Deflector Dishes...whats the advantage?

[Tribble puncher]

So, I'm sure this has been brought up, but a quick search yielded no results for me....

My question is what advantages does having a deflector dish give a ship like The Enterprise over say a ship like The Reliant or a Klingon BOP that does not have a front mounted dish or any sort of exterior array mounted? If these Dishes are needed to Sweep Particles that could damge the ship at high speeds out of the way, how does a ship that lacks one (of which there are many such designs in the Trek verse!) It seems like to me if there was an alternate method or system to accomplish the function of a big dish or glowing blue light the yells "shoot me!" to any enemy weapons officer worth his/her salt it would have been implemented on ALL ships. Any ideas?

 

[Go-Captain]

When Voyager's deflector goes down while at warp, she gets bombarded by super high velocity particles, so the ships without visible deflectors must have deflector systems. What they must lack is the navigational sensor, instead relying on smaller sensors, or a dedicated distributed array, or their normal omnidirectional sensors.

A dedicated navigational sensor could have advantages in simplicity, fidelity, range, and so on. For long range exploratory vessels, more sensing range, more efficient course plotting, and longer communication ranges are all extremely useful.

Combining the navigational deflector with the navigational sensor array might be what allows for the complex effects the Enterprise-D and Voyager performed with their deflectors. They have created weaponized gravitational beams, exotic atmosphere fixing particle beams, stabilized or destabilized wormholes, and loads of other things I am sure I do not recall. In a universe as surprising and dangerous as the Star Trek universe having a Swiss Army knife space-time device is very sensible, even if it might be a weakness in a conventional fight.

However, the only time we have seen the deflector exploited as a weakness is when a Jem'Hadar fighter rams the USS Odyssey.

 

[C.E. Evans]

I think deflector dishes aren't really necessary--shields can do the same kind of micro obstacle-clearing job and probably do so on starships and smaller craft without dishes. But deflector dishes may be ideal for special purposes, like pushing very large objects (like monster asteroids) away from something, as well as acting as impromptu graviton-based cannons against dangerous space anomalies or even the occasional super baddy.

 

[137th Gebirg]

I get the impression that, in the time of TOS, deflector dishes were extremely necessary. In fact, almost every ship with warp capability seemed to have one (except the Romulan BOP, which could likely be explained away by its scientifically impossible "simple impulse" propulsion - but that's an argument for another forum). Even the original Klingon D7 had one. Where, you may ask? That big "mouth" on the cobra head was never a photorp tube - it was the forward nav deflector! Anyone who bought the old TOS AMT kit o the D7 has seen the part that goes in there, complete with a similar-looking forward-facing antenna to what the Enterprise has. IIRC, that model was unique in that it was designed specifically based on Jefferies sketches and notes, and was the most accurate model AMT made of any of the show's ships. The oldest blueprints I could find are from 1975 (by Michael McMaster), showing the sensor, before TMP retconned the purpose of that opening in later shows for the K'T'inga. FASA's post-TMP 1983 blueprints and Jackill's 1994 datasheets follow the sensor model as well for the D7.

I am curious what Greg Jein put in his D7 for D9's "Trials and Tribble-ations". All photos I've found shows that area obscured and in shadow.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

Most official blueprints identify the gridlines on Federation ships as a "deflector grid".

The Franz Joseph Constitution class & Pocket Book Galaxy class ones do for sure (I own these sets).

 

[Crow T. Robot]

Deflector Dishes are one of the three "magic techs" of the Federation. Holodecks and Transporters being the other two. WIthout them, 99% of all technobabble would be useless.

Since technobabble is primarily a Federation thing, well more of an Earth thing really, it's no surprise that they make sure most of their ships have deflector dishes. Klingons certainly never need technobabble to get the job done.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

You're right! It's plot driven.

 

[Spot261]

Don't forget replicators

 

[Romulan_spy]

Deflector Dishes are one of the three "magic techs" of the Federation. Holodecks and Transporters being the other two. WIthout them, 99% of all technobabble would be useless.

What about warp drive? Doesn't that count as a "magic tech"?

 

[Longinus]

Even the original Klingon D7 had one. Where, you may ask? That big "mouth" on the cobra head was never a photorp tube - it was the forward nav deflector!

Interesting! I always thought it looked like a deflector, but never knew it was actually intended to be one. I speculated that the grilles in front of the 'wings' of most Klingon ships might have been deflectors.

 

[137th Gebirg]

^^^ I always thought they were the space matter acquisition sinks - what later became more commonly known as bussards, as D7's don't appear to have such things on the front of their nacelles like Fed ships do.

 

[Tribble puncher]

Interesting! I always thought it looked like a deflector, but never knew it was actually intended to be one. I speculated that the grilles in front of the 'wings' of most Klingon ships might have been deflectors.

I thought the Deflector on the D-7/K'Tinga was the Glowy red part on top of the Engineering Hull, Maybe they moved it back there when they designed the K'Tinga. Anyway, I had always thought that the "Dish" or "Big Blue Thingy" on Fed Starships had to do with sensors and not shields, I mean, Even as a Kid, I assumed that was a "Radar Dish" on the front of the Enterprise, thus it must "Detect things" But I seem to read many things online stating that it isn't a sensor array (That's what the domes on the saucer are?) but it in fact clears out the space of particles which could damage the ship if they struck it at high speed. Hence my original post.

 

[B.J.]

Deflectors always seem to be multi-function devices. On Fed ships, it's for deflecting (duh) and most likely long range sensors, plus whatever else they can manage to jury-rig. And since the Federation can use them in multiple ways, why couldn't the Klingons? I mean, the feature on the K'tinga and BoP looks far too complex to be *just* a torpedo tube, why couldn't it also (still) be the deflector? I can't say what the advantage would be to combine those functions, but I'm sure it makes sense to somebody.

 

[Longinus]

I thought the Deflector on the D-7/K'Tinga was the Glowy red part on top of the Engineering Hull, Maybe they moved it back there when they designed the K'Tinga.

Problem with that is that the thing is completely blocked by 'the head' part of the ship. Nav deflector probably needs to have clear space ahead of it.

Anyway, I had always thought that the "Dish" or "Big Blue Thingy" on Fed Starships had to do with sensors and not shields, I mean, Even as a Kid, I assumed that was a "Radar Dish" on the front of the Enterprise, thus it must "Detect things" But I seem to read many things online stating that it isn't a sensor array (That's what the domes on the saucer are?) but it in fact clears out the space of particles which could damage the ship if they struck it at high speed. Hence my original post.

It's both. Combined navigational deflector and navigational sensor.

 

[publiusr]

The grit takes care of grit, general radiation. The dish takes care of a wide path--and larger objects.

it can cannel a lot of power in one direction.

A handy thing to have--and a good active passive design.

 

[Maurice]

I once asked Andrew Probert where the navigational deflector was on the Ferengi ship and he replied, "I forgot it." The Romulan Warbird has one, though.

 

[Mr_Closet]

Even the original Klingon D7 had one. Where, you may ask? That big "mouth" on the cobra head was never a photorp tube - it was the forward nav deflector! ... IIRC, that model was unique in that it was designed specifically based on Jefferies sketches and notes, ... before TMP retconned the purpose of that opening in later shows for the K'T'inga.

Deflectors always seem to be multi-function devices. ... since the Federation can use them in multiple ways, why couldn't the Klingons? I mean, the feature on the K'tinga and BoP looks far too complex to be *just* a torpedo tube, why couldn't it also (still) be the deflector? I can't say what the advantage would be to combine those functions, but I'm sure it makes sense to somebody.

Makes sense to me! Waaaay back when I first saw the Star Trek movie as a kid who was just old enough to start asking questions about things, I concluded the following based on my observations from The Movie, Khan and the Search for Spock (I don't think I finally saw TOS until afterwards):

1. The blue thing called a deflector pushes stuff out of the way of a faster-than-light starship - that's a damn good idea, and because the ship is faster than light, that deflector must have a very long reach, which makes that deflector an extremely powerful thing!
2. The refit Enterprise has torpedo tubes just above the deflector.
3. Klingons have a big hole at the front which shoots torpedoes and has some fancy lights around it.

Hmm... I thought. What if a clever weapons engineer once said 'Hey! If we put the torp tubes near the deflector, we can boost forward firing torpedoes to extreme velocities and massively increase their effective range by having the deflector 'push' them as they're launched. This would be like a old-style 20th Century jet fighter that accelerates to Mach 1 before launching its air to air missiles, so that the missiles is already travelling really fast!'

Critic replies: 'Yeah, but what about the stern tubes? We haven't got a deflector that points backwards!'

Weaps: 'Duh! If you're shooting backwards, chances are it's because someone's chasing you! Haven't you seen Wrath of Khan? You don't need to worry about boosting your stern torps because if the enemy is in pursuit, the combined closing speed of the torpedoes own onboard propulsion plus the enemy ship is more than enough to make it difficult for the enemy to dodge in time. It's still a viable survival tactic if you get into trouble and have to run. Meanwhile, a super high velocity extended range forward firing torpedo system is a war winner!'

Critic nods thoughtfully: 'You know, you might be right, because it looks like the Klingon's have already beaten us to it! As an earlier thread about Long-necked Klingon cruisers concluded, they've been in space much longer than we have, and have developed an extremely efficient design that meets their needs very well. And it appears to show a forward deflector with a hole in the middle just the right size for a torpedo, plus lots of greeblies around the edge that could be things like sensors or the deflector components, itself. Go the head of the class!'

Weaps: [smug] ;-) [/smug]

Just a thought.

 

[Jerikka Dawn]

 

[TommyR01D]

The absence of such contraptions from so many other ships (including Starfleet ones) clearly shows that a huge deflector dish is not essential for faster-than-light travel, but it's possible that the Federation have chosen to retain it as a signature aesthetic feature, in much the same way that car companies do with their radiator grills.

 

[publiusr]

And a big dish helps a science ship--real;y pulls in signals

They can look different
http://www.spacedaily.com/reports/O..._New_Telescope_Mirrors_Get_New_Shape_999.html