Star Wars Books Thread

[kirk55555]

Like I said, I find it to be a very accurate depiction of the original character. Okay, all kidding aside, in Legends, Thrawn made plenty of magical deductions from paintings. The farther down you go, the more magical they become, to the point where he was more or less a Mary Sue of observation and planning. Having seen the episode in question, Thrawn's actions and chains of reasoning are actually a lot more rational than some of the stuff he was doing in Legends.

I completely disagree. Thrawn was never a "Mary Sue" character, and his deductions made more sense then the clips I've seen of the Rebels "Thrawn". But, you seem to have your own thoughts about Thrawn that seem unflattering, so it could be we just have opinions about the character that are too different. I think he's the single greatest villain in the Star Wars series. That's my basis for judging what Rebels has done to him. If someone was...less then impressed, lets say, by the original version, then they're coming at the adaptation from a completely different way. I judge it as a huge fan of the original character.

The show is also resolving a lot of unanswered questions left over from The Clone Wars.

If by answer questions, you mean stuff like killing off fan favorite characters and showing what the daughter of an obscure character from season 1 are doing, I guessthey are. It also makes several supporting characters (Rex and friends) into complete idiots. Oh, and the villain brought back to life because the writers are morons is now interacting with Angsty Aladdin. Besides that, not much connection, and outside of the death and (arguably) the returning villain, nothing important. To be fair, TCW didn't really leave any unanswered questions outside of the location and final fates of some characters.

A few of the episodes tie into the Death Star's construction, making them part of the build-up to Rogue One that can be picked out of the franchise ("The Honorable Ones" also retroactively foreshadows Vader's trip to Geonosis in the Darth Vader comic series). The Servants of the Empire series has massive ties to Rebels, with Zare Leonis appearing in a couple Rebels episodes (that advance his book's story), and the Ghost's crew appearing in the final novel. Lothal has factored into the Adventures in Wild Space series. Lothal's Imperial Academy is mentioned in Lost Stars. Ezra Bridger's role in sending off the message in "A Call to Action" was referred to in the Beware the Dark Side! novelization of ROTJ. The novel Ahsoka has ties to the series with the Inquisitors becoming involved (as well as acting as an origin story for some bits of the TV show). Hondo Onaka's appearance on Freemaker Adventures owed more to his Rebels apperances than his Clone Wars ones (if I recall correctly). The Lasat massacre even slipped into the Legends book Imperial Handbook!

On top of that, there have been several tie-in books and series; There was the New Dawn prequel novel (which also affected some of the short stories in that Rise of the Empire omnibus). Kanan had a comic series. Ezra starred in his own book, Ezra's Gamble. There have been replica journals for both Sabine and Ezra, a la the Survival Guide and Flight Log tie-ins Rey and Poe got. There's an official magazine with short comic stories. The entirety of season one has been novelized.

Beyond print, part of Star Wars's online materials included an entire Holonet "news" broadcast that tied into the show. Some of the Rebels characters have been given action figures in the Star Wars Black toy line. Rebels characters were among the very few Star Wars characters to be represented in the late Disney Infinity video game and got their own DLC bonus content for the Lego Star Wars: The Force Awakens game (not to mention their own Lego toys).

So, no, it's actually having a pretty big impact for a couple-years-old show and has had a stronger reception from the fanbase than Clone Wars did when it first started out.

Most of that stuff you mentioned is little kid books and reference material. I think a few of the books you mentioned are literally the 3-5 year old "first time reader" books. Servants of the Empire I had to look up, and that "massively connected to Rebels" book series is literally for 8-9 years olds. It doesn't really count, no important SW stuff is going to be done in books for kids, especially 10 and under stuff. The comics don't count if they're actually designed as a tie in to Rebels (like the Kanan comic), and obviously the Rebels tie in novel A New Dawn has a connection to the show. Toys and video games don't count, almost every SW character gets a action figure eventually (to a ridiculous degree), and most end up in the Lego Star Wars games. Also, you're really stretching with the Death Star stuff. Tarkin effects that more. The Darth Vader comic connection I don't think is even remotely an actual thing.

Libel is never a valid tool for reasoning, debate, or discussion.

I think calling into question a person's motivation for saying what they said, and talking about how truthful they're being, is a valid discussiontool. Also, I didn't libel anyone. I was, admittedly, insulting people while legitimately questioning their ability/trustworthiness, that's different then libel (libel is stuff you get sued for and doesn't apply to conversations like this, you can insult someone as much as you want without it being "libel").

Has it ever occurred to you that A). he might be a better judge of the accuracy of Rebels Thrawn than any of us are and B.) that he could be conceivably telling the truth as he sees it?

I've seen Thrawn in Rebels. Zahn is either lying, or is very easily impressed. I'd say its probably the first one, but as 65 year old he'd probably be more used to cartoons from the 50s-60s, so Rebels might seem impressive if that's the bar Zahn uses to judge a cartoon and its characters.

 

[fireproof78]

Did I miss the part where a standard of criticism is judging a character in book is the same as an adaptation for a child's cartoon?

Also, why is insulting the production staff on film and TV media necessary? I really am not understanding this at all.

 

[Ithekro]

I completely disagree. Thrawn was never a "Mary Sue" character, and his deductions made more sense then the clips I've seen of the Rebels "Thrawn". But, you seem to have your own thoughts about Thrawn that seem unflattering, so it could be we just have opinions about the character that are too different. I think he's the single greatest villain in the Star Wars series. That's my basis for judging what Rebels has done to him. If someone was...less then impressed, lets say, by the original version, then they're coming at the adaptation from a completely different way. I judge it as a huge fan of the original character.

This is only because you don't have the rest of the pieces that go with that clip. Thrawn is shown to act more like Sherlock Holmes with his deductive reasoning than anything else.

Why does he know? Why is Hera even there?

Spoiler

Thrawn figures out it is Hera due to two pieces of art that make sense that she's be the only one interesting in it to be there at all. Hera goes to the build, which is home, to pick up a family heirloom that was her late mother's which seem to be passed from generation to generation. The building has been taken over as the Empire's administration building. She is holding this object when Thrawn finds her. He's studied the local culture and knows that such a totem is only worth anything to the maker's family. Combine this with the family portrait in the main office, and knowledge that Hera's mother is dead, the only female that would be interesting in the totem is Hera. The best part of that exchange is Thrawn stunning a disguised Ezra with no problem, stating that Rebels always have people there to help them.

The local Imperial officer is a bit racist and does not appreciate art. Threatening to destroy the art sets Thrawn off for a moment, which is has done in the past. The Empire was sloppy until Thrawn ordered them to change tactics, now they are anticipating Cham's moves.

 

[fireproof78]

So, context matters? Because, I like the description I'm reading so far.

 

[WebLurker]

I completely disagree. Thrawn was never a "Mary Sue" character, and his deductions made more sense then the clips I've seen of the Rebels "Thrawn". But, you seem to have your own thoughts about Thrawn that seem unflattering, so it could be we just have opinions about the character that are too different. I think he's the single greatest villain in the Star Wars series. That's my basis for judging what Rebels has done to him. If someone was...less then impressed, lets say, by the original version, then they're coming at the adaptation from a completely different way. I judge it as a huge fan of the original character.

I don't hate the character, although I do think he's somewhat overrated. I think the Mary Sue-ing (IMHO), started after the Thrawn Trilogy was finished. So, I was judging the the canon Thrawn by if he would be a good version of the Heir to the Empire take on him, and, IMHO, it worked. Fair enough if you don't like it.

If by answer questions, you mean stuff like killing off fan favorite characters and showing what the daughter of an obscure character from season 1 are doing, I guessthey are. It also makes several supporting characters (Rex and friends) into complete idiots.

Whatever, man.

Oh, and the villain brought back to life because the writers are morons is now interacting with Angsty Aladdin.

Are you talking about

Spoiler

Maul

? A.) I think he was a better character post-"death" and B.) Ezra's latest round of actions seems to make him prime-target interest for the villain, e.g. "Holocrons of Fate."

Besides that, not much connection, and outside of the death and (arguably) the returning villain, nothing important. To be fair, TCW didn't really leave any unanswered questions outside of the location and final fates of some characters.

Still, it's nice to have some closure and I found the Clone Wars elements added to the fun. But that's just me.

Most of that stuff you mentioned is little kid books and reference material.

Not "little kids" books and there wasn't any reference material (although the TFA Visual Dictionary does tie into an event established in Rebels).

I think a few of the books you mentioned are literally the 3-5 year old "first time reader" books.

Are you trying to be disingenuous here or something?

Servants of the Empire I had to look up, and that "massively connected to Rebels" book series is literally for 8-9 years olds. It doesn't really count, no important SW stuff is going to be done in books for kids, especially 10 and under stuff.

Moving the goal posts, are we now? The original comment was: "Also, Rebels has had literally no effect on most of the books, and none of the movies." Not only is target age not relevant to the discussion (per the criteria you set), but isn't even relevant to the discussion period; all canonical books have equal weight, meaning that something like Lost Stars is as important as Battlefront: Twilight Squad (or whatever that novel was called). (Also, as far as "kids books" not having important stuff, Rey's Survival guide, anyone? Before the Awakening?)

But, getting back on topic, the question you raised was: "Does Rebels have any affect on the tie-ins outside of itself?" The answer is a definitive "yes," per the provided examples. (The movies part I will grant, but Rebels is still pretty new and in most franchises, having tie-ins that don't affect the main form of media is very common, so that's not a big deal. Rebels not directly influencing the big screen is a lot like the majority of the other installments in Star Wars canon.)

The comics don't count if they're actually designed as a tie in to Rebels (like the Kanan comic), and obviously the Rebels tie in novel A New Dawn has a connection to the show. Toys and video games don't count, almost every SW character gets a action figure eventually (to a ridiculous degree), and most end up in the Lego Star Wars games.

But if the show is as unimportant and isolated in the bubble as you say, why are we getting so much materials and merchandise connected to it? (I mean seriously, Rebels has more stuff to its name than a big Disney hit, like Zootopia.)

Also, you're really stretching with the Death Star stuff. Tarkin effects that more.

Yeah, Tarkin had some. As did Ahsoka, the Utapau Clone Wars Story Reels, and the Rebels shows "Rebel in the Ranks" and "The Honorable Ones." (I'm not talking major prequel stories here, just little clues that in retrospect are going to tie a lot of things together, or at least have a: "Oh, that fed into that. Cool.")

The Darth Vader comic connection I don't think is even remotely an actual thing.

Read it and weep, man.

Actually, calling into question a person's motivation for what they said, and talking about how truthful they're being, is a valid tool. Also, I didn't libel anyone. I gave my theories and opinions on people and they're trustworthiness/competence level. I was insulting people while legitimately questioning their ability/trustworthiness, that's different then libel (libel is stuff you get sued for, you can insult someone as much as you want without it being "libel").

Okay, look, I didn't mean in the legal sense. However, accusing someone of lying is pretty serious and need more than: "They make a bad show, so how could they possibly be honest about their intentions and love of their jobs?" to back it up. (Honestly, that's all your reasoning seems to come down to.) You need

First of all, what evidence do we even have that they could be lying? They've been remarkably consistent on what they've said. (And if your theories are your best bets, color me unimpressed) Secondly, there's no motivation for them to lie.

I've seen Thrawn in Rebels. Zahn is either lying, or is very easily impressed.

I have to give you credit for having the stones to say that you know the character better than they guy who created him and wrote practically every single frakking story about him. Not very many people would.

I'd say its probably the first one, but as 65 year old he'd probably be more used to cartoons from the 50s-60s, so Rebels might seem impressive if that's the bar Zahn uses to judge a cartoon and its characters.

Why would Zahn be using old cartoons to judge new Thrawn? Wouldn't he be using his own writings to compare them?[/spoiler]

 

[Reverend]

For what it's worth, the A-wings show up in the new Ahsoka novel too (set 1 year after Order 66), so they at least date back to the Clone Wars and I doubt they were brand new even then. Given their speed, low shielding and modest weaponry I'm guessing they were originally meant for local security forces and militias and never saw service int he Grand Army of the Republic, except perhaps save as training craft for non-clone pilots.

As for why they didn't show up in ANH or tESB: SWR has shown how the rebellion operated in semi-isolated cells, each having to mostly procure their own equipment though various means, buy, beg, steal or salvage. All we really know is that they weren't on Yavin or Hoth. Presumably there were *hundreds* of other cells out there.

Honestly, I would be surprised if the X-wings were Clone Wars era either. Looking at the state of them in ANH, they've clearly already seen quite a bit of action and are by no means brand new.

 

[fireproof78]

For what it's worth, the A-wings show up in the new Ahsoka novel too (set 1 year after Order 66), so they at least date back to the Clone Wars and I doubt they were brand new even then. Given their speed, low shielding and modest weaponry I'm guessing they were originally meant for local security forces and militias and never saw service int he Grand Army of the Republic, except perhaps save as training craft for non-clone pilots.

As for why they didn't show up in ANH or tESB: SWR has shown how the rebellion operated in semi-isolated cells, each having to mostly procure their own equipment though various means, buy, beg, steal or salvage. All we really know is that they weren't on Yavin or Hoth. Presumably there were *hundreds* of other cells out there.

Honestly, I would be surprised if the X-wings were Clone Wars era either. Looking at the state of them in ANH, they've clearly already seen quite a bit of action and are by no means brand new.

So, how old would you say the X-wings are then, if they are not Clone Wars tech or an evolution from the ARC-170 and Z-95?

Generally, I agree with you about the A-wings, even if its a minor annoyance to me, but the X-Wing strikes me as having an interesting history.

 

[Ithekro]

The X-wings should be an outgrow of the Z-95 and ARC-170 as that was what the two designs were going for with Revenge of the Sith and the Clone Wars (well and the Z-95 was basically based on the original drawing of the X-wing, that look TFA X-wings.) No telling if or when they might decide the X-wings appear in the timeline. Only that they appear to already in in service a few years before Yavin, given the wear on the ones we see in A New Hope, and the kill marks on the Ace's TIE Interceptor in Rebels. We will of course definitely see them in Rogue One.

As for Rebels tying into the movies....Rogue One will likely have some tie ins to Rebels. If nothing else the "modern day" Hammerhead corvettes first show up Rebels, and are clearly visible in the Rebel fleet in the last Rogue One trailer.

 

[Reverend]

So, how old would you say the X-wings are then, if they are not Clone Wars tech or an evolution from the ARC-170 and Z-95?

Generally, I agree with you about the A-wings, even if its a minor annoyance to me, but the X-Wing strikes me as having an interesting history.

The first thing you should do before approaching the new canon material is let go of your preconceptions. Most of the EU lore was hodgepodged together over the course of years from various sources that didn't always agree with one another. So-called retcons like they kind that claimed the A-wing in the 'Droids' cartoon wasn't *really* an A-wing is just a fig-leaf. People apparently just couldn't bare to discard even the slightest detail from some old RPG sourcebook or from some cheesy old cartoon.
In other words, you must unlearn what you have learned.

Anyway, I'd say the X-wings could possibly be very late Clone Wars, or pretty soon after. Any later than that and I think the Empire would have started clamping down on any kind of military development that isn't directly supplying them.

Keep in mind that as per TCW, the ARC-170s started showing up in season 2 and Z-95s in season 4, so that's at least a year's grace before the war ended for X-wings to at least get on the drawing board. Who knows? Maybe they barely saw service and spent 10 years in mothballs before Bail arranged to have them "misplaced"?

 

[kirk55555]

Are you talking about

Spoiler

Maul

? A.) I think he was a better character post-"death" and B.) Ezra's latest round of actions seems to make him prime-target interest for the villain, e.g. "Holocrons of Fate."

Spoiler

Yeah, I'm talking about Maul.

Still, it's nice to have some closure and I found the Clone Wars elements added to the fun. But that's just me.

The Clone wars elements just pissed me off that the garbage show was brining in stuff from the much better show and ruining it

Moving the goal posts, are we now? The original comment was: "Also, Rebels has had literally no effect on most of the books, and none of the movies." Not only is target age not relevant to the discussion (per the criteria you set), but isn't even relevant to the discussion period; all canonical books have equal weight, meaning that something like Lost Stars is as important as Battlefront: Twilight Squad (or whatever that novel was called). (Also, as far as "kids books" not having important stuff, Rey's Survival guide, anyone? Before the Awakening?)

I was talking about the important stuff, although I suppose I should have been specific. rebels has no effect on any thing that is legitimately important to the new canon. Also, Rey's Survival Guide is of literally no importance, same with Before the Awakening. They're only "canon" in that nothing they say is important enough to be contradicted (although Episode VIII could easily contradict any of the stuff if they felt like it). Nothing in Before the Awakening or the stupid "survival guide" is important or even noteworthy.

But if the show is as unimportant and isolated in the bubble as you say, why are we getting so much materials and merchandise connected to it? (I mean seriously, Rebels has more stuff to its name than a big Disney hit, like Zootopia.)

Because Star Wars merchandises everything. There are action figures for background characters that show up for three seconds. There are action figures for the alien cameos George Lucas and his family played in the prequels. Rebels was created to make five year olds buy toys and merchandise, of course they're trying to sell stuff connecyted to it, that is the only reason it exists. A cheap, lazy, poorly done show to sell toys, just like He-Man and dozens of other mediocre cartoons over the years.

Read it and weep, man.

It was mentioned in Darth Vader first, in April 2015, 10 months before Rebels mentioned it in an episode that aired February 2016. So, Rebels took it from Vader, not the other way around.

Okay, look, I didn't mean in the legal sense. However, accusing someone of lying is pretty serious and need more than: "They make a bad show, so how could they possibly be honest about their intentions and love of their jobs?" to back it up. (Honestly, that's all your reasoning seems to come down to.) You need

First of all, what evidence do we even have that they could be lying? They've been remarkably consistent on what they've said. (And if your theories are your best bets, color me unimpressed) Secondly, there's no motivation for them to lie.

They lie to make money. They know they have a garbage show made for 5 year olds, but adults buy a lot of Star Wars stuff, so they pretend like they put any effort or care about the franchise so that it makes them look good to the people who have their own money to buy SW stuff. As for what evidence? Their show is the worst (official) Star Wars related thing ever made. They're either lying, or the most incompetent people ever.

I have to give you credit for having the stones to say that you know the character better than they guy who created him and wrote practically every single frakking story about him. Not very many people would.

I'm not saying that. That's specifically why I said he was lying, or is overly impressed by the cartoon so his bar for what is good is very low.

Why would Zahn be using old cartoons to judge new Thrawn? Wouldn't he be using his own writings to compare them?

No, he could be basing his impression on what he expects of a cartoon character. He probably never expected to ever see an animnated Thrawn, so would probably be impressed that it looks better then the kids shows of the 50s/early 60s he would have seen as a kid. Or, like I said, he's just lying.

 

[fireproof78]

The first thing you should do before approaching the new canon material is let go of your preconceptions. Most of the EU lore was hodgepodged together over the course of years from various sources that didn't always agree with one another. So-called retcons like they kind that claimed the A-wing in the 'Droids' cartoon wasn't *really* an A-wing is just a fig-leaf. People apparently just couldn't bare to discard even the slightest detail from some old RPG sourcebook or from some cheesy old cartoon.
In other words, you must unlearn what you have learned.

Since I was never married to a particular EU origin, I don't have a problem relearning some stuff

In fact, even though I have read Star Wars books since I could read (and books on tape) I like the idea of exploring the new canon. I've been trying to catch up on Clone Wars and such, but that's a bit of a process.

I'm sure that the discarding of old EU was necessary in order to allow people to feel like they can step in without having to learn so much other material. I have a great friend who seems to retain every bit of information and just amazed me with what he knew. But, I now feel like I catch up

Anyway, I'd say the X-wings could possibly be very late Clone Wars, or pretty soon after. Any later than that and I think the Empire would have started clamping down on any kind of military development that isn't directly supplying them.

Keep in mind that as per TCW, the ARC-170s started showing up in season 2 and Z-95s in season 4, so that's at least a year's grace before the war ended for X-wings to at least get on the drawing board. Who knows? Maybe they barely saw service and spent 10 years in mothballs before Bail arranged to have them "misplaced"?

I just find it interesting what the history of a starfighter that is considered "old" by ANH is. The Y-Wing is a great example of new tech in TCW that is considered older by the OT.

Thanks for adding to the details

 

[JD]

I understand you don't like the show, but you seriously need to knock off the personal insults. That fucking bullshit is just not necessary. You can just say you don't like the show without making it personal.

 

[Ithekro]

They lie to make money. They know they have a garbage show made for 5 year olds, but adults buy a lot of Star Wars stuff, so they pretend like they put any effort or care about the franchise so that it makes them look good to the people who have their own money to buy SW stuff. As for what evidence? Their show is the worst (official) Star Wars related thing ever made. They're either lying, or the most incompetent people ever.

Minimum seven years old (Rated TV-Y7), lets not exaggerate due to irrational hatred. It seems more likely it is designed ten and up range given Ezra's age and the bracket may be going up as the show gets darker. Much like Clone Wars started getting darker during its third season. It is presently rated at 8/10 on IMDB.

 

[kirk55555]

I understand you don't like the show, but you seriously need to knock off the personal insults. That fucking bullshit is just not necessary. You can just say you don't like the show without making it personal.

I'm not insulting anyone I'm having a conversation with, people have the right to their own opinion even if we disagree. As for Filoni, I'll insult him until the day he stops working on SW. His work, either done from laziness or incompetence, feels like a personal insult as a SW fan, and I'll always give my real opinion on him, his team and their work.

Minimum seven years old (Rated TV-Y7), lets not exaggerate due to irrational hatred. It seems more likely it is designed ten and up range given Ezra's age and the bracket may be going up as the show gets darker. Much like Clone Wars started getting darker during its third season. It is presently rated at 8/10 on IMDB.

IMDB ratings are always off. Plus, anyone who cares enough to review/rate a SW show on IMDB is probably a SW fan, and more likely (far from guaranteed, but definitely predisposed) to give the show a good review. As for the Y7, its strictly for violence, but story content wise its a show for 5 year olds. It just has more violence to bring more people in. I definitely wouldn't call it a "dark" show. Its a show about a bunch of kids cartoon cliches and stuff like space whales. Ezra being angsty and some Y7 violence isn't really make the show "dark".

 

[JD]

I'm not insulting anyone I'm having a conversation with, people have the right to their own opinion even if we disagree. As for Filoni, I'll insult him until the day he stops working on SW. His work, either done from laziness or incompetence, feels like a personal insult as a SW fan, and I'll always give my real opinion on him, his team and their work.

And I'll call bullshit on it every time you do. That completely pole vaults over the line of what's acceptable to me, and I'm not going to let it slide.

 

[C.E. Evans]

I just find it interesting what the history of a starfighter that is considered "old" by ANH is. The Y-Wing is a great example of new tech in TCW that is considered older by the OT.

Oddly enough, that "old RPG sourcebook" described the T-65 X-Wing as not really being old at all at the time of Episode IV, but it did say that it was the last starfighter produced by its manufacturer before the Empire shut the line down sometime prior to the Battle of Yavin (subsequent X-Wings were produced by the Rebels themselves). There was actually no information regarding the origins & histories of the Y-Wing and the B-Wing, except that the Rebellion used the Y-Wing a lot in its early days. The only tidbit about the A-Wing's history was that it came out after the Rebellion began.

That's pretty much it regarding what the Sourcebook had to say about those ships (the articles on each go into much greater detail, but only about their abilities, deployments, & maintenance). It's possible that the writers & producers of Rebels may be using that book as a reference, but it's also possible that they aren't and we're just looking at coincidence.

 

[kirk55555]

And I'll call bullshit on it every time you do. That completely pole vaults over the line of what's acceptable to me, and I'm not going to let it slide.

That's your choice. I personally don't think you get to decide what's acceptable to talk about in a conversation, but whatever makes you happy, I guess. It doesn't really matter to me, and won't change how I talk about things

 

[JD]

Fine.
If you don't like something somebody makes, that's fine say it's bad all you want, but if all you are basing things on is their work then you don't have a basis for taking things to a personal level. If you had actually been basing the comments on them as a person, based on something they said at a con or in an interview, or even during a personal interaction, I wouldn't be as bothered by it. I've never heard or seen Filoni or any of the cast or crew of either Rebels or TCW say anything that I found upsetting or offensive, and I have never heard second hand about anything like that.
I've also never seen or heard anybody involved with the shows say anything that would make me doubt that they were fans, if anything it's been the opposite. The fact that they are changing things when they bring in Legends content in doesn't mean they hate it, the fact that they are choosing to use it all shows that they like it.

 

[Voth commando1]

Every time I see an article, a YouTube video, every time some idiot bashes the EU-I just love it more and more and more and more intently, each and every day. I just want it back so badly, so passionately so intensely, I feel like a franchise so near and dear to me has left m weeping in the dust and crying into the void.

I just want it back so badly, I get angry when an idiot columnist says the Vong were a generic alien invasion or that "hey it gave us Kylo Ren" That piece of dirt is nothing but a cheap and pale reflection of a much superior character and story-Jacen Solo-my favorite EU character.

I just want it so badly, I miss it so badly, I just love it harder and harder every day it goes by.

 

[Set Harth]

Their show is the worst (official) Star Wars related thing ever made.

Ha ha ha no.