Nana Visitor says no to Vedek Kira

[jaime]

My main problem with Vedek Kira is even if you accept that Kira would leave a military life and go into the religious order (which isn't completely out of character) how did she get to a position that's roughly analogous to a Bishop in only five years or so?

But then I guess Star Trek in general is never the place for realistic rank progression.

She's the Emissarys bestie. And the whole order seems to only have two ranks....priest and Pope. (Or vicar and archbishop) I can't imagine her not having the chops to go high there...her dead lover was vedek Bareil, her best mate was the singular most important religious figure on the planet, her other friends included first ministers, and she personally was possessed by a prophet in full public view. The only amazing thing is she didn't think to use all this to try and depose Winn....back then I guess she was enjoying being the right thumping hand of God.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

Prylar>Ranjen (monks)>Vedek>Kai. Winn recalled being a Ranjen during her S7 arc with Dukat.

 

[jaime]

Prylar>Ranjen (monks)>Vedek>Kai. Winn recalled being a Ranjen during her S7 arc with Dukat.

Ah ty

 

[DGCatAniSiri]

Kira becoming a Vedek is my least favorite change DRGIII made in the later Relaunch novels. I know she was always religious, but I just never saw her as the Vedek type. I know it was supposed to be because of all of the stuff that happened with the Ascendants, but it still didn't really work for me.

Same. I have just never gotten on board with this idea. It didn't even feel earned in Ascendance, which felt like it was trying to retroactively justify it, rather than making it feel natural. Like the narrative itself was going "Oh, yeah, these thoughts were there before, trust me," rather than actually trying to earn this change.

 

[Tosk]

I vote for "least fave change" too. I love the relaunch novels, but Vedek Kira just never felt right. I know people change, but it's hard to shake the version of Nerys we knew for seven years no matter what happened afterwards.

 

[KeepOnTrekking]

Kira always struck me as being the same type of person as Kirk...always wanting to be in the thick of things and making the decisions out in the field. Kira being a Vedek just rubs me the wrong way like the Spock/Saavik marriage.

 

[David cgc]

Kira always struck me as being the same type of person as Kirk...always wanting to be in the thick of things and making the decisions out in the field. Kira being a Vedek just rubs me the wrong way like the Spock/Saavik marriage.

To be fair, Kirk retired or accepted promotion out of the captaincy three or four times, even though you'd think once would be enough for him to realized he hated being out of action.

Who knows how Kira feels after being thrown back in time (in two distinct ways) and spending years cooling her heels waiting for history to catch up with her? She may be ready to get back into action, and this whole thing will end up resolving itself, not unlike the Grumpy, Paranoid Sisko arc. Except, hopefully, better, though I'm not sure where Kira's place in the current ensemble would be. DS9 is pretty top-heavy at the moment as it is.

 

[JD]

She was the right hand lady of the emissary, and was always extremely religious. She was always heading that way, even if I too would prefer her to be closer to how I remember her. She basically has choice between embracing her religion further, or turning into a crazy hermit always telling the faithful to get off her lawn and stop asking her about the emissarys ball.

Why would she have to leave Starfleet? Is there some event that happens in Ascendance that means she can't stay in Starfleet?

Where do you after commanding the most significant outpost in the sector, historically,militarily and religiously? We all know how admiralty transfers work out in Trek.
Kira the warrior monk has a nice ring to it, and many of the Bajoran clergy must have been in the resistance.

She could continue to command the station, move to a different starbase or to a starship, she could take a position down on Bajor, or accept a promotion to Admiral. There are plenty of possibilities.

 

[flandry84]

Yep,hate the change in Kira's status.
And besides,Starfleet is a big organisation,Kira doesn't need to be rooted in the Bajor sector.

(If we are talking desirable retcons...please bring back Elias Vaughn).

 

[Jinn]

(If we are talking desirable retcons...please bring back Elias Vaughn).

I would opt against a Data or Janeway type of resurrecting, but some more stuff featuring Vaughn in his days of spionage would be great. There is a lot of stuff we haven't seen yet (like whatever he did in 2355 on Gemworld and wasn't there an encounter with an Iconian Gateway?)

 

[flandry84]

Well TBH,if Treklit is going down the same road as Marvel by treating death and resurrection as routine then a great character like Vaughn deserves a second chance.
Getting older as I am,I want to see a greybeard or two in Treklit.Picard,being a new father hardly qualifies anymore.Though Rikers beard now has it's fair share of grey.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

Have to admit I never did like the idea of Kira going into the religious life. It was a facet of her life, an important one, but something personal to her--I don't see her preaching to others.

 

[VDCNI]

Yeah I've also never been a fan of Kira as Vedek. The biggest mistake of the DS9 books post Destiny and the recent attempt to explain it fell horribly flat.

It's particularly frustrating as Kira as Starfleet Captain had lots more milage to it and It doesn't help that Ro is basically being written as Kira right now as DRG removes everything distinctive about her.

 

[Paris]

Have to admit I never did like the idea of Kira going into the religious life. It was a facet of her life, an important one, but something personal to her--I don't see her preaching to others.

Agreed. I always got the impression that the religious aspect of her life was important to her, but she never really seemed to be the kind of person to preach it at others. I'm a DRG3 fan, but the Kira thing has never really sat right...for me at least.

 

[Tirius]

I don't remember the specifics of the background story in the last few novels to feature Kira, but I do remember thinking "well, if that's the reason behind it... I can live with it". So long as a change feels natural in the development of a character, I do not mind it upsetting the status quo. I recently re-read Losing the Peace, and as much as I regretted losing Miranda Kadohata, it was a natural exit for her. The same holds true here.

Having said that... as much as I like Ro, I much prefered Kira in charge of DS9 and Ro as head of security like in the earlier novels. Kira is one of the driving characters for the DS9 narative, and having her take up a secluded life style seems like an obstacle for including her in future stories. And like a few of the posters above, I too don't see Kira as an active member of the clergy. I can see her say, taking a year off as a sabatical to study and perhaps become a monk (prylar/ranjen, Memory Alpha is a bit unclear which is the lowest rank), but I think her dislike of the politics in the Vedek Assembly alone would preclude her from wanting a position in it.

 

[jaime]

Why would she have to leave Starfleet? Is there some event that happens in Ascendance that means she can't stay in Starfleet?

She could continue to command the station, move to a different starbase or to a starship, she could take a position down on Bajor, or accept a promotion to Admiral. There are plenty of possibilities.

My point is that after commanding Ds9, for her personally, anything else won't be a forward step. I would rather she had remained in that position tbh. The only forward progression for her otherwise...probably is the Bajoran religion.

 

[jaime]

Have to admit I never did like the idea of Kira going into the religious life. It was a facet of her life, an important one, but something personal to her--I don't see her preaching to others.

She regularly preached to others, including Sisko, on the show. It's best not to confuse the Bajoran faith with real world equivalents too much. While I don't think much of it, it's hard to see Kira away from Bajor/Ds9, and if she's no longer in command...where does she go?

 

[DS9Continuing]

I certainly felt the same way as many of you at first, but when I was writing my own fanfic projects (see sig), I worked hard on trying to make it all make sense. I think I did an okay job.

The 'official' story has now been told, so these are not story ideas any pro author could use, but I'll spoiler it just in case:

Spoiler

Kira first of all resigned from Starfleet in protest at their refusal to get involved in the Ascendant situation, but she had been in conflict with them for a while. Once she had quit, she needed to spend some time dealing with her own actions in the Ascendant attack, so she went to join the monastery. It was also the place most sensible to look after Raiq, the last remaining Ascendant. Not to mention she didn't really have anywhere else to go.

She played a big role in the Rebecca-Sisko-gets-kidnapped affair, persuading Raiq to help. Kai Solis and even Vedek Yevir are very impressed with her. When it comes to the Borg invasion, she leads prayer vigils all across Bajor, which a lot of the more religious Bajorans consider to be a big reason why the Prophets protected Bajor from attack.

The thing about her being the Emissary's bestie is indeed one of the reasons given in "Rough Beasts of Empire" for her becoming a vedek so quickly.

But also, consider Opaka. She always struck me as the kind of religious leader who didn't preach at all - rather than telling people what to think, she just helped others to figure it out for themselves. And given how much Kira idolised Opaka, I would see her moving in that direction. A person who uses their spirituality for the good of others, and the Assembly want to recognise that, and the only real way that have of doing that is to give her the 'rank' of vedek. But that doesn't mean that she has to lead congregations or go out proselytising on street corners.

.

 

[JD]

Yeah I've also never been a fan of Kira as Vedek. The biggest mistake of the DS9 books post Destiny and the recent attempt to explain it fell horribly flat.

It's particularly frustrating as Kira as Starfleet Captain had lots more milage to it and It doesn't help that Ro is basically being written as Kira right now as DRG removes everything distinctive about her.

Yeah, with Ro and Kira being so similar, it does feel a little redundant to have Kira leave, and then just put Ro in charge.

My point is that after commanding Ds9, for her personally, anything else won't be a forward step. I would rather she had remained in that position tbh. The only forward progression for her otherwise...probably is the Bajoran religion.

With Bajor being the in Federation now, there are still plenty of other things she could do in the system if she wanted to leave DS9. She wouldn't even need to move up, she could just move to a similar position somewhere else. But there's really no reason she would have to leave the station in the first place, we've seen plenty of people commanding the same ship/crew for decades.

 

[Jarvisimo]

I liked the idea of Vedek Kira, and I really like @lvsxy808's suggestion of an Opaka-like model. I did miss Kira's fire - that seemed to die away, but we were looking at a Kira almost 20 years older than when we met her. There were some dopey moments (stealing a runabout felt dopey somehow), but overall I was interested in what it meant to be a cleric in the 24th century (who wasn't an egotist or corrupt). I do miss Vedek Yevir (post egotistic phase) and I definitely miss Opaka (as well as Krim for another interesting Bajoran!).

Definitely there was a rupture in the DS9R, and I'm not sure the Ascendants arc went where it should have

Still, I'm excited to see where Kira goes next.