CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[muCephi]

... Mailing lists are very big biz. ... I don't have to do market research! It's all been done for me.

The Axanar list probably would be attractive to scam artists...

he must have been heart broken when he read the guidelines.

You could see it in the body language when he was asked when he had any last words about the matter.

...That's not true. Since the big change in the 1970s (1978?) copyright vests once the work is fixed in a tangible medium. No registration is required for your work to be copyrighted...

This is something I am wondering about. How can the studios tell people they may not take full actions to protect their work, if some protection is automatic as soon as a script is set down? Isn't this somehow tortuous interference, (of necessity and by silence) acknowledging people have copyright automatically, but saying they may not claim the full rights thereby unless they wish to be sued? I could see someone making the argument that you can't concede the first without allowing the second, since the second was never intended to be a separable part of the law you are acknowledging by conceding copyright-by-fixing.

 

[Warped9]

Quoting Vic Mignogna from STC's FB page;

"Hi everyone, thank you all for your tremendous outpouring of concern and support. First and foremost, we have the utmost respect for CBS and their right to protect their property as they see fit. As soon as we know for sure how the latest developments will impact STC we will most certainly share it with all of you."

"A CBS representative will be on "Engage" the official Star Trek podcast on June 29. At that time, hopefully many questions will be answered, so let's wait and see before jumping to conclusions. If you wish to ask a question, you can do so on their Facebook page."

 

[muCephi]

I guess there is scope for it, but it would be really hard to do, if you need to introduce new characters, and new storylines, and then resolve them in 30 minutes, that is not something you always going to be able to do well.

There could be a place for The Twilight Zone anthology concept as fanfic. But I think one thing would have to happen -- add one more 15 minute segment to a story. If I had any sway with the studios this is what I would lobby for. Its not enough to make a movie, but it is enough to fit the general audiences' current sense of what a single story takes to tell in video.

Who knows, maybe mindsets will change and people will be willing to have shows where the actors speak really quickly and the like. Stranger things have happened. Look at the insanity (and I do mean *insanity*) that took over college debate competitions. Just go 50% faster, rather than 200% faster. No doubt actors could still express nuance in the form. It might even get a new name, like "fanfic genre" for the unique characteristics required by this limitation.

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[dmac]

That's not true. Since the big change in the 1970s (1978?) copyright vests once the work is fixed in a tangible medium. No registration is required for your work to be copyrighted.

From the US Copyright Office's own website:

Do I have to register with your office to be protected?
No. In general, registration is voluntary. Copyright exists from the moment the work is created. You will have to register, however, if you wish to bring a lawsuit for infringement of a U.S. work

Why should I register my work if copyright protection is automatic?
Registration is recommended for a number of reasons. Many choose to register their works because they wish to have the facts of their copyright on the public record and have a certificate of registration. Registered works may be eligible for statutory damages and attorney's fees in successful litigation. Finally, if registration occurs within five years of publication, it is considered prima facie evidence in a court of law.

The point I was attempting to draw is more social than legal and pertaining more towards a platform such as Youtube than the courts. Consider a studio produces a non registered script, places it on Youtube only to have a claim that it violates another persons work. I've never gone though the process but I assume sending in a copy of your certificate of registration would clear the issue up fairly quickly.
If you can no longer produce registered work, means of recourse might not be so clear cut in a youtube court of red tape.

 

[wamdue]

There could be a place for The Twilight Zone anthology concept as fanfic. But I think one thing would have to happen -- add one more 15 minute segment to a story. If I had any sway with the studios this is what I would lobby for. Its not enough to make a movie, but it is enough to fit the general audiences' current sense of what a single story takes to tell in video.

its pretty simple we cant change the rules, so its not really worth discussing. For me I wonder why they allow a story to be 30 minutes long, but say it has to come out in two 15 minute parts.

I dont know if CBS / Paramount has ever looked at YouTube, but there are alot of videos which are of one 30 minute production, but split between Part 1 & Part 2, without any effort to make the production into 2 parts story wise. They are basically allowing a 30 minute story, just as long as at the 15 minute mark you put up a "Part 2 title card"

Also the idea of not being able to produce physical copies of it, is backward thinking, look at music, people dont own alot of physical music anymore, they stream, or download it, for a generation who is willing to pay to be allowed to stream something, not having the DVD or Blu Ray option is not a big deal.

I think both things are more to do with old fashioned studio thinking, that does not fully understand the internet.

 

[muCephi]

its pretty simple we cant change the rules, so its not really worth discussing.

I am not an Axalite lobbying for repeal

But I have a suspicion that as time goes on, and calmer heads prevail once they see the financial issues are locked down, there might eventually be some studio folk who could entertain the idea of "let them have their other 15 minutes". Just a thought.

 

[ThankYouGeneR]

There could be a place for The Twilight Zone anthology concept as fanfic. But I think one thing would have to happen -- add one more 15 minute segment to a story. If I had any sway with the studios this is what I would lobby for. Its not enough to make a movie, but it is enough to fit the general audiences' current sense of what a single story takes to tell in video.

The Twilight Zone! (original one) It was a never miss for us! It was a half hour show for almost all the years it ran. There maybe was a season, maybe the last one that went to an hour? .... anyway, it made terrific shows that were half hour, minus the time of the short commercials back then.

That's a terrific suggestion, The Twilight Zone example!

 

[muCephi]

The Twilight Zone! (original one) It was a never miss for us! It was a half hour show for almost all of its run. There maybe was a season, maybe the last one that went to an hour? .... anyway, it made terrific shows that were half hour, minus the time of the short commercials back then.

That's a terrific suggestion, The Twilight Zone example!

You know, you're right. It was a half hour. An awful lot of it seemed longer to me because the actors often projected the paralyzing fear of the new nukes era with protracted stares and silences. But they did adapt some classic SF, that's for sure. "To Serve Man" comes to mind. And its a nice circle, some of the TOS actors were in it. The only thing is it really was a one trick pony -- a conceit with a twist, the end.

 

[GeorgeKirk]

Funny thing:

Because I'm a stinker, I tweeted the link to Vic Mignogna's statement on the fan film guidelines at Axanar with a comment:

Axanar didn't reply publicly, but did direct-message me to accuse Vic of being a serial womanizer/adulterer. As if that had anything to do the fact that CBS/Paramount's intellectual property rights should be respected. Classy, right?

Also, whoever runs their Twitter account apparently doesn't believe that retweeting supporters' threats to boycott Star Trek Beyond/Star Trek 2017 constitutes encouraging a boycott. I'm amazed they didn't call me a hater or block me (makes me wonder if someone other than Alec is running the Twitter account), but since I'm tired of the constant lies and negativity I unfollowed them.

 

[wamdue]

I am not an Axalite lobbying for repeal

But I have a suspicion that as time goes on, and calmer heads prevail once they see the financial issues are locked down, there might eventually be some studio folk who could entertain the idea of "let them have their other 15 minutes". Just a thought.

maybe so, but that is far in the future, and it wont be soon enough to allow projects like Continues to not shut down now.

 

[muCephi]

Funny thing:

Because I'm a stinker, I tweeted the link to Vic Mignogna's statement on the fan film guidelines at Axanar with a comment:

Axanar didn't reply publicly, but did direct-message me to accuse Vic of being a serial womanizer/adulterer. As if that had anything to do the fact that CBS/Paramount's intellectual property rights should be respected. Classy, right?

WTF? Someone playing Captain Kirk, accused of that? SOMEone in Axanarland needs to put away their little laser gun for the night! "Oh, sweetie, is it time for you to pewdie-pew? Mommy's coming..."

Aside from which, really, WTF? They must have thought you are a random donor who could be drawn into and shocked by an ad-hominem random flash grenade, or they'd have banned you.

 

[Sgt_G]

Too bad they limited it to a two-part show. It'd be cool to do a whole series like The Mercury Men:

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[wamdue]

WTF? Someone playing Captain Kirk, accused of that? SOMEone in Axanarland needs to put away their little laser gun for the night!

just because you play a womanizer, it does not mean it is ok that you are one.

I am not saying Vic is one, but if he was it would not be cool to defend his behaviour by saying "well he plays Captain Kirk, so its fine"

 

[dmac]

I do hope I'm wrong but I can see a fan studio producing only vignettes, garner some 2,000 - 3,000 views in the 1st year. I can't speak for Vic or any others that invested a large sum of money into Star Trek fan films but I doubt it was to receive such little attention.

 

[muCephi]

just because you play a womanizer, it does not mean it is ok that you are one.

I am not saying Vic is one, but if he was it would not be cool to defend his behaviour by saying "well he plays Captain Kirk, so its fine"

I am saying it is utterly irrelevant to the question of whether Axanar stole cash value from the IP of the studios, and anyone in a public forum like a Twitter stream who tries to inject observations about the personal lives of anyone in order to evade this fact is at the very least (or really, at the very most) a 10 year old. No offense, and I am not defending, just rejecting the premise that they can inject ad hominems in this way.

 

[wamdue]

I am saying it is utterly irrelevant to the question of whether Axanar stole cash value from the IP of the studios, and anyone in a public forum like a Twitter stream who tries to inject observations about the personal lives of anyone in order to evade this fact is at the very least (or really, at the very most) a 10 year old. No offense, and I am not defending, just rejecting the premise that they can inject ad hominems in this way.

obviously is wrong for them to try and make this about Vic, but its your post I thought was odd.

WTF? Someone playing Captain Kirk, accused of that?

it kinda reads like, if had they accused him of something out character for Kirk, it would have more meaning.

or possibly im reading too much into it, and should be going to bed.

 

[Firebird]

Axanar didn't reply publicly, but did direct-message me to accuse Vic of being a serial womanizer/adulterer. As if that had anything to do the fact that CBS/Paramount's intellectual property rights should be respected. Classy, right?

Also, whoever runs their Twitter account apparently doesn't believe that retweeting supporters' threats to boycott Star Trek Beyond/Star Trek 2017 constitutes encouraging a boycott. I'm amazed they didn't call me a hater or block me (makes me wonder if someone other than Alec is running the Twitter account), but since I'm tired of the constant lies and negativity I unfollowed them.

I would post the DM that they sent you. Don't let them get away with such egregious slander towards anyone. Accusing Vic of being a philanderer is over the line. What the hell were they even thinking saying something like that?

 

[muCephi]

obviously is wrong for them to try and make this about Vic, but its your post I thought was odd.

it kinda reads like, if had they accused him of something out character for Kirk, it would have more meaning.

or possibly im reading too much into it, and should be going to bed.

the latter.. reaction to the world of Axanar often becomes a bit tongue in cheek here.. np by the way..

 

[GeorgeKirk]

just because you play a womanizer, it does not mean it is ok that you are one.

I am not saying Vic is one, but if he was it would not be cool to defend his behaviour by saying "well he plays Captain Kirk, so its fine"

The point is that none of that has anything to do with the fact that he is right: Star Trek belongs to CBS/Paramount, they can enforce their IP rights however they want, and any calls by a fanfilm producer to protest via boycott or some other scheme to financially "punish" C/P just proves their lawyers' contention that fanfilms are a threat to their business.

And since there is no logical rebuttal to such clearly factual statements, whoever runs Axanar's Twitter fired off a lazy personal attack against the guy making them.

 

[GeorgeKirk]

I would post the DM that they sent you. Don't let them get away with such egregious slander towards anyone. Accusing Vic of being a philanderer is over the line. What the hell were they even thinking saying something like that?

Honestly, I don't know that it is slander. I don't know Vic or Alec or any of these people personally, so I'm unable to independently verify or refute the claim. Maybe Vic likes to lay down with ladies. Maybe Alec puts on a Lt. Uhura dress and pays a hooker to spank him while he sings "On the Good Ship Lollipop". I don't know. I don't care. It's 100% irrelevant to the topic at hand.

I'm much more interested in how Axanar retweets every threat to boycott CBS and Paramount, then claims not to encourage any boycott. Which reminds me of how Trump says he doesn't encourage violence at his rallies, let me tell you.