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CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

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oswriter said:
There was an FTC workshop on crowdfunding several weeks ago. Check out the video starting around 20 minutes. Around 44 minutes, FTC attorney Helen Wong noted she could not comment on cases they may be bringing. But I know for a fact she's been made aware of Axanar. *whistles nonchalantly*
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So I see Alec is telling someone that 'our accountants have fully documented how there is no effect of paying salaries and benefits and putting it back, EXCEPT FOR IT SHOWING UP ON THE TAXES" (emphasis added).

Yea. About that. The IRS may want to have a word about being a discount-provider to YOUR company's act of providing YOU a loan, Alec.

And these salaries and expenses were being dispersed while Axanar was rolling in crowdsourced money, and there was no statement at that time that the payments were loans. Axanar insisted that workers 'deserved pay' for their work. There clearly was no intent to make a loan, or pay it back, while the money was coming in. Putting the money back doesn't put the action back.
 
ThankYouGeneR said:
Nice research on the court doc. Thanks

I'm trying to verify or dismiss an intimation made on Twitter that the defendant had said on social media the prop company was paying rent which the tweeter juxtaposed against the same quoted document you found. Without finding confirmation such a statement was made anywhere, for me I mean, the tweet has no credibility to me so becomes 'anti-rhetoric' noise that I feel I should dismiss at this time. I'll file it as unconfirmed 'data'. Which I will pull out again if something confirmable show up.
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RedForman said:
I'm sure this is probably old news around here..........

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Is this what you're talking about, @ThankYouGeneR?
 
oswriter said:
There was an FTC workshop on crowdfunding several weeks ago. Check out the video starting around 20 minutes. Around 44 minutes, FTC attorney Helen Wong noted she could not comment on cases they may be bringing. But I know for a fact she's been made aware of Axanar. *whistles nonchalantly*
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Hey! May your pie be tasty and your coffee not infringe on anyone's IP.
 
jespah said:
Hey! May your pie be tasty and your coffee not infringe on anyone's IP.
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Just for fun, I filed this a few minutes ago. Let's see what happens next.
----
Freedom of Information Act Request
Office of General Counsel
Federal Trade Commission
600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
Washington, DC 20580

Dear Sir/Madam:

This is a request under the Freedom of Information Act. I request that a copy of the following documents be provided to me: all investigative records, including any consumer complaints, concerning Axanar Productions, Inc., 28757 Industry Drive, Valencia, California 91355, or its principal owner, Alec Peters, Jr., who does business at that same address, in the years 2012-2016. This company raised funds from consumers through a series of crowdfunding campaigns to finance the production of an unlicensed motion picture based on the "Star Trek" intellectual property owned by CBS Studios, Inc., and Paramount Pictures Corporation, together with related merchandise, including but not limited to coffee.

I request a waiver of all fees for this request. Disclosure of the requested information to me is in the public interest because it is likely to contribute significantly to public understanding of the operations or activities of the government and is not primarily in my commercial interest. I am an individual who has written about the Axanar story in the past and I plan to disseminate any response to this request so that all members of the public may view it free of charge. Any information provided by the FTC will only be used for the noncommercial purpose of informing the public, including donors to the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns, about any investigative records related to Axanar Productions, Inc., and Mr. Peters.

In the event you deny my request for a fee waiver, I am willing to pay fees up to $10. If you expect fees will exceed this, please contact me before proceeding. [NOTE: IF THERE ARE FEES, I AM SO HOLDING A CROWDFUNDING CAMPAIGN.]

If you need to discuss this request, I can be reached at [CLASSIFIED SUBSPACE CHANNEL]. Thank you for your consideration of my request.

Sincerely,

[REDACTED BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO MEET ROBERT MEYER BURNETT IN A LAS VEGAS ALLEY SOMEDAY]
 
oswriter said:
There was an FTC workshop on crowdfunding several weeks ago. Check out the video starting around 20 minutes. Around 44 minutes, FTC attorney Helen Wong noted she could not comment on cases they may be bringing. But I know for a fact she's been made aware of Axanar. *whistles nonchalantly*
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Yessssssssssssssss. I'm hoping the FTC and IRS can make CBS/P look like the LEAST of his worries..............
 
muCephi said:
I actually think that was a satirical response to some actual sourced Alec comment. May want to dig a bit further.
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You sure? Here's the following conversation after that screen shot was posted. It seems as though it was legit and taken seriously. :shrug:
RedForman said:
I'm sure this is probably old news around here..........

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muCephi said:
Ok, let me see if I have this right.

"the money I pay myself" = Axanar Productions paying Alec a salary
"I pay rent to myself" = Propworx paying rent to Axanar Productions

Impression sought: Propworx company occupies space in the Axanar Productions building. It pays rent for that space to Axanar Productions.

OTOH, the statement says: some of the fan donated money which is personally paid to Alec by Alec is allocated to pay Propworx rent, through some undisclosed mechanism.

So how does this payment from Alec to Alec get into the Propworx financials, and why would that even be done? And is Propworx itself actually paying to Axanar Productions corp-corp, or is this just some sort of 'withholding' from Alec's salary, or is even part of what he calls salary, or is it some other cashflow he pays himself?

This argument of integrity all hinges on whether "Propworx rent" is burdening the 38k$ "salary", as Alec implies. Is Alec taking a hit on his 38k$ salary to pay the Propworx rent? Is this at all realistic, if Propworx were paying a reasonable business rent?

Or is this rent, whatever it is, a paper-only cashflow on the side from the 38k, essentially == the donors paying the Propworx rent, and Alec has failed to disclose this cashflow as part of what he is here calling "the money he pays himself" (note, the word "salary" not used, a more tortuous alternative phrase is used)?

Alec pled his salary was less than poverty level, without mentioning that he might be paying Propworx rent out of it. It seems a bit peculiar it never came up in his public statements about what he gives up for Axanar.

And besides, Propworx is a business. Alec has indicated no qualms with going in the red with Propworx business expenses in the past. So why would he this time around personally be paying the Propworx rent out of his Axanar Productions salary, instead of from the Propworx assets?

Something is strange about his claim. Its too complicated, it dances around the two companies actually having any concretely stated business relationship. It avoids saying that Propworx itself pays anything. Is anything actually being paid by Propworx as a corporate entity? Or is it all some handwaving inside the Axanar books? Wonder what the books say.
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jespah said:
Welcome to the wonderful world of commingling.
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Red Shirt said:
You sure? Here's the following conversation after that screen shot was posted. It seems as though it was legit and taken seriously. :shrug:
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Yes I believe the info was a comment on some obfuscation and the info was taken seriously. But I seem to recall this actual quote and the exerpts from the two companies incorporation filings was not originated from Axanar/Alec. Perhaps a thread search here or on facebook for the 'I pay myself' phrase could turn up the spot where this image/comment appeared and allow going backwards a little to see its context. It may have been something said at the Axanar site that wasn't actually answering a question, which seeded this.
 
oswriter said:
Just for fun, I filed this a few minutes ago. Let's see what happens next.
----
Freedom of Information Act Request
Office of General Counsel
Federal Trade Commission
600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
Washington, DC 20580

Dear Sir/Madam:

This is a request under the Freedom of Information Act. I request that a copy of the following documents be provided to me: all investigative records, including any consumer complaints, concerning Axanar Productions, Inc., 28757 Industry Drive, Valencia, California 91355, or its principal owner, Alec Peters, Jr., who does business at that same address, in the years 2012-2016. This company raised funds from consumers through a series of crowdfunding campaigns to finance the production of an unlicensed motion picture based on the "Star Trek" intellectual property owned by CBS Studios, Inc., and Paramount Pictures Corporation, together with related merchandise, including but not limited to coffee.

I request a waiver of all fees for this request. Disclosure of the requested information to me is in the public interest because it is likely to contribute significantly to public understanding of the operations or activities of the government and is not primarily in my commercial interest. I am an individual who has written about the Axanar story in the past and I plan to disseminate any response to this request so that all members of the public may view it free of charge. Any information provided by the FTC will only be used for the noncommercial purpose of informing the public, including donors to the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns, about any investigative records related to Axanar Productions, Inc., and Mr. Peters.

In the event you deny my request for a fee waiver, I am willing to pay fees up to $10. If you expect fees will exceed this, please contact me before proceeding. [NOTE: IF THERE ARE FEES, I AM SO HOLDING A CROWDFUNDING CAMPAIGN.]

If you need to discuss this request, I can be reached at [CLASSIFIED SUBSPACE CHANNEL]. Thank you for your consideration of my request.

Sincerely,

[REDACTED BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO MEET ROBERT MEYER BURNETT IN A LAS VEGAS ALLEY SOMEDAY]
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I"ll donate $0.02 to your kickstarter campaign. Will that be enough for the "I survived the lawsuit!" patch?
 
oswriter said:
Just for fun, I filed this a few minutes ago. Let's see what happens next.
----
Freedom of Information Act Request
Office of General Counsel
Federal Trade Commission
600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
Washington, DC 20580

Dear Sir/Madam:

This is a request under the Freedom of Information Act. I request that a copy of the following documents be provided to me: all investigative records, including any consumer complaints, concerning Axanar Productions, Inc., 28757 Industry Drive, Valencia, California 91355, or its principal owner, Alec Peters, Jr., who does business at that same address, in the years 2012-2016. This company raised funds from consumers through a series of crowdfunding campaigns to finance the production of an unlicensed motion picture based on the "Star Trek" intellectual property owned by CBS Studios, Inc., and Paramount Pictures Corporation, together with related merchandise, including but not limited to coffee.

I request a waiver of all fees for this request. Disclosure of the requested information to me is in the public interest because it is likely to contribute significantly to public understanding of the operations or activities of the government and is not primarily in my commercial interest. I am an individual who has written about the Axanar story in the past and I plan to disseminate any response to this request so that all members of the public may view it free of charge. Any information provided by the FTC will only be used for the noncommercial purpose of informing the public, including donors to the Axanar crowdfunding campaigns, about any investigative records related to Axanar Productions, Inc., and Mr. Peters.

In the event you deny my request for a fee waiver, I am willing to pay fees up to $10. If you expect fees will exceed this, please contact me before proceeding. [NOTE: IF THERE ARE FEES, I AM SO HOLDING A CROWDFUNDING CAMPAIGN.]

If you need to discuss this request, I can be reached at [CLASSIFIED SUBSPACE CHANNEL]. Thank you for your consideration of my request.

Sincerely,

[REDACTED BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO MEET ROBERT MEYER BURNETT IN A LAS VEGAS ALLEY SOMEDAY]
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Dude I would donate and throw in extra for you to get some sushi.............
 
muCephi said:
the US is a young country, lacking many hundreds of years of experience with demagogues and warmongers and wanna-be kings which would cultivate wariness of being massively exploited.

Somehow I think Axanar could not have happened in many other parts of the world. It would have gotten polite indifference by a populace who has no grounds to trust the speaker.
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What parts of the world would that be?

I mean, when did, say, Europe - as an example distinct from a young culture - begin to cultivate this putative "wariness" of demagogues and warmongers - 1946?
 
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