That's horrible.
Religion and Star Trek
- Thread starter VulcanMindBlown
- Start date
That's horrible.
You would think that we could all agree (Christians, Atheists and other groups) that mentally torturing our children is a bad thing.
Pretty much, yep. All the ones that require people to "sell" them, anyway.
When was the last time you saw a religion without those things going door-to-door? "Do you have an eternity to contemplate the oneness of all things and the endless cycle of death and rebirth?" No.
Girl Scout cookies are a tangible item and exist in reality. I know (or can reasonably assume based upon existing evidence) that if I purchase Girl Scout Cookies I will receive actual Girl Scout Cookies and only actual Girl Scout Cookies, fully edible in a timely manner. Also that I have recourse if my Girl Scout Cookies prove to be unsatisfactory or not as advertised.
But, much like people selling things like "essential oils," homeopathic remedies, and other things through multi-level marketing (of which door-to-door salespeople are always the lowest rung - kind of obvious when you think about it) there are only two types of people who sell religion. Those who don't know they're selling a defective product, and those that do. They may be the nicest and most earnest people, they may totally believe in what they're discussing, but they're still basically trying to sell Nibiru* to me.
*Nibiru, the alternately brown-dwarf to super-Earth-sized planet that's supposed to careen through the inner solar system every 30,000 (or 60,000, or whatever new thing they make up this week) years, according to believers, and has been ABOUT TO DESTROY US SELL YOUR POSSESSIONS AND BUY OUR BOOKS DVDS AND DISASTER KITS for round-about 20 years now. Unfortunately, because gravity is a thing, in order to exist their planet has to both be invisible on all wavelengths and have no mass. It literally can't exist. (Unless, of course, it exists outside of natural space-time, in another plane, infinite and eternal and you see where I'm going with this.)
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Can we all agree that Girl Scout Cookies are da bomb, especially Somoas? Seriously, I work in retail and I have noticed that customers have gotten much more stubborn over the last few years. By that, I mean they are insistent on hearing the answer they want to hear regardless of how divorced from reality that answer is. In a larger real-world context, religious people are specially bad at this type of behavior because they "know" they are right and their text tells them to make converts. and neither proof nor reason will dissuade them from their appointed mission. Religious belief has been known to suppress curiosity and deductive reasoning. Extremely religious people have it all figured out so no need for curiosity. Religious beliefs are supported by neither facts nor logic and require a blank-faced belief and refusal to question their religion because many religious believe doubting is sinful.
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I'll be a Thin Mints guy until the day I die, but yeah, Samoas are good too!
Yeah..those people like Kepler, Newton, Mendel....and Georges Lemaître.
I DO understand what you're saying. There are a branches of Christianity that are pretty much cults revolving around the quasi worship of a particular person. This person has all the answers and no one in the group needs to think for himself. The women don't think at all and say little unless it's to tell other women how to live. The infamous Duggars (if you don't know who they are count yourself blessed) were deep into the teachings of one Bill Gothard who teaches things that he must have pulled out from under his hat, I have NO idea where he came up with most of them. There are lot of smaller versions of this kind of thing out there. From reading these posts these appear to be the type of Christians that most here seem to have in mind, or have experience with. I won't say they aren't 'real' Christians because that is not my place and I don't want to get into the whole 'no true Scotsman' thing...I'm just saying they are just one particular thread in the blanket.
And I don't want to derail the thread with too much discussion about cults. I do know a little about them but unfortunately there are also mental triggers involved. I'm sure someday it will get easier to talk about them.
I am curious about how the universe works. I am in no way a scientist or even close.. but if you glanced at my facebook page almost half the things I have 'liked' are NASA, The ISS, Scientific America etc etc. I sit around and watch "The Universe' for fun. Neil deGrasse Tyson has my respect. It's not my life but it is a serious interest.
You seem unusually educated and well-rounded. So were the people you mentioned. There will always be exceptions to any generalization based on research. That does not make the research invalid.
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You sound like me when I was still in high school. I was a firmly devout Christian, but I loved science, I loved learning and discovery. The problem was that most of the fellow Christians my age thought that kind of thing was useless since Jesus was coming back any moment. I think it helped that I had a "nemesis." He was actually a friend, but it was a good natured rivalry between myself and a classmate who was an atheist. We were both at the tops of our classes, and so it became fun to kind of pick sides. You had him, the intelligent atheist (with a huge affinity for Simpsons humor), and you had me, the intelligent fundamentalist Christian (also with a huge affinity for Simpsons humor). I think that kept me balanced, and from taking things so seriously that I lost the whole point of it all.
Just to be clear, you would sue the girl scouts over the quality of the cookies?
Maybe it's where I live and definitely how I was raised, but I was raised with that sense of balance. Faith and scientific discovery can be side-by-side. "Jesus is coming soon," but that doesn't mean you stop learning about the world around you.
Parents are selling Girl Scouts?
Are Trekkies (or Trekkers... whatever you want to call yourselves) more likely to be Secular and/or Left? It seems that when I started getting into Star Trek (2006-2007,) people were leaning that way, and it seemed especially true for Star Trek fans.
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Good, good. Not long now until I bring you over to the Dark Side of Atheism.
Seriously, though, I understand that point of view, and not everyone's path goes in the same direction. For me, that meant leaving the faith behind. I did so willingly, and gladly, to be honest. That doesn't mean it would be the same for you or @stardream, or any other person of faith who also loves science and Star Trek, and I'm fine with that. IDIC, and everything it represents does mean something to me. I would just like a peaceful co-existence between all of us, and I think that is something I loved about Star Trek even when I was a firmly devout Christian: that idea that humanity had become a real brotherhood, that we conquered fear of the Other, at least amongst ourselves.
That's a good question. For myself, I was 4 when the adventures of Kirk and Spock first got my attention (this was back in 1984). When TNG aired for the first time, I knew I was hooked for life. I grew up as a fundamentalist Christian, and all the worldviews involved in that. Now I'm an atheist, but my love of Star Trek has remained unchanged. So there must be something in it that appeals to the best in us, something that transcends our personal beliefs on some level.
I think life experiences have only strengthened my faith. I can't fully explain why at the moment, but with everything, I feel like there is definitely a higher power.
In the '90s when TNG was on, my group of college friends was predominantly right-leaning, and a majority were some form of religious. Of course, my data's probably a bit skewed since it's from an engineering college in the South.
It appears to be a shield, which is also a Christian symbol. That or it's Blue Cross and Blue Shield Insurance.
Actually, trespassing only occurs when the person/s refuse to leave AFTER being told to leave.
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I would not even remotely attempt to dissuade you of that belief. For some, faith is unnecessary, but for others it is the very cornerstone of their lives. When it comes to religion, I do get frustrated, but only at those faiths which seek to harm others for merely existing.
Okay, Coloratura, now that I've had some time and have a keyboard to type on, I think I need to give more of a response than what I did earlier. I can understand why you did and why others do as well. Our life experiences mold our faith and religious choices.Good, good. Not long now until I bring you over to the Dark Side of Atheism.
Seriously, though, I understand that point of view, and not everyone's path goes in the same direction. For me, that meant leaving the faith behind. I did so willingly, and gladly, to be honest. That doesn't mean it would be the same for you or @stardream, or any other person of faith who also loves science and Star Trek, and I'm fine with that. IDIC, and everything it represents does mean something to me. I would just like a peaceful co-existence between all of us, and I think that is something I loved about Star Trek even when I was a firmly devout Christian: that idea that humanity had become a real brotherhood, that we conquered fear of the Other, at least amongst ourselves.
For me, the last decade and a half has been quite a journey. The last nine years or so have been probably the worst as my mother's mental and physical health deteriorated. I prayed for understanding and for strength, and for a moment of peace.
I learned from Deep Space Nine and from my own experiences that you have to listen carefully to what God says, because He doesn't always respond in words (see "The Reckoning."). I haven't had the sudden urge to break an ancient tablet dealing with Armageddon, but I have had insight that I hope I've used well. I also learned that hearing God is a special thing and not going to happen every day, so you have to learn to listen.
I think the reason I loved Deep Space Nine so much is because it showed that faith and science can peacefully co-exist. Everyone can believe as they do, but no one has to look down on anybody for it. I think that's beautiful and a future I can love.
ETA: Just saw your new post. I know you weren't trying to dissuade me. <3
I haven't read any of the posts in this thread. Just dropped by to say I'm surprised it hasn't been closed yet.
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