Spoilers Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice - Grading & Discussion

[Arrrrgggh]

Since none of the above are action movies, I don't think the comparison is fair. People go to action movies looking for different things than when they go to something like The Godfather.

Oh, my mistake. It was clearly the equivalent of Raiders of the Lost Arc, First Blood, and Leon: The Professional. <nods sagely>

I'll help you save some time: Narrow it down to "superhero movies directed by Zack Snyder and featuring both Ben Affleck and Henry Cavill as Batman and Superman where they're fighting each other." Maybe you could justify an A+ in that category. Maybe.

 

[Kelthaz]

The largest movie poll (imdb) holds it at 7,2 rating from 240k users, most polls are in line with that, and there was even a social media analysis report recently that claimed 70% of tweets were positive, 20% mixed and only 10% flat out negative. So yes, general opinion sort of reflects the opinion of this forum's poll.

Oh, come on dude. It's fine if you like the movie, but clearly the reception among the general public is very negative. Quoting IMDB scores is the equivalent of sourcing a YouTube comment in a research paper.

 

[Kor]

I notice the audience score on RottenTomatoes is down slightly from a couple weeks ago. It think it was at 74%, and now it's at 69%.

Kor

 

[Kelthaz]

Right, it was at like 90+% with 100,000 votes before the film even came out due to fanboys inflating the score. I'm sure the same will happen with Civil War. These online user polls are useless.

 

[BillJ]

Oh, my mistake. It was clearly the equivalent of Raiders of the Lost Arc, First Blood, and Leon: The Professional. <nods sagely>

Actually, I enjoyed Batman vs. Superman roughly the same as those films (never heard of the last one) and I gave it a 'B-'. Maybe it is fair to say that you shouldn't hold your own grades to everyone else as different people are looking for different things out of movies.

 

[Mudd]

So a consistent Universe is bad?

There is nothing about it that is automatically good. Consistency is a virtue or a failing depending upon what one is consistent at. Mediocre sausage may be consistently so, but that is no reason to eat it. Marvel can be relied upon to churn out mediocrity - their worst is passably watchable - but rarely do they produce anything memorably great. The Thor movies are consistently crap; the Iron Man movies are inconsistent and sometimes good - as movies. A viewer shouldn't have to give a damn about comic books in order to enjoy a movie.

 

[lurok]

To be fair to DCU, they've got two movies - in current studio incarnation - to judge against MCU's, several of which are mediocre to say the least.

 

[Arrrrgggh]

To be fair to DCU, they've got two movies - in current studio incarnation - to judge against MCU's, several of which are mediocre to say the least.

Who's judging it against any of those movies? Most people who disliked Dawn of Justice seem to dislike it solely on the basis of its own merits (or lack thereof, to be more accurate).

 

[Anwar]

Marvel can be relied upon to churn out mediocrity - their worst is passably watchable - but rarely do they produce anything memorably great.

Depends on how ashamed you are of the source material. I've really no interest in those spineless "grounded" comic book filsm.

The Thor movies are consistently crap; the Iron Man movies are inconsistent and sometimes good - as movies. A viewer shouldn't have to give a damn about comic books in order to enjoy a movie.

If you don't like comic books, don't go to comic book movies. Especially ones that aren't ashamed of themselves.

 

[BigJake]

Oh, come on dude. It's fine if you like the movie, but clearly the reception among the general public is very negative.

Your point about the inexactness of online polls is perfectly fair as far as it goes, but no, the above is not "clear." Actually I have the same basic impression of public response dodge does. It's clear to me that reception among critics is negative (and of course that certain people post about it solely from specially-rigged hyperbaric chambers filled with a custom solution of bile acid and hot, snotty tears of futile nerdrage), but that isn't the same thing.

 

[Ovation]

Actually, I enjoyed Batman vs. Superman roughly the same as those films (never heard of the last one) and I gave it a 'B-'. Maybe it is fair to say that you shouldn't hold your own grades to everyone else as different people are looking for different things out of movies.

You really should watch Leon, it's a fine film.

 

[JD]

- I perfer this version of kyrptonite. It weakens Superman, but don't knock him out like in other versions. Usually, kyrptonite turns him useless. He's either a superhero or a super-zero (bad pun) with no in-between. Here he can still fly and fight, but severly weaken and probably in great amount of pain. That combined with being pummeled by an amored Batman finally took Superman out of the fight.

I thought that was how it was usually presented? I don't really remember any version where the Kryptonite alone knocked him out.

- Lex Luthor Jr

Usually when two heroes meet, their enemies meet as well. Here they combined Lex Sr and the Joker. As Lex's son, he did a good job portraying his father ruthlessness alongside Joker's unpredictablity. At first, I thought he was an uneffective, weird, goofball that rambles on too much. When he taunted the Senator with Granny's peach tea and blew up part of Congress, I was shocked. Kidnapping Martha to blackmail Superman, made him a threat. Having his head shaved in prison, makes him look more like his dad. Maybe there's a parallel somewhere.

This bugs me. It doesn't make sense for them to try to make Luthor like Joker, if that is what they were going for, when we are already getting Jared Leto's Joker in Suicide Squad. There's no need to make another villain like Joker, when we already have a Joker.

 

[Kelthaz]

Your point about the inexactness of online polls is perfectly fair as far as it goes, but no, the above is not "clear." Actually I have the same basic impression of public response dodge does. It's clear to me that reception among critics is negative (and of course that certain people post about it solely from specially-rigged hyperbaric chambers filled with a custom solution of bile acid and hot, snotty tears of futile nerdrage), but that isn't the same thing.

Then explain why the opening weekend (the weekend when all the hardcore fans rush out to see it) was huge and every weekend after that experienced a large drop. Why did general audiences fail to turn up for the film if you think the public response was positive?

 

[Captaindemotion]

You really should watch Leon, it's a fine film.

I second this, it's a classic and Luc Besson has never topped it, IMHO. Also boasts an outstanding debut by one Natalie Portman.

 

[BigJake]

Then explain why the opening weekend (the weekend when all the hardcore fans rush out to see it) was huge and every weekend after that experienced a large drop.

It's probable that the critical reaction had some impact. I personally went the second weekend after debating whether to do so due to the wave of negative reviews in the media, and I suspect a lot of people made the opposite decision. What you should perhaps be asking yourself is why it's continuing to perform as strongly as it is past that second-weekend drop; and what that drop really represented (a drop from stratospheric, record-shattering box office for its release time and back to normal levels of March box office). And ultimately it's best to remember this whole business of scrying into the box office returns is no more scientific than trying to read into imdb scores.

 

[dahj]

Then explain why the opening weekend (the weekend when all the hardcore fans rush out to see it) was huge and every weekend after that experienced a large drop. Why did general audiences fail to turn up for the film if you think the public response was positive?

Oh, people were definitely turned off from seeing it by the overwhelming negativity of the media. You're right, there is absolutely a public perception that this movie is a failure. Hell, I know some people who didn't wanna see the movie solely based on the "Sad Affleck" video.
But those people who didn't turn up didn't see the movie, they're solely basing their negative opinion on hearsay.
People who did see it rate it on average round 7ish, which isn't great, but is far from bad.

 

[Mr Light]

Leon/The Professional is one of my all time favorite movies. I miss the Luc Besson of Leon and Fifth Element...

 

[Kelthaz]

Oh, people were definitely turned off from seeing it by the overwhelming negativity of the media. You're right, there is absolutely a public perception that this movie is a failure. Hell, I know some people who didn't wanna see the movie solely based on the "Sad Affleck" video.
But those people who didn't turn up didn't see the movie, they're solely basing their negative opinion on hearsay.
People who did see it rate it on average round 7ish, which isn't great, but is far from bad.

Yeah, that's a good point. The public perception of the film is quite negative, but few people who saw it truly hated the film. Although that's just self-selection bias. The fans went to see it and the non-fans stayed away. On the other hand you're right that people who might have enjoyed the film are staying away due to silly memes and misunderstanding the RT score.

I guess we're just going to have to kidnap a few hundred people of different demographics and force them to watch the film. It's the only way to know for sure.

 

[Tosk]

The public perception of the film is quite negative, but few people who saw it truly hated the film.

You assume.

 

[BigJake]

I guess we're just going to have to kidnap a few hundred people of different demographics and force them to watch the film. It's the only way to know for sure.

Now you're talking.