He's very good as Sisko's father too.
Why The Huge Gap Between TMP & WOK?
- Thread starter DeepSpaceYorks
- Start date
He's very good as Sisko's father too.
I agree.
And Brock Peters is part of that elite group of actors who've done both Star Trek and Star Wars, sort of -- he was Darth Vader in the NPR radio adaptations of the Star Wars movies.
Think I heard recordings of that. He was a pretty good casting choice. He certainly sounded a lot like James Earl Jones's version.
Who's also a brilliant actor.
I watched WOK again the other night and had some more thoughts. At the end of TMP Kirk seems to, once again, be Captain of a starship (Admirals don't command starships) yet he's an Admiral again by the start of WOK. Bones is still complaining about him accepting the promotion so what happened there? Promotion (Admiral) - demotion (Captain) - promotion (Admiral), perhaps Kirk agreed to be promoted again after another 5YM?
This is part of why TWOK feels like a reboot as if TMP didn't exist. And it's something I dislike about the film.
Yet at the end of TMP he does appear to be back in charge of the Enterprise, there's no indication that he's going back to the Admiralty.
At the end of TMP, Kirk takes the Enterprise for a joyride, without consulting upper echelons. That's a pretty clear indication that he's headed back to the admiralty, once the Enterprise has had her shakedown.
Well, it was literally the end of the crisis, he hadn't even reported to Starfleet at that point! Maybe he stuck around for the shakedown cruise, before being dragged back to his office in San Francisco.
That makes sense. I wonder why Starfleet was so keen to promote Kirk? He saves their asses again in TMP and they reward him by returning him to Admiral. (I'm currently reading Dillard's Lost Years so I know the reason put forward there) What is Starfleet thinking?
Kirk is a hero, a legend in his own time. Starfleet cuts him some slack. Eventually, Starfleet corrects their "error" in promoting him too far above the trenches, by returning him to captain at the end of TVH. 
Seriously, though, this, like so many other aspects, is just on par with "cartoon" realism. I try not to take it too seriously, and just simply enjoy it.
<=== obsessive fan
Seriously, though, this, like so many other aspects, is just on par with "cartoon" realism. I try not to take it too seriously, and just simply enjoy it.
<=== obsessive fan
The implication at the end of the film is that are heroes are back where they belong (and where we want them to be) and set to head out to new adventures.
The time period between TMP and TWOK doesn't negate that implication or assumption. But the setup for TWOK makes it sound as if TMP never happened. Now, several years later, Kirk is finally an Admiral and bitterly unhappy. The time since TOS is never addressed. And this is where TWOK picks up the story.
There is no explanation given for why Kirk wears captain's braids instead of admiral's. Kirk is addressed as Admiral and wears admiral's braids even after his meeting with Nogura. The only discussion about demotion in the film is with respect to Decker, it's described as temporary, and it's implied that his demotion is only for the duration of the crisis. What Kirk's and Decker's assignments are going to be after the crisis is resolved is also never stated.
However, based on what's given in the film, there is no reason to suppose that Kirk's rank reduction isn't as temporary as Decker's is supposed to be. So, I would have to say, no, not all, there is no such implication that Kirk will stay in command of the Enterprise. There is no indication that there will be any "new adventures" under Kirk's command, except those that may occur while the Enterprise is getting her shakedown. Anything else isn't implied by what's on screen.
Sorry, I wasn't retconning.
I think the lengthy time gap between the events of TMP and TWOK helps make sense of it. In TMP, Kirk still felt like he was in his prime and ready to get back on the horse. By TWOK, over a decade later, he's feeling old and worn out. Maybe he gave up command again because he felt he was slowing down and didn't think he could cut it anymore.
Again, though, my rationalization in Mere Anarchy was that he made a better deal the second time -- he'd accept the promotion, but would keep the Enterprise as his personal flagship and occasionally take it out on special missions, so it wouldn't be just a desk job like it was before.
Again, though, my rationalization in Mere Anarchy was that he made a better deal the second time -- he'd accept the promotion, but would keep the Enterprise as his personal flagship and occasionally take it out on special missions, so it wouldn't be just a desk job like it was before.
Agreed. Kirk's assignment is clearly for the V'ger incident alone. His reduction in rank is just stupid, Decker's even more so, but there's no reason to suppose that Nogura and Starfleet Command intended it to be permanent. "OK, admiral, you can command the ship during this emergency, and after that why don't you just give up your responsibilities as an admiral and stay there for good." That just doesn't sound believable. Or it sounds more like a punishment.
I've always interpreted the "Out there... thataway" line as Kirk taking the ship on a victory lap before returning to his duties as an admiral.
