BREAKING: Official Fan Film Guidelines Issued

[Noname Given]

JJ Abrams must be wondering why the hell he ever went to bat for these day.

That said whilst he only ever said he is getting the law suit dropped, he has a played in these new guidelines, which have prevented Axnar and other productions from happening, so his little stunt seems to have back fired.

This whole thing has blown up in his face, but I think he did make a mistake being involved.

With regard to the part I bolded above, that is not AT ALL what JJ Abrams said. What he said is that he was told in a few weeks the lawsuit "would be going away." <--- That does not mean dropped necessarily (and since 5 weeks past that statement the lawsuit continues I do not believe that what JJ Abrams meant.)

What was announced shortly after JJ Abram's comment was that C/P lawyers were in settlement talks with Axanar's lawyers and that was it. What JJ Abrams/Justin Lin probably did was get the suits at Paramount to agree to attempt to work out a settlement with Alec Peters (which they probably did not want to do as they were handily winning their case as evidenced by the Judge's denial of every Axanar motion - and some of the comments in his denials of those motions.)

JJ Abrams probably believed Alec Peters would be like any reasonable person; and that in a couple of weeks a settlement would be done, and the case would go away. IMO - Just goes to show how deluded Alec Peters must be because I'll bet many reasonable settlement offers were made; and Alec Peters probably has turned down every single one - probably because Alec Peters believes a Jury will side with him and somehow go against all copyright laws; and he'll be somehow vindicated and allowed to make Axanar.

But when people (including may so called mainstream journalists) mis-state what was actually said by JJ Abrams; it certainly doesn't help the situation.

 

[drt]

My understanding was that the teleprompter had a bit at that point to mention the lawsuit. I doubt they fully briefed Abrams other than to mention that it was in settlement talks. I doubt either he or Lin personally went to bat for Peters, maybe for "fan films" in general since Abrams had Cawley in '09.

I think mentioning the lawsuit at all was probably a mistake, since it seemed to embolden the Axanar folks.

 

[Sgt_G]

My understanding was that the teleprompter had a bit at that point to mention the lawsuit.

Depends on who you talk to. I've heard everything from "JJ's comments were scripted word-for-word on the screen," to "there were instructions for Adam Savage to ad-lib a few questions about the lawsuit," to "the teleprompter simply paused on Adam's last scripted question/comment." I would dearly love to see a photo taken that night with the screen in it. If nothing else, I'd like to see what the guy running the teleprompter has to say about it.

 

[wamdue]

Depends on who you talk to. I've heard everything from "JJ's comments were scripted word-for-word on the screen," to "there were instructions for Adam Savage to ad-lib a few questions about the lawsuit," to "the teleprompter simply paused on Adam's last scripted question/comment." I would dearly love to see a photo taken that night with the screen in it. If nothing else, I'd like to see what the guy running the teleprompter has to say about it.

I seem to have stumbled into a rabbit hole here, cant say which I was quoting, just my memory of what was reported, which fair enough is not always 100% true either.

Still if JJ had any hope that Alec was a reasonable man, then those hopes have well and truly been dashed, and as I recall Alec was present and received some coverage from StarTrek.com, there was certainly recorded video, this suggests to me that JJ thought Alec as a person could be reasoned with.

 

[JD]

I had a thought. Could a non-Trek celebrity be involved in a fan film under the guidlines, like Stan Lee in the one linked to a while back or Richard Hatch in Axanar?

 

[Maurice]

I find it a little sad that so many people are immediately trying to figure out loopholes in the letter of the law instead of heeding the sprit of the guidelines.

 

[urbandefault]

With regard to the part I bolded above, that is not AT ALL what JJ Abrams said. What he said is that he was told in a few weeks the lawsuit "would be going away." <--- That does not mean dropped necessarily (and since 5 weeks past that statement the lawsuit continues I do not believe that what JJ Abrams meant.)

What was announced shortly after JJ Abram's comment was that C/P lawyers were in settlement talks with Axanar's lawyers and that was it. What JJ Abrams/Justin Lin probably did was get the suits at Paramount to agree to attempt to work out a settlement with Alec Peters (which they probably did not want to do as they were handily winning their case as evidenced by the Judge's denial of every Axanar motion - and some of the comments in his denials of those motions.)

JJ Abrams probably believed Alec Peters would be like any reasonable person; and that in a couple of weeks a settlement would be done, and the case would go away. IMO - Just goes to show how deluded Alec Peters must be because I'll bet many reasonable settlement offers were made; and Alec Peters probably has turned down every single one - probably because Alec Peters believes a Jury will side with him and somehow go against all copyright laws; and he'll be somehow vindicated and allowed to make Axanar.

But when people (including may so called mainstream journalists) mis-state what was actually said by JJ Abrams; it certainly doesn't help the situation.

Weren't both parties directed by the court to engage in settlement discussions as part of the planned timeline? Seems like I remember reading that in the documents posted by Jespah.

If that's the case, CBS' announcement that settlement talks were in progress was just stating what was already on the schedule.

 

[USS Triumphant]

I find it a little sad that so many people are immediately trying to figure out loopholes in the letter of the law instead of heeding the sprit of the guidelines.

Consider that people figure out how to rob banks for three reasons: to rob banks, to write about bank robberies, or to stop banks from being robbed the way they figured out.

My hypothetical situation, at any rate, was partially the third, partially the second - we gotta have *something* to talk about around this joint.

 

[Noname Given]

Weren't both parties directed by the court to engage in settlement discussions as part of the planned timeline? Seems like I remember reading that in the documents posted by Jespah.

If that's the case, CBS' announcement that settlement talks were in progress was just stating what was already on the schedule.

Not really. The Judge is usually mandated to require a 'settlement conference' - BUT, if the Mediator sees that one side or the other really doesn't want to settle; such a conference can last 5 minutes or less. It really sometimes is just a formality in many cases.

The fact that C/P lawyers have tweeted on multiple occasions that they are (still) in settlement talks leads me to believe that (due to JJ Abrams/Justin Lin's intervention); C/P are still actively pursuing a settlement and not just talking up what's 'on the schedule'.

Personally, I hope Alec Peters decides to go to court and see just how deluded he is. But that's me. As I've said here and in other threads; I'm fairly certain C/P offered a settlement any reasonable person would accept - but Alec Peters and his ego somehow believe that JJ Abrams is 100% "on his side" - thus he feels he can get any terms he wants - OR - he actually believes if they have a Jury trial the Jury will find in his favor (again showing just how out of touch with reality he is on this matter).

Time will tell.

 

[USS Triumphant]

It'd be hilarious if Abrams only indicated some degree of support for Peters just to encourage him to push this thing to *maximum stupid*.

 

[Warped9]

I had a thought. Could a non-Trek celebrity be involved in a fan film under the guidlines, like Stan Lee in the one linked to a while back or Richard Hatch in Axanar?

The guidelines state something along the lines of anyone who has been connected with Trek previously or currently cannot participate in fan productions. If someone has never had anything to do with Trek previously than there is nothing barring them from participating in a fan production.

 

[JD]

That's what I thought.

I find it a little sad that so many people are immediately trying to figure out loopholes in the letter of the law instead of heeding the sprit of the guidelines.

I'm not trying to find a loophole, I'm just trying to understand what is and isn't allowed.

 

[Warped9]

That's what I thought.

I'm not trying to find a loophole, I'm just trying to understand what is and isn't allowed.

This is the case. JVC himself emphasized these are guidelines and not inflexible rules.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

This is the case. JVC himself emphasized these are guidelines and not inflexible rules.

True, but that doesn't say/mean too much, since we don't know what CBS means by "flexible". And I would not assume that to the extent there is flexibility that all the guidelines are equally flexible.

Sure, I doubt CBS will C&D you because your film was 32 minutes instead of 30, or you raised $51,000 instead of $50,000 on Kickstarter. But I won't be surprised if they'll be sticklers about not being able to have "Star Trek" in the title (other than in the "a Star Trek fanfilm" subtitle) and not being able to use alums.

 

[Warped9]

I think there are certain "do nots" in the guidelines. And I think they're pretty obvious to most people. The others seem to imply they're giving you a kindly warning not to stray too far--keep certain goals and expectations more reasonably modest.

If we could assume about $50,000 to make a reasonably polished 50-60 minute feature then you should get some decent mileage out of that if your episodes are only 30-35 minutes (or less) in length. If you exceed your crowdfunding target by 5-10 thousand dollars I don't see CBS/P being bugged by it.

 

[ThankYouGeneR]

True, but that doesn't say/mean too much, since we don't know what CBS means by "flexible". And I would not assume that to the extent there is flexibility that all the guidelines are equally flexible.

True enough, though I'm pretty sure my memory serves me right in that the word flexible was never said. To me it wasn't even left vague; make films using our official guideline list - we give you the assurance we will never have any issue with your films --- and we will do for you what we have never done before for any fan films ever - we will allow you to display, advertise, and promote funding for your productions at our Official Events & Conventions. And we will not tell anyone what they can or can not do in their productions. But if you do film with these guidelines you can be confident we will not ever take issue with what you do in your productions and will allow your productions to be on display at our Official Events & Conventions.

So there is assurance of security, & benefits, they give for filming within their official guidelines.

I saw never even a hint to an allusion to how they will or will not address any film choosing to film outside their official guideline list. But Mr. van Citters reiterated several times they will not tell film makers what to do or how they must choose to film. Which I infer to mean an implication of total absence of assurance to anyone choosing to film outside their official guidelines as to how they will or will not respond to doing so.

Which, to me personally, does not imply flexibility, nor does it imply inflexibility. But precisely an absence of assurance offered one way or the other for film makers who choose to film outside their now official 'guide' lines.

It says 'to me' that they are wanting to co-exist with us, that they are offering benefits to the those of us who are willing to work with them in the way they are comfortable. Make these films we love to make, even make them the way we want to, but to use discretion, self monitor in our choices away from the guidelines. Stay close to what has allowed business and fun to coexist for decades. Crowd source money if we want, but hundreds of thousands and millions of dollars in crowdfunding is now intolerable to them. That there are no limits on money just given us. Only on massive crowd sourcing.

 

[YJAGG]

I find it a little sad that so many people are immediately trying to figure out loopholes in the letter of the law instead of heeding the sprit of the guidelines.

I agree, when my son tries to dance a around a rule, I tend to get angrier, about the transgression, since it was against the spirit of the rule in question (yes I pulled the same crap w/ my parents and teachers in life, but the worst I got was getting grounded or detention not denying everyone form doing something).
Yes I know these are guide lines and they seem to being saying we are not policing this, go and finish what you already started ( can't wait for Alec to play that one up) and who knows maybe NV, C Far and Intr are all going to get blind eye turned to them. That said I don't want to poke that bear come out with an hour plus pilot of a new fan film series. So all I can say to the loop holers is keep poking that bear, please let's see how much you get away with before the owners of ball take it back for good and lock the fence to their yard.

 

[Warped9]

They have already stated what will happen if you go too far for their liking. First is a polite phone call to express their concerns. If that falls on deaf ears then the C&D order comes next. If that still doesn't get the message across that means you've crossed into lawsuit territory.

 

[Admiral2]

They have already stated what will happen if you go too far for their liking. First is a polite phone call to express their concerns. If that falls on deaf ears then the C&D order comes next. If that still doesn't get the message across that means you've crossed into lawsuit territory.

Yeah, but constantly trying to figure out exactly which poke will piss the bear off is unnecessary and needlessly provocative. If you just stick to what the freaking guidelines say to the best of your ability you won't show up on CBS/P's radar at all. And there's an unwritten guideline that everybody should follow if they want to do something in a trek fan film that raises a question in their head: When in doubt, just don't fucking do it, okay?

 

[YJAGG]

Yeah, but constantly trying to figure out exactly which poke will piss the bear off is unnecessary and needlessly provocative. If you just stick to what the freaking guidelines say to the best of your ability you won't show up on CBS/P's radar at all. And there's an unwritten guideline that everybody should follow if they want to do something in a trek fan film that raises a question in their head: When in doubt, just don't fucking do it, okay?

Sadly when Kirk breaks a rule he gets a commendation for original thinking- OMG I just figured out AP's defense ...