn't until Sherlock was complete in late spring or so that Moffat had a chance to move onto Doctor Who, meaning that this special and the new season had no more prep time than any prior season or Christmas special had.

 

[Christopher]

The problem is that the secret identity thing is at least questionable (according to today's sensitivity). Indeed, this point is also addressed in the modern superhero genre shows/movies (for example, virtually no one has a traditionally "secret identity" in the MCU films). But the episode played it totally straight.

It plays a lot of classic superhero tropes totally straight. Moffat's Who has always been a fairy tale, so it follows that it'd play them straight rather than deconstructing them.

The one thing that bugged me is, why did Grant need to hide behind glasses if the Ghost wore a mask?

Plus, his superhero growl was almost as bad as Christian Bale's.

 

[Lonemagpie]

It plays a lot of classic superhero tropes totally straight. Moffat's Who has always been a fairy tale, so it follows that it'd play them straight rather than deconstructing them.

The one thing that bugged me is, why did Grant need to hide behind glasses if the Ghost wore a mask?

Plus, his superhero growl was almost as bad as Christian Bale's.

It was worse than Christian Bale's, and yeah, I did wonder about the glasses/mask ting - obviously just so they could reference Clark Kent.
(Overlooking, as everyone does, that there's a reason why nobody makes the Clark/Supes connection- because everyone thinks Superman is Superman 24/7, knowing hes an alien, and so they've no reason to look for another identity for him...

 

[Christopher]

(Overlooking, as everyone does, that there's a reason why nobody makes the Clark/Supes connection- because everyone thinks Superman is Superman 24/7, knowing hes an alien, and so they've no reason to look for another identity for him...

Well, post-Crisis, yes -- in the Silver Age, Lois was constantly trying to prove that Clark was Superman.

I figure people just come up to Clark sometimes and say "Has anyone ever told you that you look kinda like Superman?" and he goes, "Yeah, I get that sometimes" and that's as far as it goes.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

This was a case where I think the Christmas Special might have benefited from having someone else write it, someone with experience writing comic books and their tropes. Maybe someone like Paul Cornell, who's written super-heroes for Marvel and DC. Or Neil Gaiman, even.

I don't begrudge Moffat for writing this episode at all. In the promotional material, he makes clear his love of Superman, and the episode was clearly his homage to Richard Donner's Superman movie. I'm not sure we needed another homage to that movie, not after Bryan Singer's Superman Returns a decade ago, especially since Moffat seemed to pick up on Singer's "Supercreep" characterization of Superman.

I didn't have any expectations for this going in -- the trailer and clips were underwhelming -- but I felt generally okay with this, even with the thought that there's a better executed version of this with a better script out there in the multiverse.

 

[Romulan_spy]

I figure people just come up to Clark sometimes and say "Has anyone ever told you that you look kinda like Superman?" and he goes, "Yeah, I get that sometimes" and that's as far as it goes.

For me, the way Christopher Reeves played Clark Kent as clumsy and reserved and Superman as the opposite, made it very plausible to me that people would miss that they were the same person. Psychologically, it makes sense. People are defined not just by outward appearance but also by personality. So, yeah, people probably did think Clark Kent resembled Superman in physical looks but would have dismissed the idea that this mild mannered, clumsy guy could be a bold, fearless superhero since those two personalities are diametrically opposite to each other.

 

[shivkala]

Nice that the Superman comic the Doctor was reading was a John Byrne issue (not the same Johnny Byrne who wrote "The Keeper of Traken," "The Arc of Infinity," and "Warriors of the Deep," by the way). Since that was 24 years ago, or 1992, that's about right, assuming the issue was a few years old (his tenure on Superman was 1986-88). Did anyone recognize what issue it was, by any chance?

Yes! It was Superman #7 from July 1987. The other part, I think, is from Superman #15 from March 1988 based on the appearance of Jimmy Olsen's mother (you can clearly see her on screen in a panel where someone refers to her as "Mrs. Olsen."), as well as Superman flying into Maggie Sawyer (who was introduced this season on Supergirl). I have Superman #7 and found the panel, but I don't have Superman #15.

 

[TommyR01D]

The poll has now been open for fifty-five hours. Initially Humbug! was in the lead with 100% of the vote, only for there to be a 50 point swing to Fantastic! a few hours later. Satsuma then shot into the lead with three votes. Earlier today it fell back to a mere 48% but as I type now it has climbed back to exactly half of the total.