First and last names of minor characters

[Christopher]

I've been wondering, has Spock's full name S'chn T'gai Spock ever been spoken out loud by any character?

"Out loud?" If you mean onscreen, certainly not, since it comes exclusively from the novels. If you mean, was it used in dialogue by a book character, not as far as I know. To the best of my knowledge, it's been used in only three books. Ishmael, where it originated, used it only in a computer-screen text readout. The Tears of Eridanus had Sybok introduce himself as "son of Sarek, of the family S'chn T'gai, of the Clan Hgrtcha," but Spock did not exist in that universe. And Uncertain Logic mentioned the family and clan names only in narration. So there is one instance where the family name was spoken "out loud" in a book, but not Spock's full name specifically.

 

[Extrocomp]

The S'chn T'gai name was also used in the novels Beneath The Raptor's Wing and To Brave The Storm, but only in narration, not in dialogue.

 

[Ed Sanders]

Peter David had a recurring character named Ensign Sanders that I always wondered pic I inspired from some interaction we had back in the day on the AOL boards but it was probably just a coincidence.

 

[Ed Sanders]

How do you edit posts on here to fix typos?

 

[The Wormhole]

How do you edit posts on here to fix typos?

There's usually an Edit button at the bottom of the post. Although, it's possible you need to attain a certain rank before you can do that.

 

[Extrocomp]

It's occurred to me that there have been many times when two contradictory names have been combined into a single name (William Thomas Thelonius Riker is my favorite just because of how awesome it sounds out loud), but no one's ever tried to retcon the contradictory names into being siblings or cousins serving on the same ship. Obviously, that's not going to work for all characters (it's unlikely that McCoy has 5 ex-wives), but it could work for some.

 

[Christopher]

It's occurred to me that there have been many times when two contradictory names have been combined into a single names (William Thomas Thelonius Riker is my favorite just because of how awesome it out loud), but no one's ever tried to retcon the contradictory names into being siblings or cousins serving on the same ship.

I did, sort of, though more with professions than names. In writing DTI: Forgotten History, I referenced Lt. Watley from "Trials and Tribble-ations" as a science officer aboard the Enterprise, giving her the first name Dierdre after Memory Beta's entry. Soon thereafter, I learned that A Choice of Catastrophes had mentioned Lt. Watley (no first name given) as the ship's historian -- even though she was in blue and the two ship's historians we've seen (McGivers and Erikson) wore red for some reason. Since I didn't want to ditch my science-officer version of Watley, I threw in a line mentioning that she had a historian sister among the crew.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

Soon thereafter, I learned that A Choice of Catastrophes had mentioned Lt. Watley (no first name given) as the ship's historian -- even though she was in blue and the two ship's historians we've seen (McGivers and Erikson) wore red for some reason.

Given Kirk's comment in "Space Seed", "Here's a chance for that historian to do something for a change", one can either assume that a) historians didn't have a lot of official duties on board ship, day to day, and were therefore free to pursue their own interests, mostly, until needed, or b) officers with such positions also cross-trained in more than one department, and when not employed in historical pursuits, served elsewhere on the ship.

-- even though she was in blue and the two ship's historians we've seen (McGivers and Erikson) wore red for some reason.

She may have been attached to the sciences dept temporarily. Mira Romaine is an archivist, also related to history, somewhat...

Since I didn't want to ditch my science-officer version of Watley, I threw in a line mentioning that she had a historian sister among the crew.

Who could indeed be the one that gave rise (eventually) to Bashir.

 

[Christopher]

Given Kirk's comment in "Space Seed", "Here's a chance for that historian to do something for a change", one can either assume that a) historians didn't have a lot of official duties on board ship, day to day, and were therefore free to pursue their own interests, mostly, until needed, or b) officers with such positions also cross-trained in more than one department, and when not employed in historical pursuits, served elsewhere on the ship.

Or maybe Marla herself just wasn't very good at her job.

Who could indeed be the one that gave rise (eventually) to Bashir.

You do know that was just meant to be a wild fantasy of Bashir's, not an actual fact, right? Basically he just thought she was hot and was trying to make an excuse for having sex with her by convincing himself that she was his ancestor and he'd cease to exist if he didn't. (Sure, he had a female ancestor named Watley, but by that logic, Superman and Batman would be half-brothers.)

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

"Could", not "is", and with some other man, not Julian.

 

[Christopher]

"Could", not "is", and with some other man, not Julian.

But we weren't even supposed to believe there was any realistic chance that she could be. Taking it seriously even as a possibility is missing the point of the joke. O'Brien said outright that Bashir was being ridiculous, because he was.

 

[Jinn]

But we weren't even supposed to believe there was any realistic chance that she could be. Taking it seriously even as a possibility is missing the point of the joke. O'Brien said outright that Bashir was being ridiculous, because he was.

But if they would have wanted to kill off Bashir I think it would have been at least interesting to have him erased because he didn't have sex with a random Enterprie crewmember. It would probably feel very cold, as nobody can mourn for him.

 

[Ed Sanders]

Continuity porn freaks will never get that sort of joke...it just reinforces their belief that everything and everyone is connected in a universe.

 

[The Wormhole]

(Sure, he had a female ancestor named Watley, but by that logic, Superman and Batman would be half-brothers.)

Zack Snyder seems to think the mothers of two unrelated people having the same name is significant...

 

[Avro Arrow]

Given Kirk's comment in "Space Seed", "Here's a chance for that historian to do something for a change", one can either assume that a) historians didn't have a lot of official duties on board ship, day to day, and were therefore free to pursue their own interests, mostly, until needed

One does sort of wonder what use it would be to deploy an historian on a mission of exploration of uncharted territory. An A&A officer, sure, but you'd think that historians would be able to accomplish most of their work planet-side.

Unless the idea was the historian would research the history of any new civilizations they encountered, which kinda makes sense, but... in "Space Seed" they seemed to specifically need her because of her knowledge of *Earth* history, which in deep space would generally be next-to-useless.

(Well, unless it was because of all those Earth-offshoot planets, and planets that followed Hodgkin's Law of Parallel Planetary Development. Too bad she left the ship with Khan... they could have really used her on 892-IV, Ekos, and Sigma Iotia II! )

but by that logic, Superman and Batman would be half-brothers.

Except for the very, very basics, I am not well-versed in superhero lore. What is the connection that would cause someone to think that?

 

[Christopher]

Unless the idea was the historian would research the history of any new civilizations they encountered

That's exactly how I've explained Sam Kirk's job in Rise of the Federation. That, and chronicling the new history that Starfleet ships are making "with every light year," as Archer likes to say.

which kinda makes sense, but... in "Space Seed" they seemed to specifically need her because of her knowledge of *Earth* history, which in deep space would generally be next-to-useless.

Not really. History isn't just facts and figures, it's understanding processes and causes and social/political dynamics. The examples of history provide precedents that help us understand new situations -- which is why they say those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. The examples provided by Earth history can be useful for recognizing and predicting comparable events and processes on alien worlds.

I have bachelor's degrees in both physics and history, and I've actually found the history degree more useful in my science fiction writing, because of its applicability to writing about alien cultures and contacts. See also the SF of Poul Anderson, who based a lot of his alien cultures and far-future human civilizations on his extensive knowledge of history. If anything, it's implausible that we don't see historians consulted more often in Trek.

Except for the very, very basics, I am not well-versed in superhero lore. What is the connection that would cause someone to think that?

Lucky you -- you clearly haven't endured watching Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice. One of its many clumsy plot points is that Batman abandons his murderous vendetta against Superman based on nothing more than the fact that both their moms are named Martha.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

I suppose by extension, she and Lindstrom would've overlapped in their fields (history and sociology).

 

[Extrocomp]

I ask so that we can identify those individuals who don't have names, in an effort to minimize two people giving the same character different first names.

If the goal is to minimize characters having different names, I was wondering if we can do anything about the characters who already have multiple contradictory names. Would it be a good idea for the writers to decide on one name for each character which would have a quasi-canon status and stop using the other names? Or would that require giving up too much creative freedom?

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

While some may want to strive for consistency and homage-paying, others may decide, "well, that's another universe..."

 

[Idran]

Yeah, I'm not sure what that would really gain. What would be the point of it? Why's it matter? These people aren't real after all, they don't really have names beyond what was shown on screen.